Explanation of attributes?

[sportsfreaklgg]

I know some attributes out there are self-explanatory (ie. Speed...Catching) However, there are some very ambiguous attributes. Here are the ones that need clarification:

Awareness: I've wondered about this for years now. What does it do precisely? Does it vary depending on the position? and if so, what are its effects from position to position?

Strength: At first it seemed self explanatory, but then it makes you wonder... Is strength only factored in for blocking? Or does it affect a ball handlers' ability to break tackles? If Marion Barber has 80 strength and Reggie Bush has 60 Strength, will Marion be harder to tackle?

Agility Vs. Elusiveness? What is the difference? My guess would be that agility effects how well a player can "stop and start" with directions, and elusiveness affects how well a ball handler will make jukes/fakes but that's just a guess.

Elusiveness vs. Juke vs. Spin
Aren't Jukes and Spins "elusive" moves? Is elusiveness more of a passive "auto break tackle" modifier? Does elusiveness have any effect on a non-ballcarrier who is moving around?

Route Running vs. Agility?
Theoretically, a receiver with good route running would run a "crisper" route, but doesn't that slightly overlap with agility? Again, I just want clarification. I do not mean to criticize the design of the attributes.

Blocking Strength vs. Blocking Footwork?

Play Recognition
What are the specifics on this? I know the smart *** answer is "well the defender can recognize plays better," but does that mean the defender commits to the correct play type (run vs. pass vs. play action etc.) if he has a high play recognition? Specifics here please.

Block Shedding vs. Strength
What is the difference between the two? If block shedding is how well a player gets by blockers, wouldn't that overlap with Finesse Moves and Power Moves?

Trucking/Stiff Arm
Is there a passive function to trucking/stiff arming, or is it simply when you flick up on the stick/hit X?

Zone Coverage
So a player has 99 zone coverage. Woohoo. What will he do better than a player with a 50 zone coverage? Anyone can figure out how to stick around in a certain area, right? I believe there is a difference, I just want to know what it is.

EA has too often left the gamers guessing as to what the attributes do, which is a shame since attributes are at the core of every player! If someone could clarify these attributes for me that would be nice. I think they should also have a breakdown of these attributes somewhere in the game. It really would help everyone's understanding of the game and make it WAYY more fun.

[rsoxguy12]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

I have always wondered what the toughness rating is as well....

[rickywal]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

I have always wondered what the toughness rating is as well....

I would assume toughness effects the amount a players stamina wears down in a game when taking big hits etc. and maybe the type of injury they get. So a tough player may only get a 1 week injury while a player with a lower rating may get 3-4 weeks out.

Thats my guess!

[rickywal]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

Great post actually.

You always try get players with high ratings in everything, but what does it all mean? If I draft a rookie with 80 block footwork and block strength but only 50 impact, is he even worth using or trying to develop?

I'd assume footwork helps him in positioning, strength in holding the tackle and impact in pancaking... but these are all guesses.

I guess this is one of the things we miss about no game instructions... they should have a break down of what each does, so we can better understand how we should be utilizing our players.

[ChuckMonts]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

toughness used to affect injury length. injury affected the amount of injuries. so a player with 99 injury rating and 1 toughness would VERY rarely get hurt but when he did he would be out for a long time. On the other end a guy with 1 injury rating and 99 toughness would get injured on every hit but it would rarely be more than a few plays.

my undertanding of footwork vs. power is that footwork is length they can hold blocks and power is the push they get

[Outkizast]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

Strength: I believe this affects a ballcarrier's ability to "fall forward"...?

Agility - Elusiveness: I actually just figured this out the other day: a ballcarrier with a really high agility rating can pull of his moves (spin, juke) MUCH faster and more responsively.. It's crazy how fast you can pull of some juke moves with a 99 agility guy... I think Elusiveness purely helps break tackles...

Block Shedding: not necessarily the ability to get PAST blockers... but the ability to desengage from a block I believe... if you want to get past the blocker, you would need a power or finesse move...

Route Running: nothing to do with agility... Jerry Rice is an AMAZING route runner... but not nearly as agile as Reggie Bush or someone....

Zone Coverage: My guess is this is how well a player can realize and react to a player running through his zone... also probably plays into awareness a little bit....


