My take on the divide of opinions on this game

[Big FN Deal]

Quote: Originally Posted by Ampking101

I should have been more specific. It does have it's problems but the fact that people say it's completely unplayable garbage is just untrue. This I believe is said because of the EA name 2k5 did a ton of things right and were an smart with their coding and algorithms but EA technically bought them out. Again for the third time I'll state "This is not the best football game" but it does give enough to be enjoyable.

That's where we disagree again because I think that is true, predicated on each individuals standards. For example, there are things many people cite in NBA2k13 that they feel were done much better in NBA2k11, so if they feel having certain areas regress makes the game unplayable for them, I completely understand that. Some people have a harder time with things seemingly unnecessarily regressing than others, even while some other aspects maybe the same or even better. The fact that so many different elements go into making a game fun and immersive for each individual is why something regressing in some areas that are irrelevant to some can ruin the game as a whole for others.

For example I don't have fun playing the CPU and online ranked can get frustrating so when next gen M07 added "Live Opponent" which allowed Users to invite other online friends to control their CPU opponent's team each week in their offline Franchise, I was able to enjoy that game, in spite of its' shortcomings. Then in M08 that feature was removed, which ruined the enjoyment for M08 that I got out of M07, despite what other things likely remained and even improved.

My point is that no reasonable person is critical of Madden for no good reason, we all just have different standards.

[Introvese]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

I understand that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I agree that people shouldn't be lumped in as casuals just because they can enjoy Madden but the bold I just don't get. If the EA brand is what makes gamers be so hard on this game, it's in the context of the fact that EA has been making Madden for 25 years yet it still is what it is. Now in the context of how you are using it, there are probably some fringe that just hate everything EA and a fringe that love everything EA but there are an overwhelming amount of reasons to be hard on this game on it's merit. For gamers that experienced 2k's football games it's due to not having Madden 25 in 2013 represent certain football aspects as well as that game did in 2004 and 2007. For gamers that tried Back Breaker it's due seeing a company implement true physics in their first try at creating a football game ever, which we still don't have in M25. For last gen Madden gamers it's due to still not having features from the exact same series added or working in M25. For HC09 gamers it's due to not having the depth of team and player management in M25, even though EA also made that game and the brain child of it created CFM. For gamers that have patiently waited for "next year" this entire gen it's due to watching features and aspects of next gen Madden from one year regress or be completely removed in the following year or two. For those that play and/or pay attention to other sports sims this gen, even some made by the same EA, it's due to seeing how well they represent certain aspects of their respective sports in comparison to M25. For completely unbiased gamers that haven't preferred any particular game from any company it's due to watching just how stagnant the football game genre has been the last 9 years with only EA licensed to make football games. I'm happy for anyone that is able to enjoy or even tolerate Madden in spite of these FACTS but that doesn't change them.

U got tears in my eyes. 2nd best post (1 goes to that guy for saying homey was searching for glitches)

Everything u said was exactly how i feel. All that money EA make. All the resources they have. But no true innovation. But its our fault. We buy madden like they not makin one next year. We gotta stop blaming EA to be honest. Because if we were in their shoes. Knowing consumers would buy a product every year with little improvement. Why would EA work hard on anything? There is no reason to bust their butts when sales are thru the roof. Before i go these damn videogame journalist suck. All these interviews they have with EA. Not one of these media aholes ever asked why?

[Ampking101]

Quote: Originally Posted by Big FN Deal

That's where we disagree again because I think that is true, predicated on each individuals standards. For example, there are things many people cite in NBA2k13 that they feel were done much better in NBA2k11, so if they feel having certain areas regress makes the game unplayable for them, I completely understand that. Some people have a harder time with things seemingly unnecessarily regressing than others, even while some other aspects maybe the same or even better. The fact that so many different elements go into making a game fun and immersive for each individual is why something regressing in some areas that are irrelevant to some can ruin the game as a whole for others. For example I don't have fun playing the CPU and online ranked can get frustrating so when next gen M07 added "Live Opponent" which allowed Users to invite other online friends to control their CPU opponent's team each week in their offline Franchise, I was able to enjoy that game, in spite of its' shortcomings. Then in M08 that feature was removed, which ruined the enjoyment for M08 that I got out of M07, despite what other things likely remained and even improved. My point is that no reasonable person is critical of Madden for no good reason, we all just have different standards.

