Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

[Pistol44PeteMaravich]

I can't play on All-Star because I find it too easy. I have to play on Superstar or Hall of Fame.

Upping the difficulty does not make the AI play more intelligent basketball. It seems to me it only does two things:

1) Make the AI physically way stronger than you. For example, I've seen Christian Braun (strength 46) outmuscle LeBron (strength 89). They blow past you way too easy, and them setting a screen means they're an unbeatable brick wall leading to:

2) They make too many shots. They barely miss open shots and they'll get plenty of them seeing how strong screens out. Plus, even if you get a hand in their face they can hit contested shots. Meanwhile, you have to absolutely master rhythm shooting on high risk to compete with their FG% and even if you do, the game will randomly move your green window so you don't make too many.

I've put hundreds of hours into this game trying to enjoy a MyNBA experience and I can't because of the two above reasons. There are other issues, fouls never get called, offensive rebounding for the player is non-existent, but I can live with them. The above just means I have to cheese the game to win and I don't enjoy that.

It's fundamentally low IQ game development. I'd love it if the game played in a more intelligent way to force me to think my strategy and prepare before I enter each game. But that's not what happens. The AI is just much, much stronger than me and hits shots I can never make.

I don't want to play on All-Star cause it's too easy. I don't want to use sliders because I haven't liked any I've tried and it feels like cheating otherwise. Why can't 2K just have the brains to make the game more interesting rather than taking the piss by giving the AI physical and shot making advantages the player cannot?

It's doing my head in. I just want to enjoy a basketball game and I can't.

Literally the only enjoyment I've had is on play now online. I have an 89% win record. I'm not bad at the game. But the game development is just trash. I've been playing this game since 2K5 and it feels like an abusive relationship at this point.

[cch99]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

What exactly do you qualify as the ai not being intelligent enough at?

I get it to some degree. Pro is away too easy for me and default all-star is too difficult for me.

Personally I feel like you have to get over the feeling that it’s cheating if you adjust sliders.

I use sliders to try and get to a point where I feel like I win most of the time with teams I should and lose most of time with worse teams. I think that’s how you need to look at it. I’ve only adjusted shooting sliders and fouls and play on All-Star.

I never would have gotten close this year without adjusting sliders. I also use real % so that makes a difference as well . If I don’t lock in I lose 90% of the time.

Beyond that it’s still a video game. I don’t think there is a magic code to make ai more intelligent. Beyond that they can only program so much. Each players skill will dictate how “dumb” the CPU is. If I played on Hall of Fame or superstar I’d get demolished.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[tariq071]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

- Disable staff badges in settings. They stack for you and CPU and can make Ben Simmons play like top level sharpshooter

- Lower down Speed, Agility and Strength on CPU side by 5 to get more balanced results.They will still be able to do their cheese but in much lower frequency. and..that's it

CPU has baked in +5 for Agility, Strength and Speed(and god knows for what else) in every difficulty starting with AS.However that will most likely neuter CPU as it is programmed to take advantage of bonuses and rebounding hidden bonus (which is something like 10+ ,just guessing). They will probably end up in 30's percentage.

- If they still scoring in high percentages 55+ somehow , then lower whichever CPU shooting slider is causing it (ex 3 point) by 2 or more until you are happy.

Btw, once you balance those 4 it doesn't matter which difficulty you are playing on , it comes down to same, AS or HOF.

[sirdez]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

I'm pretty sure the CPU uses rhythm shooting too. Getting them to realistic percentages has probably been my biggest challenge on 25

[sirjam]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

I'm pretty sure the CPU uses rhythm shooting too. Getting them to realistic percentages has probably been my biggest challenge on 25

They definitely do. And hit whites

[Pistol44PeteMaravich]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

I suppose I'd like it if higher difficulty meant more ball movement and smarter decision making as opposed to the same boring plays being run, but the AI is much stronger and faster than you. I want simulation basketball, it's not simulation when much weaker, slower guys IRL are bulldozing through the best defenders in the league.

But honestly the two main gripes for me are:

1) Screens are overpowered and the AI hits too many open shots. Even if I read the screen, it's not always possible to get a hand in the face of the player coming off ball and by my own record taking, the AI shoots 70% from 3pt when left open on Superstar.

I don't want to lower their shooting % because otherwise they'll never hit anything remotely contested. But their wide-open shooting and ability to bulldoze through the paint on Superstar means that keeping them to any realistic FG% is impossible (if anyone has on a regular basis kept the AI to 46% on Superstar or HoF please provide screenshots).

As such I have to out-offense the AI which leads to:

2) Offensive boards for the player are just non-existent. I'm now forced into cheesing the game to get open looks so I can keep up with the AI's ridiculous FG% knowing that I won't ever get a chance at an offensive rebound. FYI, I also think this is because the AI is much stronger and can jump higher than you.

Ultimately higher difficulty = more unrealistic buffs for the AI and I'm saying I wish higher difficulty = more intelligent AI that can run more sophisticated sets and make better decisions.

Iinstead it's just the AI running Floppy plays and hitting 70% from wide open 3PT. You can't leave ANYONE open on this game because mediocre 3pt shooters will turn into Steph Curry.

[Real2KInsider]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

Ultimately higher difficulty = more unrealistic buffs for the AI and I'm saying I wish higher difficulty = more intelligent AI that can run more sophisticated sets and make better decisions.

But that's what higher difficulty is in ANY game.

The enemy units don't get smarter in Call of Duty or other shooters, they just deal more damage and they raise the accuracy.

They don't get smarter in Street Fighter. They deal more damage and have a higher action rate.

They don't get smarter in racing games. They just get faster.

Video games aren't Chess where there are a fixed number of moves and values.