These may not all be true... but this is what I see the ratings as.

[sportsfreaklgg]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

Hmm, very good ideas so far. It's a shame we have to speculate though. Lets push for clearer explanations from EA!

Strength is tricky to figure out. I do feel like that when I have RB's that have high strength, they do fall foward a lot though.

[OSTAJ34]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

Seriously, what IS Awareness? I have heard that it is reflects decision making for CPU players, but does awareness mean anything if YOU are controlling the player?

WTF is it?

[adembroski]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

I know some attributes out there are self-explanatory (ie. Speed...Catching) However, there are some very ambiguous attributes. Here are the ones that need clarification:

I'll do the best I can, but I haven't exactly seen the code, so this is what I've gathered.

Awareness: I've wondered about this for years now. What does it do precisely? Does it vary depending on the position? and if so, what are its effects from position to position?

For some positions, it does nothing. It's a LastGen holdover that has yet to be replaced at all positions. You have several different ratings (Play Recognition, Man Coverage, Zone Coverage, Ball Carrier Vision) that have replaced it. QBs still use it extensively to find open men, feel the rush and get rid of the ball, things like that. At this point, it's greatest value is for the QB, and even then, only when CPU controlled.

It's a dying rating. A few more years and it'll likely be gone.

Strength: At first it seemed self explanatory, but then it makes you wonder... Is strength only factored in for blocking? Or does it affect a ball handlers' ability to break tackles? If Marion Barber has 80 strength and Reggie Bush has 60 Strength, will Marion be harder to tackle?

Another rating that seems to be being phased out. As it is right now, it's still used as a defender's ability to anchor against a block (hold his ground), a QBs ability to throw while being tackled (I think), and to break tackles, though it's only part of the equation. The anchor thing is probably it's most prevalent use now.

Agility Vs. Elusiveness? What is the difference? My guess would be that agility effects how well a player can "stop and start" with directions, and elusiveness affects how well a ball handler will make jukes/fakes but that's just a guess.

Agility is change of direction speed, and has been borderline useless until this year. Elusiveness is "trucking" for small backs... agility as it applies to breaking tackles.

Elusiveness vs. Juke vs. Spin
Aren't Jukes and Spins "elusive" moves? Is elusiveness more of a passive "auto break tackle" modifier? Does elusiveness have any effect on a non-ballcarrier who is moving around?

Jukes and spins are their own separate moves. If you attempt to juke someone, the Juke rating is checked. Elusiveness is checked when "trucking" with an elusive back.

Route Running vs. Agility?
Theoretically, a receiver with good route running would run a "crisper" route, but doesn't that slightly overlap with agility? Again, I just want clarification. I do not mean to criticize the design of the attributes.

An agile player is not necessarily a good route runner. He has greater potential to run great routes, but you have to know how the route needs to be run, and have the correct footwork, not to mention being disciplined in your route. Agility governs none of those.

Blocking Strength vs. Blocking Footwork?

Footwork opposes Finesse moves, Strength opposes Power moves. I think RBS also governs "push" and PBS governs the ability to stand up to a bull rush.

Play Recognition
What are the specifics on this? I know the smart *** answer is "well the defender can recognize plays better," but does that mean the defender commits to the correct play type (run vs. pass vs. play action etc.) if he has a high play recognition? Specifics here please.

Well, judging by the videos I've seen of linebacker play so far, it doesn't do much of anything:P

That said, it's intended to do exactly what you said; spot play action, quickly diagnose run vs. pass, prevent being fooled by a counter, that sort of thing.

Block Shedding vs. Strength
What is the difference between the two? If block shedding is how well a player gets by blockers, wouldn't that overlap with Finesse Moves and Power Moves?

That's a damn good question, I think it would. Perhaps block shedding is getting off a block moving laterally? As in, making a tackle when the back is passing by the block, rather than when making a move? Just a guess.

Trucking/Stiff Arm
Is there a passive function to trucking/stiff arming, or is it simply when you flick up on the stick/hit X?

Trucking is hitting up on the right stick when Elusiveness is not applicable (as with Brandon Jacobs). That simple.

Zone Coverage
So a player has 99 zone coverage. Woohoo. What will he do better than a player with a 50 zone coverage? Anyone can figure out how to stick around in a certain area, right? I believe there is a difference, I just want to know what it is.

