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Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushing.

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Old 09-04-2013, 10:19 AM   #1
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Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushing.

9/7 Update: After playing more and more it is becoming clear that HB Iso is much easier to gain yardage on compared to other running plays. There is no risk calling that play the minimum yards gained is 4 every time. Please fix or give us back our sliders to fix it.




Last year I made a thread pleading with EA to patch the AI in CCM. Out of the box it was clear that the AI in CCM was different from Play Now. The sliders did not even work the same. We got lots of replys, tweeted the devs, and it got patched and fixed. They deserve credit for listening and being responsive. It was a really good feeling to see community action work.

It is a new year and a new game. The first impressions have been mostly positive. The problem with impressions is we all WANT a good football game so we are going to lean towards optimism. Most of us are football fans first and video game fans second. There is much improved with the gameplay. My favorite features are how INTs are only caught if the defender actually has his eyes on the ball. I also like how the running back does not fall on his butt after running into the offensive line, but puts his hand out. The devs must watch a lot of Jets football.

There is a major, game breaking issue however for those of us who enjoy user vs cpu. The problem is the USER rushing up the middle, and not as bad but still worrisome rushing outside. It is an issue for a few reason that I will break down:

1. There is no block shedding. The offensive line ALWAYS gets a strong push. there is zero risk of being blown up in the backfield.

2. When you are tackled you almost ALWAYS fall forwards for an extra 2-3 yards every play. Again there is no risk in running the ball. The minimum amount of yards you gain is 3 every play.

3. I like the feature when the running back places his hand in the offensive line's back and continues forwards, but it just adds the to the issue. It removes the risk of running inside that was there last year now you can run into your own players and still gain 3-4 yards.

4. Not as horrible but still a bit of an issue is rushing outside. The problem here is how good the WR's are at holding blocks. They litereally all block like Pro bowl fullbacks. This cannot be remedied because we do not have a block shedding slider.

So what do we want EA to do to fix this? We need our offline sliders back. We need the blockshedding slider to fix issue 1 and we need the breaktackles slider to fix issue 2. Without being able to adjust those the USER rushing will remain a joke once you get to a certain level of skill.

It is not as apparent to see the issue in the context of a game. If you do the following you will see how unacceptable it is.

Pick I form - HB Iso (it can be any run up the middle but this is the most basic.)

Push forwards

Gain 3-4 yards, first down after first down, and score a TD at will.

Sliders are irrelevant. The running back you use and the defense you face and the playbook they use is irrelevant. I have tried the hardest sliders with the worst RB vs the best defense and can recreate this scenario every time, and you could too. It should NOT be possible. There should be options to make the running game harder like it was last year. There is no risk to rushing and you cannot create any. Using Jarrods black set (The hardest sliders on the forum) on All-Madden I run for 4 yards MINIMUM against any defense even when they have 8 in the box or are in a goal line formation. That is not an exaggeration. There is no reason for me to punt on 4th and 1/2/3 because I know I will get the first down 90% of the time. There is no way that would happen in the NFL, play calling is a game of percentages. The risk of being stuffed at the line for no gain is not there. The only risk is you will run for 4 yards minimum, even on the hardest sliders with run block 0 on All-Madden. We can't tune anything to increase the difficulty to a realistic level. We want our sliders back.

I know some people use gameplans on offense, but just knowing in the back of your mind that when you get an inside run called it's guaranteed to give you 4 yards is not football. You will never lose yards, get blown up in the backfield, or tackled at the line unless you do something atrocious like using a poorly timed spin move.

This was not an issue last year. Everyone knows Jarrods black set is the hardest of all the sliders. Last year I threw my controller in frustration at random walls because of getting blown up in the backfield. But I like that that is possible. It made you have to call a variety of plays to get the run game going and felt like a chess match. It meant I could adjust the sliders and make it harder when I got better at rushing. Knowing I could make it omgimpossible difficulty was nice to have. This year that ceiling is not there. You cannot make it harder.

I understand and accept that the game is geared towards online play. I have no issue with that, I want Madden to be successful and sell lots of copies and EA make lots of money so it continues getting better. This year was a big step forward in every area. However we the user vs CPU gamers are always getting the short end of the stick. It happened last year with the CCM AI, and again this year, they took away our sliders. The most important ones! We need to get EA's attention again and get this patched. You may not see the issue now, but when you get better you will reach a point where there is no more challenge. There needs to be a risk to the user rushing game that is not there. Please reply and get this to the top and tweet EA.

https://twitter.com/Josh_Looman
https://twitter.com/EAMaddenNFL

Please do not spam them. Be thoughtful and respectful and succinct when addressing them. A simple link to this thread and a few words is all you need. All we can do is get their attention and hope they will respond as positively to us this year as they did last year. Thank you for reading.

EDIT: If any devs do check this post out I would also like to mention if we had the ability to assign custom playbooks/gameplans to CPU teams in CFM that would be highly appreciated too. I know that might causes issues and require lots of programming so I did not focus on that. The primary goal is to fix the running game but if we could create how the CPU picks plays that would be a very amazing addition. You would see the community here come out with some really solid effort I have no doubt. Combined with 32 team control and Madden Share it feels like the perfect time to let us have full control over the CPU's play calling tendencies. When you go into a teams Scheme menu you can assign them other teams default playbooks but the custom playbooks are not listed. If it is something that requires a great effort that is understandable but if it was a simple oversight it would be very welcome to have that option available as well. The more customization the better. Give us the tools and we will tune the game to play how we all wish. I have no doubt you would see great community work in that front just as you see with sliders.

