2018 Chicago Cubs

[WaitTilNextYear]

Been hearing more and more about how awful the Cubs' starting rotation has been and some are starting to implicate Willson Contreras' pitch framing skills (or lack thereof) as a part of the reason why. I just checked BP's stats on him and Willy is 2nd best (behind only Tucker Barnhart) in terms of blocking, but 2nd worst (ahead of only Omar Narvaez) in terms of pitch framing.

Interesting, but I wonder how stable these stats are. Last year, Contreras was middle of the pack in both categories.

[CBoller1331]

I think it could have something to do with the Cubs pitching woes, but for me framing is almost as much on the pitcher to hit his spot as it is on the catcher to make it look good. It's not very often your going to get a borderline call when you miss across the plate (heck, sometimes we see pitches down the middle not get called cause the pitcher missed by a foot). Tyler Chatwood has been all over the place and when he misses he usually does so by a lot, often making it hard for Willson to even catch/block the pitch let alone frame it.

As for how consistent framing metrics are, I believe that while he was in Milwaukee Jonathan Lucroy was regarded as one of the game's best "receivers" (I believe that's the preferred term...lol) and after being traded he regressed back to the MLB average. I would guess that part of it is due to catching different pitchers and not getting used to their repertoire's. Framing seems like a skill that wouldn't regress with age, so I would guess that it's somewhat random from year to year.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Ex-Cub Jake Arrieta has a higher WAR than any pitcher on the Cubs' roster this season. Sigh

It's July 21st and no Cubs pitcher has hit 1.0 WAR yet.

[Jr.]

Quote: Originally Posted by WaitTilNextYear

Been hearing more and more about how awful the Cubs' starting rotation has been and some are starting to implicate Willson Contreras' pitch framing skills (or lack thereof) as a part of the reason why. I just checked BP's stats on him and Willy is 2nd best (behind only Tucker Barnhart) in terms of blocking, but 2nd worst (ahead of only Omar Narvaez) in terms of pitch framing. Interesting, but I wonder how stable these stats are. Last year, Contreras was middle of the pack in both categories.

They fluctuate pretty drastically. Tyler Flowers had one of the best ever seasons by pitch framing tracking last year and while he's still good, he's outside of the top 10 this year. I wonder if umpires are told about this kind of thing, so they are more aware season to season about catchers trying to steal pitches by framing.

Yadi was always considered one of the best at this, too, and he's middle of the pack this year

[CBoller1331]

Anybody heard anything about Eddie Butler? I know he was placed on the 60-day DL in April but I haven't heard anything about him in awhile and thought of him while pondering about options to start tomorrow's (Monday) game vs Arizona

[Jr.]

Quote: Originally Posted by CBoller1331

Anybody heard anything about Eddie Butler? I know he was placed on the 60-day DL in April but I haven't heard anything about him in awhile and thought of him while pondering about options to start tomorrow's (Monday) game vs Arizona

Doesn't look like he's doing too well in AAA

https://www.cbssports.com/fantasy/ba...g-at-triple-a/

[WaitTilNextYear]

Quote: Originally Posted by Jr.

They fluctuate pretty drastically. Tyler Flowers had one of the best ever seasons by pitch framing tracking last year and while he's still good, he's outside of the top 10 this year. I wonder if umpires are told about this kind of thing, so they are more aware season to season about catchers trying to steal pitches by framing. Yadi was always considered one of the best at this, too, and he's middle of the pack this year

I hadn't considered that. This would be pretty interesting if umpires were tied into that. It might be interesting to see how these numbers hold up over several years for a bunch of catchers. If they don't, then people are either measuring this wrong or what is being measured is much more than just catcher skill.

Quote: Originally Posted by Jr.

Doesn't look like he's doing too well in AAA https://www.cbssports.com/fantasy/ba...g-at-triple-a/

That heroic 7 inning stint in relief down in Miami really messed him up, huh?

[Jr.]

Quote: Originally Posted by WaitTilNextYear

I hadn't considered that. This would be pretty interesting if umpires were tied into that. It might be interesting to see how these numbers hold up over several years for a bunch of catchers. If they don't, then people are either measuring this wrong or what is being measured is much more than just catcher skill

I think it's you're last point. It's a combination of pitchers' being pretty close to the zone consistently and catcher skill. With how much pitching staffs turn over from year to year, it doesn't surprise me that they're are inconsistencies in the data thus far.

This is also still really new, so maybe it gets trimmed over the years.


To a more specific Cubs question. Who is your #1 desired target? Mine is deGrom. I think they should give whatever they need to get him and of the article I posted in the trade deadline thread is any indication, it might not take as much we'd all think. The pitching staff is so erratic, I would love to see deGrom in there to solidify it.


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