Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

[Agame]

Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

Last year popular opinion was that rating on individual players had almost No effect on line play. No reason to draft a good lineman when they all did more or less the same performance on game day. This year, Madden 2012 sounds like all has changed, ratings will count at every position. For those involved in making Madden or those that have played Madden 2012, feedback on this would be greatly appreciated.

[RGiles36]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

I'd venture to say that O-line ratings mattered last year. There are absolutely some high rated OL that stone wall defenders, and there are also some DL that are extremely disruptive.

[guaps]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

I don't know about Madden 12, but it sure didn't feel like it in Madden 11. While I agree with rgiles36 that there was a difference between the elite and average DL's in the game, it mostly came down to the block shedding rating, IMO. If the block shedding rating of the defenders were low, then it didn't matter too much who was playing on OL or DL from what I experienced.

Line play is one of the central elements of getting football right, but also something that is hard to replicate in a video game. Yet I feel that Tiburon should be dedicating more time and energy on getting line play right than getting the presentation right, but that's just my opinion. I might be getting Madden 12 this year, but that'll only be because I want something to play until FIFA 12 comes out.

[LionsFanNJ]

Doesn't matter what anyone says. Someone is going to unrealistically, unsim-ly(ironically very hypocritical btw) put a punter on the line and say look broken.

sent from parts unknown

[lofeazy]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

Doesn't matter what anyone says. Someone is going to unrealistically, unsim-ly(ironically very hypocritical btw) put a punter on the line and say look broken.

sent from parts unknown

Well back in madden 05 ratings mattered.(No sliders,tuner set,BSH rating)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxG-FbPP12s

If last gen can do it.Shouldn't this gen should be able to.(Yes are NO)

[Bluesman]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

I don't know about Madden 12, but it sure didn't feel like it in Madden 11. While I agree with rgiles36 that there was a difference between the elite and average DL's in the game, it mostly came down to the block shedding rating, IMO. If the block shedding rating of the defenders were low, then it didn't matter too much who was playing on OL or DL from what I experienced.

This is what I've found as well. Julius Peppers and his low BSH attribute meant there was little difference when he went against a good/great OT or a scrub rated in the 60's. On offense I couldn't understand why rather nondescript DL were blowing up my running plays until I saw their obscenely high BSH. I surmise that the inability to get real 34 line play (double teaming of linemen) results in these guys getting overly high BSH ratings.

[Thinking Out Loud]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

Doesn't matter what anyone says. Someone is going to unrealistically, unsim-ly(ironically very hypocritical btw) put a punter on the line and say look broken.

sent from parts unknown

With all due respect to LionsFan, I don't understand why people state things like this and it always comes across to me, like they are missing the whole point. Two things I want to state about youtubbers or whomever does these type line "tests".

1) They are NOT just placing players like punters in offensive line positions, they are actually changing the players, like punters, into offensive lineman. The whole point of no longer allowing users to place any player, at any position, like in past Maddens, was supposed to be so changing their position would allow their skill ratings at that position to determine their effectiveness. So anyway you shake it, changing a Punter into an offensive lineman or lowering the position skill ratings of a default offensive lineman, to match each other, should at least yield similar results. Then people could claim height and weight don't matter but at least position skill ratings clearly would.

2) I have actually seen the CPU teams in franchise mode, place a punter on the offensive line, WITHOUT converting them into an offensive lineman. Me and my friend control the CPU team of each others weekly opponent in our franchise. Whenever a CPU controlled team's game is played by a user, they can NOT change the CPU teams depth chart. The user has to do in-game formation subs to make any changes to the CPU teams on-field personnel. Countless time, I have played with CPU controlled teams that have so many offensive line injuries, that punters will be starting on the offensive line, out on the field. Now, I always take the time to formation sub them out of each formation but you get the point.

So in Madden, people don't necessarily have to be looking for troubles, sometimes, troubles find them.

[Thinking Out Loud]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

Well back in madden 05 ratings mattered.(No sliders,tuner set,BSH rating)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxG-FbPP12s

If last gen can do it.Shouldn't this gen should be able to.(Yes are NO)

Great post.

Now how anyone can sit there and watch that while still claiming EA devs have never done better than what we have seen with some elements of next-gen Madden, is beyond me.

I have no beef with the Madden devs or EA Sports but for 6 years now, there have been some serious unresolved issues specific to next-gen Madden. In Madden 12, they may have actually successfully addressed some of those next-gen issues but more people would probably feel more confident of that, if EA was more willing to admit their past next-gen Madden failures.

Not doing so can sometimes give the impression that they still "don't get it" to some people, even if this year, they actually do.

