Correlation between Madden and NCAA

[RGiles36]

Sen Palmer dropping knowledge all up and through this thread -- respect!

Quote: Originally Posted by Senator Palmer

If this is how you feel and you believe that representing realism comes by way of limiting the user, then shouldn't you be willing to go a step farther and have it so that if you play with a low AWR QB, the CPU makes every offensive for the first 1-2 years of his career until his awareness is sufficient?

That's what I was attempting to get at -- when it comes to sports games, whether people realize it or not, they are picking and choosing where they want to apply realism. Too often, people don't want to give credence to videogames being just that, videogames.

[Big FN Deal]

@Senator Palmer, I feel like my last post summed up what I have been saying for the most part.

For example, the roster position requirements in Madden are unrealistic when compared directly to the NFL because in real life you can have any 53 players, regardless of position. However in Madden you are required to have a certain number of players at each position because the game is not programmed to regulate the flexibility afforded to real NFL rosters.

That's exactly what I am saying about audibles and no huddle in Madden in relation to play calling.

To answer your specific question though in HC09, like in NFL2k5, the had practice represented but you could simulate it. The point being, with the process represented, adubling players into plays they are not familiar with presumably would have an applicable effect on their effectiveness in that play, not currently found in Madden.

Earlier I was talking about QB AWR being tied to the capability of each QB to call their own plays at the LOS. In Madden there is not a true no huddle in the NFL sense and it's basically just the QB deciding at the LOS what play to run, given the available personnel. That's what I kept trying to get across, was that in Madden's no huddle you can not sub players in or out, you are limited to the personnel on the field. So it doesn't make sense, imo, to limit that aspect but still allow access to the entire playbook.

I got into personnel packages trying to relay that point in relation to Madden, not the NFL. A better way would have been to say in the real NFL if they call "Red Dog Z Flat", there is a specific personnel package associated with that play call, so the sideline or QB in the real NFL would not call that play if the appropriate personnel can not take the field to run that play.

This article better articulates what I have been trying to say.

"Whatever the play, its route to Shanahan’s sheet is both circuitous and orderly. Modern play-calling isn’t an off-the-cuff choice from a grab bag of 300 plays. It is a week-long process rooted not only in the base principles of an offense — in the Redskins’ case, the West Coast, zone-blocking scheme developed by Coach Mike Shanahan, Kyle’s father. It also is rooted in the perceived weaknesses of an opposing defense and the players available on a given day — with a dash of gut instinct sprinkled in."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports...EGN_story.html

Adjustments are made to offensive plays in relation to available offensive and opposing defensive players in a game but they are not just plugging in random personnel into designed plays like Madden currently allows.

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by rgiles36

Sen Palmer dropping knowledge all up and through this thread -- respect! That's what I was attempting to get at -- when it comes to sports games, whether people realize it or not, they are picking and choosing where they want to apply realism. Too often, people don't want to give credence to videogames being just that, videogames.

So if people don't advocate for everything being changed to be completely realistic they shouldn't want anything to be realistic? I definitely don't agree with that.

For example, I despise the unrealistic aspect of the current game play view but that doesn't keep me or many others from suggesting ways to potentially make the game more realistic, utilizing that view.

At the end of the day, most of us are trying to achieve balance but we all have different views on how, imo.

[RGiles36]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

So if people don't advocate for everything being changed to be completely realistic they shouldn't want anything to be realistic? I definitely don't agree with that.

Not what I said, nor what I implied.

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by rgiles36

Not what I said, nor what I implied.

I put a question mark at the end. lol

Seriously though, I don't get what you are saying then. If you were referring to what I was talking about for the last few pages, I don't see how that jives with, "when it comes to sports games, whether people realize it or not, they are picking and choosing where they want to apply realism. Too often, people don't want to give credence to videogames being just that, videogames. "

I was just trying to say that the video game already limits what wouldn't be in the real NFL, due to the limitations of the program itself, so it should do the same thing with respect to the plays available for audibles and no huddle.

That's accepting that this is a video game not real life and trying to offer suggestions for more, not completely, realistic game play within that framework, imo.

[RGiles36]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

I put a question mark at the end. lol Seriously though, I don't get what you are saying then. If you were referring to what I was talking about for the last few pages, I don't see how that jives with, "when it comes to sports games, whether people realize it or not, they are picking and choosing where they want to apply realism. Too often, people don't want to give credence to videogames being just that, videogames. "

I can certainly understand why you thought I was attempting to single you out, but that really wasn't my intention.

I was just speaking to the comments that are made on this forum in general. If you let some on OS tell it, it's realism or die. But as you peel back the several layers of football, how realistic do we want to go? How can we apply realism here, but not there? That's what I got out of Senator's post(s) and that's what I was agreeing with.

[CRMosier_LM]

Quote: Originally Posted by rgiles36

I can certainly understand why you thought I was attempting to single you out, but that really wasn't my intention. I was just speaking to the comments that are made on this forum in general. If you let some on OS tell it, it's realism or die. But as you peel back the several layers of football, how realistic do we want to go? How can we apply realism here, but not there? That's what I got out of Senator's post(s) and that's what I was agreeing with.

I'm of the mindset lately where if everyone here wants 100% realism... Give it to them. I'm pretty positive that most people would NOT like it. I could deal with it but I don't think it would be pretty.



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[KOACHK]

When it comes down to it, people want as much realism as possible in sports games, but it also has to have that easy pick-up-and-play factor for those times when you just want to knock out a quick match online or during a "Madden night" with your friends.

One thing I think many people get wrong about Madden is that they don't know how to play the game on a basic "pick-up" level. In other video game genres with a competitive, multi-player component everyone starts out learning to play on the same level under the same basic premise. Sometimes one can actually over-think and/or over-talk their way out of enjoying something for what it is.

"LET'S PLAY MADDEN; -YOU READY?"