Solution for cheesers!

[foolish813]

Limit each play to no more than 3 times called per game. Could it be that simple or am I missing something?

[ChicagoCubz]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...909-post2.html

[foolish813]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

r u a cheeser?

[TomBrady]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

So, only 3 punts and field goals per game too?

[KBLover]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

Limit each play to no more than 3 times called per game. Could it be that simple or am I missing something?

If we had 100s of plays like the playbooks in HC - then I could see this making sense.

Or maybe if all the plays, especially running plays, actually WORKED, then it would make sense.

But some of these plays are like...what? What kind of route is that? What kind of route combination is that? I mean, some of these I can't imagine the situation you'd call them in - much less it being a crapshoot if the players will run it even as it's drawn up with any consistency.

The reason "money plays" exist is partly because they actually worked. If more plays actually worked, then I'd bet even the "cheesers" would call more diverse plays.

Applies on defense too - a lot of the defensive plays just don't work or don't make sense (like...why would I call a MLB blitz, send the OLBs to the flats and the CBs to the deep sidelines...and leave the WHOLE MIDDLE of the field undefended? I mean...really?) No hook from the SS - no hook or buzz from at least one of the OLBs - no zone from the DEs - nothing. It's like "here, offense, here's at least 9 yards. Even the *AI* licked it's silicon lips when I tried that play, and hit it for 15 yds with ease.

[jvaccaro]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

The plays currently available are too limited to restrict this much, especially on defense.

I hate when somebody finds a certain route combo that screws up my defenders' AI and runs it all game, but 3 is too few IMO.

[TheTurducken]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

I agree, some of the plays are seemingly designed by monkeys!

[nighttrain32]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

If we had 100s of plays like the playbooks in HC - then I could see this making sense.

Or maybe if all the plays, especially running plays, actually WORKED, then it would make sense.

But some of these plays are like...what? What kind of route is that? What kind of route combination is that? I mean, some of these I can't imagine the situation you'd call them in - much less it being a crapshoot if the players will run it even as it's drawn up with any consistency.

The reason "money plays" exist is partly because they actually worked. If more plays actually worked, then I'd bet even the "cheesers" would call more diverse plays.

Applies on defense too - a lot of the defensive plays just don't work or don't make sense (like...why would I call a MLB blitz, send the OLBs to the flats and the CBs to the deep sidelines...and leave the WHOLE MIDDLE of the field undefended? I mean...really?) No hook from the SS - no hook or buzz from at least one of the OLBs - no zone from the DEs - nothing. It's like "here, offense, here's at least 9 yards. Even the *AI* licked it's silicon lips when I tried that play, and hit it for 15 yds with ease.

I agree. There should be more plays for every team. What EA should do is add more plays; if that means open beta test the game or get real coaches in the development cycle and get community feedback on playbooks so be it. Madden on the PSP has more formations and plays than the next gen versions.

[foolish813]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

I agree with there being too few plays. Especially when half of them are in every playbook. Special teams and defence should probably not be limited, because most teams use their base D alot and just vary on a situational basis to keep the O guessing. But truly on offense I don't think any real NFL coordinator would use a play more than 3 times. The way I see defense is that if you let yourself get figured out u pay. Just like in real life. As far as fooling the AI. That's a whole nother thread!

[KBLover]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

I agree with there being too few plays. Especially when half of them are in every playbook. Special teams and defence should probably not be limited, because most teams use their base D alot and just vary on a situational basis to keep the O guessing. But truly on offense I don't think any real NFL coordinator would use a play more than 3 times. The way I see defense is that if you let yourself get figured out u pay. Just like in real life. As far as fooling the AI. That's a whole nother thread!

Well, a real life offense is going to keep doing what works too. How much variation was there when the Ravens ran on the Pats 52 times (46 if you take out Flacco's runs) in their game? Or when the Ravens said "Screw it, we're running in down your throat" the whole second half of their game vs the Raiders?

Heck, the Pats game, they got 234 yds (229 if you take out Flacco's) - so just around 5 ypc - and they kept going it. So it was effective, and kept doing it. A Madden playcaller should have that option - just that Madden needs more run plays that work so I wouldn't have to call 30 Power O's with flips to be just as effective as my real life Ravens.

I'm willing to guess a lot of the variation is more with packages or subtle changes. For example, one pass play might be 4 WR - all Go routes. Then another might be 4 WR, Go's outside, and a slant in one slot and a curl in the other. Then 4 WR with Three Go routes and a quick hit drag in case it's a blitz, etc.

Then another play might be 2 WR, the HB and a TE - all running Go route except the HB is running the slant and the TE running the curl.

Same for runs. One might be strong I - A gap HB Dive. Then same thing, but B gap. Then same thing but Off Tackle. In Madden - we just have "HB Dive". Yeah.

Until we get that kind of variation, I think we can't limit anything. I'd rather EA just make all the plays be effective so the temptation isn't even there because you know only about 15-20 of the plays are truly effective in any one book.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: Solution for cheesers!

Well, a real life offense is going to keep doing what works too. How much variation was there when the Ravens ran on the Pats 52 times (46 if you take out Flacco's runs) in their game? Or when the Ravens said "Screw it, we're running in down your throat" the whole second half of their game vs the Raiders?

Heck, the Pats game, they got 234 yds (229 if you take out Flacco's) - so just around 5 ypc - and they kept going it. So it was effective, and kept doing it. A Madden playcaller should have that option - just that Madden needs more run plays that work so I wouldn't have to call 30 Power O's with flips to be just as effective as my real life Ravens.

I'm willing to guess a lot of the variation is more with packages or subtle changes. For example, one pass play might be 4 WR - all Go routes. Then another might be 4 WR, Go's outside, and a slant in one slot and a curl in the other. Then 4 WR with Three Go routes and a quick hit drag in case it's a blitz, etc.

Then another play might be 2 WR, the HB and a TE - all running Go route except the HB is running the slant and the TE running the curl.

Same for runs. One might be strong I - A gap HB Dive. Then same thing, but B gap. Then same thing but Off Tackle. In Madden - we just have "HB Dive". Yeah.

Until we get that kind of variation, I think we can't limit anything. I'd rather EA just make all the plays be effective so the temptation isn't even there because you know only about 15-20 of the plays are truly effective in any one book.

Bingo.