A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

[ElephantEyelash]

Shortly ago I posted my complaints in the demo impressions thread about how my pass coverage seemed fundamentally broken, ie. in man they give too much of a cushion or give away the inside to easily and in zone they don't pay much attention to anything but their zone pattern. I also noticed that the CPU seemed to have no trouble whatsoever keeping up in man and covering the right guys in zone. I was talking to my friend about this, and he proposed that instead of it just being broken (since clearly the coding is there for competent D) that maybe the difficulty level is the cause. (I suppose this isn't a huge revelation for some, but bear with me)

Sure enough, I fire it up on Rookie (instead of All-Pro that I have been playing on), and my secondary is playing just as intelligently as the CPU plays me in the higher levels. So....I'm thinking there is a possible fix for this. With the custom difficulty, I could put everything on All-Pro, but leave the Pass D on Rookie or Pro right? There will still be way too much pressure and interceptions and generally bad decisions by the QB, so do you guys think that with the sliders (we are supposed to get CPU AI sliders right?), these things could be adjusted so that there would be a competent passing offense by the CPU with a competent pass defense by my AI teammates?

Also, to stray slightly from the topic, the deeper issue is the way I think the difficulty is programmed (and I have this same issue with other sports games like FIFA) which is just to make your AI players less capable rather than just making the CPU capable of making smarter choices. I absolutely hate this with a passion and feel like it is a fundamental flaw in sports gaming.

[vision]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

The user defense on All-Pro is Broken. I posted about this in the huge thread, but of course it just got lost in the shuffle of blind praise. I'll be fair the game has come a long way, and there should be legit praise.

But the 5min demo is far.. far from perfect. I may get some heat for this, but I'm inclined to think that some of those glowing posts are even planted from.. lets just say, certain entities that may have an agenda to propagate sales hype. Just a thought.

[sevenjames]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

I have noticed the same thing on all-pro as well. You are absolutely correct in saying that the user's defense is less capable. I assume we are all playing the 5 minute version.

Just wondering, is anyone who is playing the 1 minute version seeing the same things? I heard it seemed to be the more polished version from a couple people. I don't have a 360 so I can't verify. If anyone can, I'd appreciate...

[vision]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

I did notice that the 1 minute demo seemed a little more polished. Even the graphics seem to have AA. I'll play t demo again, and just play man coverage to see if it is fairly consistent.

[FOREST007]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

i play on all madden and its the same problem. there are even times my players would freeze for a sec after the snap...like they'll take a step or two then stop (freeze in position) and then continue on w/ their assignment.

there are times when im tryin to blitz manually w/ my FS and it'll freeze me for a sec too..

[Nintari]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

You right...completely. The user defense is alot stupider then the CPU's on all-pro. As far as I'm concerned, it's broken and needs patched if possible.

Also, the CPU secondary is like, uber physic. I had one DB running BEHIND my WR who I sent a perfect lob to. The DB does a 360 spin AGAINST his momentum, leaps up with one hand and intercepts it.

It's things like this that just...should never happen and it's not possible for me to overlook.

[ElephantEyelash]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

Does anyone think putting the pass d on pro and trying to supplement it with sliders would actually work? I'm not sure what sliders we will have at our disposal, but I think even if I bumped up something like QB accuracy, it might not help if the decision making is automatically bad on the lower rating.

[sevenjames]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

we are not playing the final version of the game...i'm hoping it will be fixed before there is a need for a patch lol

[WFColonel56]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

My pass D seems fine to me.....Zone imo is as good as its ever been, almost like in real life......The hook zones play deeper if there is nobody in their zone....Im loving it....I got some real nice heat out of man cov...with Bump&Run.....

I really love how the Lbs have weight in zone coverage so you just cant make sudden jerks to get back into position..

[sevenjames]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

My pass D seems fine to me.....Zone imo is as good as its ever been, almost like in real life......The hook zones play deeper if there is nobody in their zone....Im loving it....I got some real nice heat out of man cov...with Bump&Run.....

I really love how the Lbs have weight in zone coverage so you just cant make sudden jerks to get back into position..

what demo?

[WFColonel56]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

both

[Nintari]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

Does anyone think putting the pass d on pro and trying to supplement it with sliders would actually work? I'm not sure what sliders we will have at our disposal, but I think even if I bumped up something like QB accuracy, it might not help if the decision making is automatically bad on the lower rating.

I know there's sliders, but really...these guys are really talented college graduate developers. They should get these things right themselves before they send the game out instead of throwing sliders in and saying "fix it".

And IMO, this is probably an engine problem. Sliders are only going to go so far. For me, it's just a matter of whether or not I can handle it until we get a new engine or something else comes out on the market that's better.

[BadApple]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

How did you play both demos? Still trying to figure out how to download both.

My user defense (with the cards on all-pro, 5 minute demo for 360) is pretty dead on. Just recently, I user-controlled Antrel Rolle and only allowed 58 totals yards for the steelers, with the ending score 14-10 (7 of their points came from a pick-6).

I really don't see a problem with the defense besides man coverage and the pass rush sometimes. The cpu really does apparently know EXACTLY what play I called and jumps the route every single time. And on the pass rush, all I do is user control Karlos Dansby or Chike Okeafor and I usually get good pressure. I don't always get the sack or cause the duck throw, but I do deliver a pretty good hit.

I am thinking of purchasing a capture card, so I might put up some videos soon.

[Nintari]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

The cpu really does apparently know EXACTLY what play I called and jumps the route every single time.

And this is exactly my gripe. I'm tired of super psychic DB/MLB/Safeties jumping routes with Mater Chief like movement. If they can't program the defense to play a good game without CPU cheating then just throw in the towel and start from scratch with a new engine.

[HolyCrap]

Re: A theory about bad defense and difficulty level

if their is a safety deep even if the safety is 20 yards deep upon the snap the safety will immediately back pedal which doesn't happen in the NFL

this causes the Safeties to be in no mans land and be no where near the play. the DBs cant be reaction to the coverage that is called but integrating the coverage and the routes that are being run by the wide receivers

The DB's do what ever the coverage tells them do do regardless of the routes being run