What do you expect from the Next-Gen Madden 25

[ch46647]

Quote: Originally Posted by SageInfinite

All I know is the game better feel alive like they are touting. Madden this whole generation has just felt stale and very tame. The one thing I'm concerned about is audio. This new engine can't save the audio problems madden has had over the years as far as I know. I know they implemented the new commentary engine last year, and we'll see how far it's come this year, but the crowd audio still hasn't been up to par. I hope everything takes a step forward next gen. I also want to see the broadcast feel Madden 12 had make a return. This game could really be incredible if Tiburon can take advantage.

Sage, I completely agree with your point, and if you have noticed over the years I have brought crowd atmosphere up time and time again.

Yesterdays engine reveal really got me excited, in the fact that "bringing stadiums alive" is a primary element of this engine. I am actually shocked that this is such an integral part, and thrilled at the same time!

EA games as a whole have really lacked stadium atmosphere in a BIG way. I believe that EA is really going to go all out in this department, and it is going to do wonders for the immersion factor. IMO, this is one area that a majority of people dont even realize how big of a difference it will make, until we have it. Combining 3D crowds, with living sidelines, and realistic crowd noise will do wonders for all of EA's titles in the immersion department.

Check out some of the highlights that EA has on their website for "living worlds"... (Has anybody ever seen stadium atmosphere touted as a primary feature for a new sports game engine?)

1. Ever-changing, electrifying atmospheres
Living Worlds usher in an all-new level of immersion and authenticity. Crowds and sidelines are as ever-changing as real-world stadiums.

2. LIVING SIDELINES
Sidelines are now comprised of individually modeled 3D characters, each with dynamic reactions and behavior. In-game environments are as ever-changing as real-world stadiums and arenas that evolve throughout a match.

3. CROWD REACTION
Playing home or away never felt so real. EA SPORTS IGNITE eliminates scripted crowd animations, with individual intelligence and context of the game allowing the stadium and sidelines to react to every scenario organically. As in the real-world, the emotions of crowds – such as elation, frustration and anxiety – swings as the match plays out.

[The_Rick_14]

Quote: Originally Posted by ch46647

Check out some of the highlights that EA has on their website for "living worlds"... (Has anybody ever seen stadium atmosphere touted as a primary feature for a new sports game engine?)

Only once before with the Euphoria engine used in Backbreaker.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rITm44sOzPM

[JJT]

All I expect is for them to catch up to the show, nba2k, fifa etc of this gen.

Crazy how I even have to say that.

[Trick13]

Quote: Originally Posted by The_Rick_14

Only once before with the Euphoria engine used in Backbreaker. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rITm44sOzPM

That crowd is "hopping" man, what is going on in that stadium? They must be blasting one of those 90s rap tunes that every body who ever listened to would just jump up and down and up and down...

Crowd noise is essential to the experience, 3D crowds eh not so much. It is cool if the engine/hardware can deliver it without negative impact on the "on field calculations" and render rate, but color me worried...

Front few rows being 3D when you get down to the goal-line, yeah man, but do I really care if I can zoom in on 3D fans in the top row of the stands - heck no - show me "dynamic crowd reactions" in terms of noise levels, booing horrific performances by home team players, chanting the back up QB's name during QB controversy, booing hated teams at every turn, "situational" awareness of crowds - booing penalty against home team, louder more vibrant and reactive in regular season than pre season and yet another notch in the playoffs, and collective eeews on big monster hits, sensible reactions to on field plays - air coming out of stadium on 3rd a 6 after you get 3 yards, building noise when player breaks away and either celebratory explosion when he scores or sigh of relief/disappointment when tackled. And, if they get that down, then give me some "user power" in creating my stadium atmosphere - custom music after certain types of plays - team sack, player gets a sack - Grave Digger from Packers history comes to mind, choices of different chants, PA announcer quirks and so forth.

3D is over rated if we get the same audio garbage and lifeless cookie cutter stuff going forward.

