Route-based passing: I've missed it for so long

[guaps]

Quote: Originally Posted by lofeazy

This is one reason why madden needs some form of RBP....

Another reason why is also because it's what you see on sundays

[Bootzilla]

Quote: Originally Posted by Broncos86

I'm glad more see the point to this. I lost a game due to tethering, etc. 3rd down and goal from the 7, down by 6, 40 seconds left. I throw a fade route to the corner, only I'm blitzed so I throw early. Instead of a pass going to the corner, the throw goes over the middle because my WR didn't break yet. Three DBs were waiting for the toss. NOBODY had the corner, and had my QB been able to throw to that corner, my WR would've had a chance to get to that corner and make a play. At the least, it would've been incomplete and I would've had 4th down. Instead, I toss a pass into triple coverage because my WR hadn't yet made his cut to the corner. This is just last night, btw.

Timing is just incredibly off on fades. This example is the truest example of the ball being tethered/magnetized to the receiver. If you're throwing the fade, you don't really even drop back. You just take the snap and lob it to an area. You're not reading a break. If your receiver doesn't beat the jam at the line of scrimmage the ball should sail to the deep corner of the end zone or out of bounds. As is your pass that should be traveling 12-15 yards in the air with a nice loft to it will now go 4 yards on a line.

Out routes are just as bad. On a three step drop, when your QB's back foot hits, the ball needs to be out. The ball needs to be thrown to the sideline. If the receiver is late getting out of his break the ball should be kicking up chalk on the sidelines. Right now you run a greater risk of throwing behind the receiver and getting the ball picked off if you throw the out too early when it should be the other way around because the ball wants to magically find the receiver regardless of route.

There should be some wiggle room that can sort of serve as a sight adjust. In other words, if a tight end gets off of the line of scrimmage free and unimpeded you should be able to fire the ball to him without him completing his route. Same goes for a WR when a blitzing linebacker or db leaves him wide open. In those instances there needs to be an animation where the receiver will turn his head or raise his arm or something indicating he knows he's uncovered.

[canes21]

Quote: Originally Posted by Bootzilla

Timing is just incredibly off on fades. This example is the truest example of the ball being tethered/magnetized to the receiver. If you're throwing the fade, you don't really even drop back. You just take the snap and lob it to an area. You're not reading a break. If your receiver doesn't beat the jam at the line of scrimmage the ball should sail to the deep corner of the end zone or out of bounds. As is your pass that should be traveling 12-15 yards in the air with a nice loft to it will now go 4 yards on a line. Out routes are just as bad. On a three step drop, when your QB's back foot hits, the ball needs to be out. The ball needs to be thrown to the sideline. If the receiver is late getting out of his break the ball should be kicking up chalk on the sidelines. Right now you run a greater risk of throwing behind the receiver and getting the ball picked off if you throw the out too early when it should be the other way around because the ball wants to magically find the receiver regardless of route. There should be some wiggle room that can sort of serve as a sight adjust. In other words, if a tight end gets off of the line of scrimmage free and unimpeded you should be able to fire the ball to him without him completing his route. Same goes for a WR when a blitzing linebacker or db leaves him wide open. In those instances there needs to be an animation where the receiver will turn his head or raise his arm or something indicating he knows he's uncovered.

100% agree. If the passing game was realistic and played like you just described, I probably would actually get through many seasons. I usually get frustrated every time I play Madden because I always end up throwing a pass anticipating the cut, but it ends up throwing the ball like its a streak, then my WR either cuts and its an easy interception, or he magically knows to keep running down field for the ball.

Get the passing game nailed down along with blocking and defensive schemes and Madden will not leave my 360 until the new one comes out.

[Only1LT]

Quote: Originally Posted by Bootzilla

Timing is just incredibly off on fades. This example is the truest example of the ball being tethered/magnetized to the receiver. If you're throwing the fade, you don't really even drop back. You just take the snap and lob it to an area. You're not reading a break. If your receiver doesn't beat the jam at the line of scrimmage the ball should sail to the deep corner of the end zone or out of bounds. As is your pass that should be traveling 12-15 yards in the air with a nice loft to it will now go 4 yards on a line. Out routes are just as bad. On a three step drop, when your QB's back foot hits, the ball needs to be out. The ball needs to be thrown to the sideline. If the receiver is late getting out of his break the ball should be kicking up chalk on the sidelines. Right now you run a greater risk of throwing behind the receiver and getting the ball picked off if you throw the out too early when it should be the other way around because the ball wants to magically find the receiver regardless of route. There should be some wiggle room that can sort of serve as a sight adjust. In other words, if a tight end gets off of the line of scrimmage free and unimpeded you should be able to fire the ball to him without him completing his route. Same goes for a WR when a blitzing linebacker or db leaves him wide open. In those instances there needs to be an animation where the receiver will turn his head or raise his arm or something indicating he knows he's uncovered.

The first bolded part is a very good illustration of how tethering impacts the game. It's damn near impossible to throw too early on an out and have the ball fall out of reach, in the field of play. Whether the route gets changed to a Go or a quick hook because you threw too early, or the ball is thrown behind the receiver, the way this game does passing is just not right. I'd love to see this pass become much more of a timing pass than it currently is. I'd love to see the ball hit the turf if you threw it too early. Madden has to be the only Football game that I have ever played, where throwing an out early, more than likely results in a pass that's behind the receiver, ie late lol.

As for the second part I bolded. The weird thing is, or maybe not weird when you consider this is Madden, but this used to be in the game on the 16bit systems no less lol.

[Dblock1111]

my biggest problem with the passing game is that when a cornerback is in man coverage on a WR, that CB will make the cuts on a recievers route before it has been telegraphed what-so-ever, therefore when i do throw a pass based on route timing, it doesn't matter because the CB gets to the ball before the WR.

That and they need to fix how CBs cover streaks by running directly in front of the WR and slowing them down. If a Corner was ever running straight in front of the WR, the WR would just stop and turn around as the Corner continued his 100 yard dash.....

DB vs WR play really needs to be improved this year.

[ACardAttack]

I dont know much about programing, but it seems like it would be an easy fix, just put it in the code that the WR keeps running their route and it doesnt change unless you lead the receiver in a different direction on purpose.

[43M]

Quote: Originally Posted by ACardAttack

I dont know much about programing, but it seems like it would be an easy fix, just put it in the code that the WR keeps running their route and it doesnt change unless you lead the receiver in a different direction on purpose.

Definitely not an "easy" fix at all.

[canes21]

Quote: Originally Posted by ACardAttack

I dont know much about programing, but it seems like it would be an easy fix, just put it in the code that the WR keeps running their route and it doesnt change unless you lead the receiver in a different direction on purpose.

I'm guessing as easy as it sounds, its really not. I guess the way they first built the game for next gen with 06, they never really planned for anything like this to be implemented.

I was hoping procedural awareness would help this, but that is all cosmetic. I had thought receivers would turn around at correct times and really had to pick the ball up with their eyes, same for every single player on the field, but obviously I am dead wrong.