Again I will state this one more time so people can understand this.....

Unplayable = can not physically be played.

Garbage = left over unused material.

The game both can be played and unless you have placed it in the garbage is not just that.

The game did not live up to your standards, we get that. Guess what it didn't live up to mine but it's a heck of a lot better than the last few iterations of Madden.

I like you BFD I've had a lot of good conversations with you in the past that we both have and have not seen eye to eye on. So I say all of this with respect to that. My point is that people seem to throw words around to prove a point and are a lot harsher with Madden than they would have been had it been made by 2k. A lot of people that trash the game are bitter because of the monopoly that EA made on 2k for football games (which admittedly upsets me from time to time). Is it a great game? No not by any means but it is an okay game (this actually is starting to remind me of the "they ruined final fantasy" arguments that I've heard).

I'll stop posting here as we are both on opposite sides of the fence and it's not productive for either side to continue. I do however want to leave with this though. I am not defending Madden as a good game, I am however arguing against the fact that it is as broken as people say (albiet due to the ability to fix the things that ARE broken eg: sliders and 32 team control).

[Franchise408]

I enjoy the game for my 32 team online league that I'm in. Against like minded human opponents, the game is definitely playable, if even frustrating.

Playing against the CPU is absolutely atrocious, and if I wasn't in a 32 man franchise, I would be returning the game. I've played 2 pre-season games in my offline CFM, and I'm already done with it.

This game just simply does not offer an acceptable offline sports franchise experience.

[Franchise408]

Quote: Originally Posted by kjcheezhead

I wouldn't say it's a matter of sim vs casual. Most madden fans will admit madden has never tried to be a true simulation. It's more fan vs haters to be honest. Madden fans over look a lot of flaws because they buy the game every year. I was a fan with Madden 09. Even tho the game was terrible, I played every day throughout the season and found a way to enjoy it because I had to get a football fix. Now I'm not saying 25 is terrible, but that even if it is the fans will find a way to enjoy new Madden. Madden haters can't over look any flaws. Since Madden 09, I became a member of this club. Everything is magnified. I can't over look qb accuracy, I can't stand being able to run read option with pocket qbs. Every legacy issue I see convinces me it's the same game. When the infinity engine gives me a tackle that defies physics, I see another type of warping or shifts that has been a staple of Madden gameplay throughout this gen. Nobody on this board is experiencing Madden for the first time. Most are firmly in their camp. Either EA is responsible for killing football gaming or EA is always being treated unfairly and delivers fun games. Just look how people respond to impressions. When I posted my impression, some fans responded that it was ridiculous because I redboxed the game, clearly I didnt spend enough time, don't know the ins and outs of it and that's why I didn't like it. The haters do the same, demanding to know how people can over look this flaw or that glitch. this divide is nothing new with this year's game. Every year Madden has a group claiming it should be sports game of the year, and another claiming it's unplayable garbage. Reviews on Amazon show it too. Look up any Madden this gen, the majority of them will either be 1 star or 5.

Might be the most logical thing ever said on this forum.

This, and everything that Big F'in Deal post:

[llarchie84]

I'll go ahead and put my 2 cents on here.

This is my first post, and normally I only come on here and various other message boards for information about various aspects of the game that I may not know about, and it has helped tremendously in the past. What I have been seeing over the last few days is nothing short of stupid.

Yeah, there is a divide, and there always will be, but it doesn't need to be a public one. There doesn't need to be topic after topic created with either praise or complaints for the same game year after year followed up by bashing and name-calling because someone else has a different opinion on the game then you do.