[SageInfinite]

Quote: Originally Posted by Trick13

That crowd is "hopping" man, what is going on in that stadium? They must be blasting one of those 90s rap tunes that every body who ever listened to would just jump up and down and up and down... Crowd noise is essential to the experience, 3D crowds eh not so much. It is cool if the engine/hardware can deliver it without negative impact on the "on field calculations" and render rate, but color me worried... Front few rows being 3D when you get down to the goal-line, yeah man, but do I really care if I can zoom in on 3D fans in the top row of the stands - heck no - show me "dynamic crowd reactions" in terms of noise levels, booing horrific performances by home team players, chanting the back up QB's name during QB controversy, booing hated teams at every turn, "situational" awareness of crowds - booing penalty against home team, louder more vibrant and reactive in regular season than pre season and yet another notch in the playoffs, and collective eeews on big monster hits, sensible reactions to on field plays - air coming out of stadium on 3rd a 6 after you get 3 yards, building noise when player breaks away and either celebratory explosion when he scores or sigh of relief/disappointment when tackled. And, if they get that down, then give me some "user power" in creating my stadium atmosphere - custom music after certain types of plays - team sack, player gets a sack - Grave Digger from Packers history comes to mind, choices of different chants, PA announcer quirks and so forth. 3D is over rated if we get the same audio garbage and lifeless cookie cutter stuff going forward.

Exactly what I was saying. I mean I know there are hardware limitations, but the crowd and overall audio could've been so much better in Madden this gen. Who's to say this is going to end next gen? I hope it does but as I continue to say, the approach and the mindset must change with the dev team, not just the hardware/software.

[jpdavis82]

Quote: Originally Posted by SageInfinite

Exactly what I was saying. I mean I know there are hardware limitations, but the crowd and overall audio could've been so much better in Madden this gen. Who's to say this is going to end next gen? I hope it does but as I continue to say, the approach and the mindset must change with the dev team, not just the hardware/software.

The crowds and sidelines look good in the trailer and they don't look like they are CGI. I also noticed how there's team banners and flags that people are waving after RG3 scores, never seen that before in a football game. The Euphoria crowd was kinda cool, but there was way too much hopping at the same time going on. Watch the M25 and FIFA crowds, they respond more naturally.

[Trick13]

Quote: Originally Posted by jpdavis82

The crowds and sidelines look good in the trailer and they don't look like they are CGI. I also noticed how there's team banners and flags that people are waving after RG3 scores, never seen that before in a football game. The Euphoria crowd was kinda cool, but there was way too much hopping at the same time going on. Watch the M25 and FIFA crowds, they respond more naturally.

That is all well and good, but will it translate well in game? Don't get me wrong, if they can do it well - great - but if gameplay suffers for graphical "extras" and superfluous crap - like how sig animations died for 3D grass - I will retire from NFL gaming until either a new company makes a game or my plans for world domination come through and allow me to buy EA and fire every nimwit that allowed such garbage to go on...

[jpdavis82]

Quote: Originally Posted by SageInfinite

Exactly what I was saying. I mean I know there are hardware limitations, but the crowd and overall audio could've been so much better in Madden this gen. Who's to say this is going to end next gen? I hope it does but as I continue to say, the approach and the mindset must change with the dev team, not just the hardware/software.

The approach and the mindset at its core is changing, the execution has to. The approach and mindset is gameplay and simulation first. Their plan is to build a solid foundation and build off of that until they get the game where they want it to go. Player movement, o/d line interactions, blocking logic, wr/db interactions, physics, Connected Franchise, Owner Mode, all these things they are working on for this year and probably some of them next year are just a foundation. Rex Dickson said they don't want to add features unless they fully develop them anymore. That is why he said they realized that blocking would be two cycles. One of them for run blocking, they're going to improve what they can in pass blocking in the meantime. Then another one for pass blocking. I'm perfectly ok with that as long as it means they are going to give us the best possible gameplay with each element of football. They are saying Clint Oldenburg has gone through and completely redone every run play this year and they also brought Bob Wylie, former Raiders O-line coach in for 3 days to have a blocking technique training camp. Hopefully next year they will give the pass blocking that same level of attention and detail. Rex also mentions in his interview in the Press Row Podcast about wanting to have a subject matter expert for each feature that they add from now on. I would guess Clint Oldenburg will be the one to help with pass blocking and then they will have a former WR and DB come in when they redo the wr/db interactions. Doug Martin and Kenjon Barner came in and helped them with the Run Free feature this year and taught them about how they, and other NFL HBs start running at 80% speed and then wait to find the hole before they accelerate to top speed. With that in mind, sprint won't take you above a players realistic top speed it just gets you there faster.

These are just some examples of some of the ways the approach and mindset is changing, I wouldn't say has changed yet, with the development team that is there now.