LB with low strength ratings?

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  • thebizarrojerry
    Banned
    • Aug 2012
    • 506

    #1

    LB with low strength ratings?

    Why do some linebackers have such low strength ratings? For example on the Lions, all the linebackers have 70 or below. While they may not be the best at their positions, regardless of skill level, the one thing a linebacker has is strength.
  • steamboat
    Rookie
    • Dec 2004
    • 481

    #2
    Re: LB with low strength ratings?

    Linebackers are not all strong. One of the best ever MLB was a guy that had very little strength. 70 would be about right for a low strength LB. Lions LB make a living off quickness etc. Doesn't surprise me that they have low strength.

    Comment

    • DCEBB2001
      MVP
      • Nov 2008
      • 2569

      #3
      Re: LB with low strength ratings?

      Position should NEVER be used to pre-determine STR or any other rating for that matter. If that logic was used, then all WRs/CBs would have STR in the 20s, when clearly there are guys who are much stronger than that.

      How about instead we let the DATA tell us how strong/fast/agile, etc someone is and just let it be instead of assuming that someone is strong/wesk, fast/slow, etc based on their position.

      There are several Ks and Ps in the league who can lift more than several RBs out there. The notion of STR being position-determined and specific is a myth in reality.
      Dan B.
      Player Ratings Administrator
      www.fbgratings.com/members
      NFL Scout
      www.nfldraftscout.com/members

      Petition to EA for FBG Ratings:
      https://www.change.org/p/ea-sports-t...bers-index-php

      Comment

      • steamboat
        Rookie
        • Dec 2004
        • 481

        #4
        Re: LB with low strength ratings?

        I do believe it is a myth entirely, but I do believe that a strong WR is very rarely as strong as a strong DT. I believe strength should be an actual strength number instead of being position specific. Like, if a WR is just not strong at all, he shouldn't get a 50, he should get lower then that.

        Guess I just believe in stretching the numbers out a bit more. I wish the ratings started out more at a 30 with most being between 50-65 starters 65-80 and stars 81-99. Course I hate the fact that we can see exactly what the ratings are.

        Comment

        • thebizarrojerry
          Banned
          • Aug 2012
          • 506

          #5
          Re: LB with low strength ratings?

          Originally posted by steamboat
          Linebackers are not all strong. One of the best ever MLB was a guy that had very little strength. 70 would be about right for a low strength LB. Lions LB make a living off quickness etc. Doesn't surprise me that they have low strength.
          Cmon now, tell me linebackers are not the strongest on the teams? I bet most can bench press more than anyone besides defensive ends or dt

          Comment

          • NYM72382
            Banned
            • Sep 2012
            • 115

            #6
            Re: LB with low strength ratings?

            Originally posted by steamboat
            Linebackers are not all strong. One of the best ever MLB was a guy that had very little strength. 70 would be about right for a low strength LB. Lions LB make a living off quickness etc. Doesn't surprise me that they have low strength.
            Why would you make a comment like that without giving us a name? Any can make claims using the term "a guy"

            Comment

            • steamboat
              Rookie
              • Dec 2004
              • 481

              #7
              Re: LB with low strength ratings?

              Originally posted by NYM72382
              Why would you make a comment like that without giving us a name? Any can make claims using the term "a guy"
              the name is Zach Thomas. And yes, linebackers are on average more powerful then cornerbacks and wide receivers. Not always more so then safety's, rarely more then lineman on either side probably on par with TE's.

              Are you guys saying there is no such thing as a 70's strength linebacker that is good at other phases of the position?

              Comment

              • DCEBB2001
                MVP
                • Nov 2008
                • 2569

                #8
                Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                Originally posted by steamboat
                the name is Zach Thomas. And yes, linebackers are on average more powerful then cornerbacks and wide receivers. Not always more so then safety's, rarely more then lineman on either side probably on par with TE's.

                Are you guys saying there is no such thing as a 70's strength linebacker that is good at other phases of the position?
                There are plenty of good LBs with STR over 70 (what I deem to be "average") and other great skills. Check out the FBG site. All players are normalized where 70 is average for the raw physical attributes of STR, AGI, SPD, ACC, and AGI, regardless of position.

                Check out the top OLBs and their physical attributes. All of the top guys have STR in the 70s not because they are LBs, but because the data used to determine the ratings deem their STR to be over the average rating of STR for any player (70).

                Dan B.
                Player Ratings Administrator
                www.fbgratings.com/members
                NFL Scout
                www.nfldraftscout.com/members

                Petition to EA for FBG Ratings:
                https://www.change.org/p/ea-sports-t...bers-index-php

                Comment

                • Obnoxious
                  MVP
                  • Sep 2011
                  • 1134

                  #9
                  Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                  Originally posted by DCEBB2001
                  Position should NEVER be used to pre-determine STR or any other rating for that matter. If that logic was used, then all WRs/CBs would have STR in the 20s, when clearly there are guys who are much stronger than that.

