Ground Grappling Offense and Defense do not apply to human players

[MC Fatigue]

This is a pretty big problem with the game. Ground Grappling Offense and Defense has NO effect on human players. That is - Human vs Human or Human vs CPU.

I'm inclined to believe that maybe it barely even applies to the CPU...

I made a lightweight and tested him out against BJ Penn... I don't recall Penn's stats - but I believe they're both in the 80's.

My offense and defense? 1 for both - and 41 ground striking.

The results? 3 times in a row - full mount within 1 minute, TKO within 4 minutes.

Once in mount, he was hardly able to roll over and give up his back unless I just timed a punch poorly; then I just flipped him right back over.

I don't know why, but it seems like either the game just gives humans 100 in both automatically (as is proof - online it's not about the fighter, but the player's timing with the transitions. I've held people down the entire round just for fun to see if they could do anything).

Either that - or the stat just doesn't matter at all. I don't see how a 1 rated ground grappler can get full mount on one of the best ground fighters, and TKO him 3 times in a row.

This is a major problem. My suggestion is that next time you do a career, don't even waste points on these two stats - they do nothing.

[Tell22]

I see what you mean Timmay...my CAF in career is easily mounting guys like Forrest Griffin and Machida on Expert...i think its all about timing

[Stumbleweed]

Are you on Expert? I play my career on expert and the better ground fighters pop right out of many positions even when I'm doing nothing but transition blocking. I fought Noguiera with my 50-something rated ground grapple and he demolished me and choked me out in the first round after reversing me once. I wasn't able to keep him from advancing position at all and wasn't able to transition out once he got me into side control -- he just laid on me and I tired myself out then he kimura'd my ***.

I dunno if I'm convinced of this just based on that BJ Penn experience.

It seems to me to matter because I was having a lot of trouble doing reversals (which I'm very good at) with my recent career fighter. Once I increased his ground grapple stats up to 50+, I was able to reverse people more often, and that continued until it felt like normal in the mid 60's-70's range (which makes sense, since most fighters are somewhere in there) and I could reverse anyone basically at will like I can in Exhibition playing the CPU on Expert.

[MC Fatigue]

Quote: Originally Posted by Stumbleweed

Are you on Expert? I play my career on expert and the better ground fighters pop right out of many positions even when I'm doing nothing but transition blocking. I fought Noguiera with my 50-something rated ground grapple and he demolished me and choked me out in the first round after reversing me once. I wasn't able to keep him from advancing position at all and wasn't able to transition out once he got me into side control -- he just laid on me and I tired myself out then he kimura'd my ***. I dunno if I'm convinced of this just based on that BJ Penn experience.

Yes - expert. And the Penn thing was just to test it out. I've played on every weight class and been able to do anything I want on the ground with anyone.

[Stumbleweed]

No idea... that's hasn't been my experience at all. I normally dominate the CPU on the ground still, but it's from playing smart and well-timed reversals more than just being able to transition whenever I want. I'll have fights like that where I absolutely mob some real fighter with my newbie career guy, but others (like that Nog fight, which was in Year 4 or 5 of my career) I am basically screwed if I get taken down or mounted. I think we're basically at the same level on the ground game given what I've read (you're probably better at the game overall judging from your online record), so I don't know why our experiences in career would be so different considering we both play on Expert.

[PrettyT11]

This sounds weird to me as well. I have been able to tell the difference between the higher rated guys and lower rated guys as well in career mode. In my last career in Heavyweight Mir and Nog gave my guy some trouble on the ground as well. Mir was doing reverses and changing positions as well while guys like Vera I was dominating on the ground. And I'm pretty dominate on the ground and have been able to tell the difference in career.

[Stumbleweed]

Yeah, I was fine on the ground until I got Nog -- most of the guys before him were primarily strikers for whatever reason. He owned me and I had some problems with Mir too before being able to reverse him and get the mount. Definitely not as easy as someone like Kongo, who I was able to transition on basically at will.

After the Nog fight, I immediately pumped a bunch of points into ground grapple and submissions and that's why I don't think Mir was as much of an issue. I couldn't reverse Nog at all really and once he got dominant position I was screwed... felt like playing a really skilled player online the way he just flipped it on me and that was the end.

[Wet Bandit]

Yeah, this hasn't been my experience either. I think it's generally too easy to transfer, both offensively and defensively, on the ground, but I've definitely noticed differences in fighters with different skills.