You're asking an AI to understand human sports at a high human level. It will never have that context, not for another 100 years. That's what makes it a "simulation". That word gets thrown around a LOT over the last 20 years in these parts and I feel like a lot of people take it for granted & don't actually know what it means.

1. imitation of a situation or process.

2. the action of pretending; deception.

3. the production of a computer model of something, especially for the purpose of study.

SimNation indeed!

AI stands for "Artificial" Intelligence, HEAVY emphasis on the Artificial. The day we have an AI that can make "Intelligent Basketball Decisions" it's already over for the human race, Skynet took over and Ultron is president.

[Matt23134]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

But that's what higher difficulty is in ANY game.

The enemy units don't get smarter in Call of Duty or other shooters, they just deal more damage and they raise the accuracy.

They don't get smarter in Street Fighter. They deal more damage and have a higher action rate.

They don't get smarter in racing games. They just get faster.

Video games aren't Chess where there are a fixed number of moves and values.

You're asking an AI to understand human sports at a high human level. It will never have that context, not for another 100 years. That's what makes it a "simulation". That word gets thrown around a LOT over the last 20 years in these parts and I feel like a lot of people take it for granted & don't actually know what it means.



SimNation indeed!

AI stands for "Artificial" Intelligence, HEAVY emphasis on the Artificial. The day we have an AI that can make "Intelligent Basketball Decisions" it's already over for the human race, Skynet took over and Ultron is president.

Well said, Real2KInsider.

[Pistol44PeteMaravich]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

I will concede you have a valid point, but I don't think it's unrealistic to expect on higher difficulty the AI would run more complex plays, or pick up on real strategies used in the NBA (I.e maybe they start switching defenders, or run zone defense). These are elements within the game, so I am not asking for anything unrealistic.

I am just personally tired of having to "out-offense" the AI due to them having insane buffs going up to Superstar from All-Star.

But that's what higher difficulty is in ANY game.

The enemy units don't get smarter in Call of Duty or other shooters, they just deal more damage and they raise the accuracy.

They don't get smarter in Street Fighter. They deal more damage and have a higher action rate.

They don't get smarter in racing games. They just get faster.

Video games aren't Chess where there are a fixed number of moves and values.

You're asking an AI to understand human sports at a high human level. It will never have that context, not for another 100 years. That's what makes it a "simulation". That word gets thrown around a LOT over the last 20 years in these parts and I feel like a lot of people take it for granted & don't actually know what it means.



SimNation indeed!

AI stands for "Artificial" Intelligence, HEAVY emphasis on the Artificial. The day we have an AI that can make "Intelligent Basketball Decisions" it's already over for the human race, Skynet took over and Ultron is president.

[sirjam]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

Agreed it shouldn’t be about buffs for the cpu.

[sirdez]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

I feel like 2k have been pretty open that All-Star difficulty gives the most balanced basketball game (which makes sense as its the "middle" setting). If you're finding AS too easy, then you can just start with that as a difficulty base and then adjust sliders to make it more difficult (eg - up the CPU's physicals, perimeter D, lower the effect of your contests etc).

There are a million tools for this. Taking the position that you're not prepared to alter sliders severely limits how the game plays.

[simbayless]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

I feel like 2k have been pretty open that All-Star difficulty gives the most balanced basketball game (which makes sense as its the "middle" setting). If you're finding AS too easy, then you can just start with that as a difficulty base and then adjust sliders to make it more difficult (eg - up the CPU's physicals, perimeter D, lower the effect of your contests etc).

There are a million tools for this. Taking the position that you're not prepared to alter sliders severely limits how the game plays.

The only problem with that is iso stars not aggressive enough like superstar/Hof
And they milk the shot clock by shooting at the last minute even with offense awareness at 100

[sirdez]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

That's weird, I get players driving incessantly even on semi-pro level. I find them too aggressive.

[Pistol44PeteMaravich]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

I feel like 2k have been pretty open that All-Star difficulty gives the most balanced basketball game (which makes sense as its the "middle" setting). If you're finding AS too easy, then you can just start with that as a difficulty base and then adjust sliders to make it more difficult (eg - up the CPU's physicals, perimeter D, lower the effect of your contests etc).

There are a million tools for this. Taking the position that you're not prepared to alter sliders severely limits how the game plays.

Breaking it down, my issue with AS is that I can blow past defenders way too easily. In a way, what "fits" right for me is HoF AI Defense and AS AI Offense. Maybe I should just give the AI HoF defensive sliders and AS offensive sliders. That way I don't feel like I am "cheating" or anything. Plus, then I no longer feel I have to cheese the game for points.

I just wish that Superstar at least was not so full of AI cheese and the AI maybe just moved the ball quicker/was more decisive. I don't think it's too much to ask cause it gets boring when they hold the ball for 10 seconds and then run an off-ball screen that they inevitably hit. Superstar feels best overall OTHER than the AI being brick walls on screens and hitting every open shot.

[MiracleMet718]

Re: Why can't higher difficulty equal more intelligent play?

Breaking it down, my issue with AS is that I can blow past defenders way too easily. In a way, what "fits" right for me is HoF AI Defense and AS AI Offense. Maybe I should just give the AI HoF defensive sliders and AS offensive sliders. That way I don't feel like I am "cheating" or anything. Plus, then I no longer feel I have to cheese the game for points.

I just wish that Superstar at least was not so full of AI cheese and the AI maybe just moved the ball quicker/was more decisive. I don't think it's too much to ask cause it gets boring when they hold the ball for 10 seconds and then run an off-ball screen that they inevitably hit. Superstar feels best overall OTHER than the AI being brick walls on screens and hitting every open shot.

For off-ball screens, just adjust your defensive settings to allow for players to either go above or below the screen dependent on the screen type and it fixes most of those issues. They’ll still get open at times, but nowhere near as much so it’s more balanced.