[Johnny "Too Tall"]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

whether or not ratings and physical attributes mattered for oline players in-game is a matter of debate. I tested it and, to me, they certainly don't matter as much as they should.

Whats not debatable to me is how their relationship to sim stats. This might not bother some people but i do sim games and the oline meant absolutely nothing to the sim engine. You could have an oline of punters and your running back would still produce the same. It meant nothing at all. Hopefully this has changed.

[Agame]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

Madden 2005! Great video, thanks for posting everyone’s Strong emotions on this subject. We all know that line play is Huge in the NFL. Look who gets drafted first and second round. Follow the money.

The Madden Team has gotten rid of suction blocking, so you would think that ratings will play a major role this year on how will your line executes their responsibilities. It would be OUTSTANDING if one of the Madden Developers would post some video and give some more details on line interaction and the ratings that will matter this year for each Line position.

[rylynner]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

I'm with you on really getting anxious about seeing more of the game. Can't wait to see some videos featuring new game play. I'd even settle for another set of screenshots haha

[falconfansince81]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

Madden 2005! The Madden Team has gotten rid of suction blocking, so you would thing that ratings will play a major role this year on how will your line executes their responsibilities.

i don't think eliminating SOME of the suction is going in automatically increase the effectiveness of oline ratings, weight, strength, etc. so it will most likely be another debate. the only benefit lineof this for me is still being able to draft olineman somewhere after my punter in online franchise as i put up just as good of numbers with or without a beast line. til i see a significant and proven change, its business as usual.

[TNT713]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

I'm not sure why the idea that ratings don't mean anything... Unless they let the CPU do everything AND only broadcast the parts that prove their point (ie O-line made of punters, kickers, and Qb's). When players actually control a big lineman like Suh, it's simple and easy to shove the punter to the side and get a pass rush. It's even easier on run plays.

In a more practical sense. When people audible down from Quarters to a 4 man line, the 7th DB moves to the DT spot. EVERYTIME I see opponent's do this, I audible and run right at the DB on a 3-pt stance for an average of 4-6 yards. Why? Size matters.

Also, I've also noticed that I can run right ALL DAY with my Panthers, but could not do the same with the Cardinals. Why? Ratings matter.

Of course, someone will do something STUPID to try to prove the ratings don't matter when all they are really proving is that they aren't very smart.

I'd like to see someone make these silly personnel changes (P and K to O-Line) and play an ENTIRE GAME instead of focusing on the one or two plays where a little guy actually makes a good block. I'd be willing to bet that the O-Line consisting of kickers, punters, and backup QB's will perform poorly. Why? Ratings matter.

Always beware anyone that says "This should never happen" as part of their point. Reason being, their entire argument is based using something that would never happen as a means to prove something would never happen. We should be laughing because some fool put a Punter at center, not because of the 15 replays of the two plays where the punter actually made a good block.

Later

[DaggerSwagger]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

Doesn't matter what anyone says. Someone is going to unrealistically, unsim-ly(ironically very hypocritical btw) put a punter on the line and say look broken.

sent from parts unknown

so in other words you think that is realistic for a punter to hold his own at ol or dl play?

[Tecmo Bowl]

Re: Will Ratings Matter for Offensive Line Play?

I'm not sure why the idea that ratings don't mean anything... Unless they let the CPU do everything AND only broadcast the parts that prove their point (ie O-line made of punters, kickers, and Qb's). When players actually control a big lineman like Suh, it's simple and easy to shove the punter to the side and get a pass rush. It's even easier on run plays.

In a more practical sense. When people audible down from Quarters to a 4 man line, the 7th DB moves to the DT spot. EVERYTIME I see opponent's do this, I audible and run right at the DB on a 3-pt stance for an average of 4-6 yards. Why? Size matters.

Also, I've also noticed that I can run right ALL DAY with my Panthers, but could not do the same with the Cardinals. Why? Ratings matter.

Of course, someone will do something STUPID to try to prove the ratings don't matter when all they are really proving is that they aren't very smart.

I'd like to see someone make these silly personnel changes (P and K to O-Line) and play an ENTIRE GAME instead of focusing on the one or two plays where a little guy actually makes a good block. I'd be willing to bet that the O-Line consisting of kickers, punters, and backup QB's will perform poorly. Why? Ratings matter.

Always beware anyone that says "This should never happen" as part of their point. Reason being, their entire argument is based using something that would never happen as a means to prove something would never happen. We should be laughing because some fool put a Punter at center, not because of the 15 replays of the two plays where the punter actually made a good block.

Later

SO you think a punter could go a full game playing OL one on one with a DL and actually block him for a few plays?