Thank you for the effort you put into the game this year. It is clearly the best of the generation and gives me personally optimism for future editions. Also thank you for your response last year to the Play Now vs CCM AI complaints we brought up. We are not the largest play base but we are your most passionate fans. I know that USER vs CPU does not sell copies but we need some loving too. The work to franchise mode over the last few years that Josh has done is outstanding. It is just hard to get into it when you see some glaring problems. We all love football and want to get our fix. To see some of these smaller gameplay issues undermine that is a shame and should be corrected. Thanks for the improvements you have made and giving us more each year!

Last edited by BrianU; 09-07-2013 at 10:46 AM.
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Old 09-04-2013, 10:35 AM   #2
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Re: Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushi

what kind of sliders have you tried?

rushing up the middle works well for me, as the packers, who are bad at rushing, with my current sliders, i'm getting around 3.5-4.5 YPC with eddy lacy, which i consider to be pretty accurate for a packers RB...



my trouble is rush defense... i can hold the CPU to 4-5YPC, but they always seem to break a 30-50yd run, once per game or so.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:23 AM   #3
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Re: Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushi

I tried this out in Practice mode using A&S sliders with threshold up to 80 and I'm sorry Brian but I didn't see an issue. I ran the I formation Iso play out of the Eagles playbook against the Redskins defense and the success/failure of the play was widely varied depending on the defensive play called. In no way did I feel it was a "Money" play so to speak. If needed I was going to take it a step further and run the play against different defenses and record each result, but I just didn't find it necessary. Sorry bud, I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:35 AM   #4
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Re: Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushi

agreed. the running game is overpowered.
running up the middle is easy like the original psoter said, and running to the weak side is also a tad bit over powered.
defense overall needs to be patched.
As it stands right now the game is too offensive heavy especially with the run game. There was only 1 game where I had only run for 46 yards on 15 carries. all the other games were 150+ yards per game on 15-20 carries. all tehe games were on all pro or all madden.
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Old 09-04-2013, 01:05 PM   #5
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Re: Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushi

Yeah the USER rushing is definitely overpowered.. The blockshedding up front is terrible, outside running is easy, and the read option is overpowered too due to guys not getting off the block. It's so obvious I can't see how it's not noticed by some people. I can get almost every other area to play tough besides the CPUs run defense and it didn't help that they took away rush reaction and blockshedding slider that could have helped these issues. Taking away the pass rushing slider has been huge too.. The Devs definitely need to know about these issues and it needs to be patched for guys who are having too easy of a time running the ball..

You guys who aren't having these issues should keep enjoying the game and there really isn't no need to come in here and kill the momentum we are trying to create to make the game more tougher and enjoyable for some of us. We need the run defensive sliders to be tougher.
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Old 09-04-2013, 01:20 PM   #6
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Re: Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushi

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarodd21
Yeah the USER rushing is definitely overpowered.. The blockshedding up front is terrible, outside running is easy, and the read option is overpowered too due to guys not getting off the block. It's so obvious I can't see how it's not noticed by some people. I can get almost every other area to play tough besides the CPUs run defense and it didn't help that they took away rush reaction and blockshedding slider that could have helped these issues. Taking away the pass rushing slider has been huge too.. The Devs definitely need to know about these issues and it needs to be patched for guys who are having too easy of a time running the ball..

You guys who aren't having these issues should keep enjoying the game and there really isn't no need to come in here and kill the momentum we are trying to create to make the game more tougher and enjoyable for some of us. We need the run defensive sliders to be tougher.
Yes. CPU run defense and pass rush, especially with how they just play patty cake and don't shed blocks, needs a patch
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Old 09-04-2013, 01:45 PM   #7
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Re: Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushi

Just like last year I don't understand the mindset of people who are saying this is not an issue..

Any effort to make the game harder should be supported. We aren't asking to make it harder for you we want it harder for us. You can still use the same sliders and get the same gameplay you are using now. More options on how to play = we all win. That is why The Show is so applauded, they have 5 control schemes for hitting/pitching that can be tuned to get the experience you want.

I am using the Jets vs the Pats in CFM. I am watching my offensive line push their defensive line backwards EVERY rush attempt. There is no counter. How are people not seeing this? They literally push them backwards and I run for 4 yards a pop. I feel like I am hallucinating, must have been the pancakes I ate this morning.
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Old 09-04-2013, 01:47 PM   #8
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Re: Rushing up the middle is broken and overpowered. We need EA to fix the USER rushi

My run game is iffy. I can get some runs up the middle and sometimes I get cutback lanes, but I've also had DT's and DE's shed blocks as soon as I get to the line, especially when I'm playing a user. My only issues with the running game are (1) smaller backs and QB's trucking All-Pro defenders and (2) outside blocking getting 100% seals and holding (WR's pancaking LB's or blocking them for quite a while).
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