Its really simple to me. If you enjoy the game, keep playing it and keep enjoying it. After all, you spent your hard earned money to buy it, so you might as well enjoy it. If you hate the game and can't stand it and think its a big steaming piece of poo, you have the option of giving it away, selling it, throwing it away, or trading it in. Maybe even returning it entirely.

What I find funny is some of you purchase the game year after year, and year after year your disappointed. I'm sorry to say, but it was your choice to purchase the game. Does EA put out hot steaming piles of trash sometimes? Oh yeah, they do, but we all have a choice of whether or not we will put the money down to buy it or not. I say the same thing to friends of mine who buy every new iPhone that comes out, and are disappointed when its only a few minor upgrades. Personally, I don't think thats smart, but thats just me.

I'll give a personal example. I used to be an Oakland Raiders fan for a long time. Year after year I cheered them on, and year after year I had faith despite the losing seasons. Finally, I had enough, and you know what I did? I stopped supporting the team. I stopped giving my hard earned money for game tickets, merchandise, and anything else that had to do with the Raiders. Even better, I picked a new team. I would suggest those of you who hate madden do the same in your own unique way.

The point of this post is, stop the bashing the arguments and the name-calling, and just agree to disagree. Let me also say that I have read some of your post on other topics as well, and it can definitely come off as being condescending and a "better then you" attitude. Thats not cool at all. I don't know any of you, so you can be sure if you say you hate this game with a passion or if you love it to death, I won't be affected by it either way because you are entitled to your own opinion of the game. You did not purchase the game for me, and I did not purchase the game for you. Either like it, or leave it alone, its just that simple.

That was my first and probably last post, but I had to get that one out after reading through some of the stuff I'm seeing on here. Having an opinion on something is cool, just be sure you are respecting the opinions of others as well. No need to go back and forth over the same thing year after year. Its not worth it. Thanks and goodnight.

[tril]

@llarchie

EA has a great advertising and marketing group. On top of that the name change from Madden14 to Madde25 was pure genius. IT made most of us believe that we were getting something special this year. "This year was the year". Go out with a bang on the current gen consoles and usher in a new era of MAdden with the XBOX1 and PS4.

to comment on the original post. When it come sto football gaming Id say Im somewhere between a casual and sim-head. Leaning more so to the sim side of things.
I want a challenge, realistic stats, and sim style gameplay with the most common things people know about football. That is realistic passing(stat wise), realistic running game(stat wise), realistic defensive play.
the line play is key but the action is so fast at time that I dont worry about whether my left guard pulls or engages correctly. I would love to see accurate line play but in the grander scheme of things is not a deal breaker. (I know for some it is)
and lets not forget about the penalties and the challenges. 2 key components of NFL football. as it stands right now MAdden only give coaches the option to throw a flag on certain plays, and the challenge choice is limited. From what I remember, ON 2k football you could throw a flag whenever you wanted, and you had a handful of choices.

cut scenes, sideline interactivity are minor annoyances when it comes to madden (again for some it is).
Franchise issues, I cant comment on this year yet cause I havent started one yet.

The thing that pisses me off though if I think about is; When it comes to Madden,Everything folks complain about was done on the older gen consoles; Namely, NFL2k5 and the APF2k8 (this gen). 2k nailed everything that people continuously complain about with MAdden.

and its been 5-8 years, since those titles have been released

sorry to use comparisons, but that's just how it has to be when one devloper sets the standard.

[atc43]

I agree with tril.

I think alot of the frustration comes from the fact that some of the things that madden cant seem to get right were done much better if not perfectly 9 years ago and on inferior hardware.

Exclusivity is one thing, however you cant tell me all would not be forgiven if Tiburon at least did some of the basics(ie challenge system) as well as 2k did back in the day.

Personally thats where my frustration with this franchise stems from, and the only thing that makes sense to me is the incompetence of the devs making the game(At least I hope its incompetence and not laziness). If the basics, simple things, were done up to par then we wouldnt be complaining like we do every year. The exclusivity only magnifies the problem.

Like others have said there is a divide. But think about it for a second. Do you think there would be such a divide in the Football gaming community if there TRULY wasnt something wrong with this franchise?