                  How about instead we let the DATA tell us how strong/fast/agile, etc someone is and just let it be instead of assuming that someone is strong/wesk, fast/slow, etc based on their position.

                  There are several Ks and Ps in the league who can lift more than several RBs out there. The notion of STR being position-determined and specific is a myth in reality.
                  Yeah, I agree. People are ignorant. In HS football, the coach told one of my friends he could never be a punter because he was 280ish pounds. He could kick footballs, basketballs, soccerballs, anything across our entire apartment complex. Yet they had this little guy probably 5'8" playing gaurd, a hell of a gaurd at that. Even though our school went undefeated every year we had DaeQuan Scott, our fat *** coach was ignorant as hell.

                  Comment

                  • thebizarrojerry
                    Banned
                    • Aug 2012
                    • 506

                    #10
                    Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                    Originally posted by Obnoxious
                    Yeah, I agree. People are ignorant. In HS football, the coach told one of my friends he could never be a punter because he was 280ish pounds. He could kick footballs, basketballs, soccerballs, anything across our entire apartment complex. Yet they had this little guy probably 5'8" playing gaurd, a hell of a gaurd at that. Even though our school went undefeated every year we had DaeQuan Scott, our fat *** coach was ignorant as hell.
                    Except linebacker is specifically a position where you need strength and speed combined to be a professional player. You not only need to be able to handle big O linemen but also take down any receivers or runners that come your way.

                    Comment

                    • Obnoxious
                      MVP
                      • Sep 2011
                      • 1134

                      #11
                      Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                      Originally posted by thebizarrojerry
                      Except linebacker is specifically a position where you need strength and speed combined to be a professional player. You not only need to be able to handle big O linemen but also take down any receivers or runners that come your way.
                      Basically. I read sort of a quote/motto once that said a linebacker should be fast enough to play Safety and strong enough to play DE. I personally played DE in our yellow defense and LB in blue.

                      Comment

                      • thebizarrojerry
                        Banned
                        • Aug 2012
                        • 506

                        #12
                        Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                        Originally posted by Obnoxious
                        Basically. I read sort of a quote/motto once that said a linebacker should be fast enough to play Safety and strong enough to play DE. I personally played DE in our yellow defense and LB in blue.
                        I personally have never played tackle football, the middle and high school I went to was too small. But middle school we had flag football league with other private schools around. lol. Played wr and backup qb. So I'm not first hand experienced but know enough tactic wise I think.

                        Comment

                        • steamboat
                          Rookie
                          • Dec 2004
                          • 481

                          #13
                          Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                          Originally posted by DCEBB2001
                          There are plenty of good LBs with STR over 70 (what I deem to be "average") and other great skills. Check out the FBG site. All players are normalized where 70 is average for the raw physical attributes of STR, AGI, SPD, ACC, and AGI, regardless of position.

                          Check out the top OLBs and their physical attributes. All of the top guys have STR in the 70s not because they are LBs, but because the data used to determine the ratings deem their STR to be over the average rating of STR for any player (70).

                          http://www.fbgratings.com/members/ra...php?genpos=OLB
                          I believe I am more with your ratings style, and I wish I could use them in madden 13. I wish we still had a site around that did those ratings for CAPS for past players. There was one that once had a cap for nearly every player who has played in the last quarter century (for instance, Mark Clayton & Duper)

                          Comment

                          • billsmetalbooze
                            Rookie
                            • Aug 2009
                            • 265

                            #14
                            Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                            Originally posted by DCEBB2001
                            Position should NEVER be used to pre-determine STR or any other rating for that matter. If that logic was used, then all WRs/CBs would have STR in the 20s, when clearly there are guys who are much stronger than that.

                            How about instead we let the DATA tell us how strong/fast/agile, etc someone is and just let it be instead of assuming that someone is strong/wesk, fast/slow, etc based on their position.

                            There are several Ks and Ps in the league who can lift more than several RBs out there. The notion of STR being position-determined and specific is a myth in reality.
                            the problem with data (and i assume you're talking combine lift results) is that it can change, especially with regards to strength.

                            young men in their early 20s are not as strong as they can be a few years later. this could be partially physiological and partly a result of pro training, but they get more mass and strength in their mid 20s often.

                            so, what do you do to reflect that? i think that's where subjective "eyeball" tests are the only evidence: does a guy look and play "strong"?

                            it's tough to measure accurately.

                            Comment

                            • Major9
                              Rookie
                              • Jul 2012
                              • 175

                              #15
                              Re: LB with low strength ratings?

                              Originally posted by thebizarrojerry
                              Cmon now, tell me linebackers are not the strongest on the teams? I bet most can bench press more than anyone besides defensive ends or dt

                              Actually offensive lineman can usually bench press more than anyone on the team. Some LB's with strength ratings in the 70's is fine.

                              Comment

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