How quickly they respond to a pass into their zone, how well they diagnose a route by a receiver in their zone.

EA has too often left the gamers guessing as to what the attributes do, which is a shame since attributes are at the core of every player! If someone could clarify these attributes for me that would be nice. I think they should also have a breakdown of these attributes somewhere in the game. It really would help everyone's understanding of the game and make it WAYY more fun.

I tried

[yapa44]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

As usual with EA, there is no 'real/good'guide with the game so :

- Impossible to chose one playbook without some internet sites.
- no explanation about any attributes so you can imagine what you want about them EA doesn't care.

The solution is not so difficult :
Just put on EA internet site a file (pdf,doc etc) with all informations we need/ask.

[Glorious Arc]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

I think it would be nice if EA took a look at all the info that gets used when playing the game and posted it on the internet. It would be like reading Diablo 2 equations and anyone that wanted to know how much a stat really mattered they could take the time to plug in the stats and see the statically result of the action.

With that info released people could take the equations and make guides to help give a general feel for what everything does and what is most important for each position ect ect. It sure would be nice

Simple example of what the D2 formulas look like...

Total Damage:


Minimum Damage = (Weapon Minimum Damage + (+x To Minimum Damage)) * (1 + StatsBonus + (+x% Enhanced Damage) / 100) * Modifier
Maximum Damage = (Weapon Maximum Damage + (+x To Maximum Damage)) * (1 + StatsBonus + (+x% Enhanced Damage) / 100) * Modifier

Or...

Mana Regeneration forumla

25 * [[256 * max_mana / (25 * 120)] * (100 + %Mana Regeneration) / 100] / 256

It took my awhile to find it but I found Ian's post about QB accuracy. These are the type of things that should be fully laid out for everything so people who are obsessed with madden can completely understand the ramifications of what may/may not happen with having X ratings.

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...hilosophy.html

[jvaccaro]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

I've said it before, and I'll say it again...

Why on earth does EA keep this stuff a mystery? Why wouldn't they share how the game works with their customers? It just doesn't make any sense at all...

I understand saving a few pennies by having thier local copy shop create that weak 8 page instruction manual we've gotten the last several years, but why not put this info on a website somewhere?

[sois]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

This is a beautiful thread. Thanks OP, this is wonderful.

Adembroski, that is great info. I would love to see an official response to this thread as well.

My main concern is how do some of the useless attributes, mainly agility and awareness, affect salary demands? This is critical to franchise guys who typically sign low awareness, high PS/PA QB's for example and kind of "game the system" because the of the useless attributes.

[DallasAllDay]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

One major problem that i have with these rating is they way guys like Felix jones and Brian Westbrook break 3 and four tackles in a single play but a back like Marion Barber with a 99 trucking rarely breaks more than one.

Backs like Marion and Brandon Jacobs are known for being tough physical runner that routinely need to have two and three guys to tackle them. I just dont under stand how elusiveness helps you break tackle.

To me Elusiveness mean you are you are harder to get a hand on. Trucking to me means that you are able break through attempted tackles more.

It just frustrates the crap out of me when Demarcus Ware hits a guy like Brain Westbrook Square on in the back field for what should be a loss but some how by the grace of god westbrook breaks out of the tackle for what usually turns out to be a big gain. When Marion is in the same situation he usually goes down. I just dont get it.

[sportsfreaklgg]

Re: Explanation of attributes?

This is a beautiful thread. Thanks OP, this is wonderful.

Adembroski, that is great info. I would love to see an official response to this thread as well.

My main concern is how do some of the useless attributes, mainly agility and awareness, affect salary demands? This is critical to franchise guys who typically sign low awareness, high PS/PA QB's for example and kind of "game the system" because the of the useless attributes.

Thanks, I'm glad others want some answers too.

Even more important than skewed salary demands is skewed player ratings, and consequently skewed team ratings! If awareness truly does nothing for say, Runningbacks (since they are almost always player controlled when doing anything besides blocking,) then runningbacks with high awareness really aren't as good as their overall says they are. This is a major problem because I'm sure it applies to all positions.

So, to clarify, the major issue is still ambiguity in respect to the player attributes. However a possible sub-problem is that player attributes aren't being correctly into the single "overall" rating.