Does 2k14 pick who wins the game?

[Coach2K]

Quote: Originally Posted by mars5541

Why should it matter if the POE changed if I'm still open? That means no adjustment was made to stop me from getting the open shots in the first place

Let me first start by explaining that I didn't design the game so why it matters is a developer issue. For my part, I am just a user. There will be people who disagree with how I think it works and that's fine.

As far as the POE's go and the defensive settings before them, I think over the last three years or so, I've probably played more games "user v user" on 12 minute quarters, hof, sim sliders than probably anyone in the community. That's A LOT of time. And that doesn't count the number of hours I've studied the HOF CPU play which probably might be more than my user play and probably more than anyone in the community. And I mean really studied it, not just played games against it.

Just a quick note, just so no one gets confused. That doesn't mean that I think that I am the most awesome 2K player, I'm far from it. But - what it does mean is that I understand pretty well what is happening to me on the floor, as good as anyone.

Now there are people that have certainly played tons of quick match that could rival the amount of time I have spent playing 2K but they only play a handful of teams - the Thunder, the Heat etc where I've faced nearly all of the other teams in the league more often than not.

I say that only because I feel the perspective I can bring here is important even if it's not agreed with because of my experience playing the game is pretty extensive, especially against some pretty tough users who play the game how it was meant to be played and that play really good defense on top of that.

I've often read on the forum this problem people have. They get off to a good start, things are going great and then all of the sudden, things change. You work hard to get a clean look doing the same things you were doing before, take the shot and then you can't knock them down anymore. This also applies to going inside all of the time. You were pounding it inside and now you can't score in there.

Why?

My feeling is the defense adjusted. Now it's not the only thing that matters but it does matter in my opinion. Momentum, consistency, who took the shot, who is nearby all also matter. Momentum can overcome settings.

The first mistake that I think people make is thinking that the game is constant from the beginning to end. That an open shot is the same in every situation and that the other side makes no adjustments. But my feeling is that it's not and people do adjust and when they make changes it matters.

When I miss a wide open shot that I normally hit, my first thought is that the POE has been changed to limit shots or key on that person. And, regardless of why I miss that shot, if I am on my game, I immediately move to going inside.

Experience has taught me that the defense changed and the mere fact that it did change affects all shots even if, there is no defense nearby. I know it's not logical to think it works this way, but I've also used this technique with success against other users.

So my hypothesis that a change in defensive settings, CAN affect all players on the floor JUST because it is changed.

Now here's the problem, it doesn't affect every player the same way and just like calling a timeout to stop momentum, changing defensive settings doesn't do it automatically either, you still have to execute.

I first noticed this a while back when the Pacers had Gerald Green. Green was a monster yet Granger was extremely sensitive. Really it didn't matter what defensive changes were made, Green operated at will except in certain situations that I learned when he would miss. Granger however, a better shooter even with the deadeye sig skill would start to miss wide open shots and I couldn't figure out why.

And the answer to me was defensive settings changed on the other side.

But if that's the case, why did defensive setting change not affect Green but affect Granger. That's because the computer didn't recognize Green as a shooter like it did Granger.

I also noticed the same thing occur this year with Orlando Johnson and Solomon Hill to some degree.

People think that shooting is all perfect releases but I don't think it is really. It can be. It is certainly important. Open space is by far the most important. Some superstar players are going to hit everything regardless of the defense and when you play people who know the spots to go to they will hit those shots at a higher degree as well even though they shouldn't. A guy like Durant, he isn't bothered by what you do because he is just so good and guys that aren't rated high aren't either. It's those guys in the middle, like over 80 that get affected more.

That's why people play those teams. Because they are easier to use and not affected as much by defensive changes.

So this isn't a hard and fast rule, but it is a factor. I have hard time reconciling what people can do in quick match with this, but I think this is the single reason I miss shots in quick match more often than not. Often a zone is employed, with the defensive POE to limit my shots and I miss the wide open corner three.

Even though it isn't a hard and fast rule though, you've got to take the information on the floor as a clue to what the defense is trying to take away, read it each time down the floor, act accordingly and do the opposite of what you feel the defense is trying to stop.

[primegamer]

So, the defense changes strategies, and my wide open men go from making every shot to 1 in 7? go from throwing passes across court to wide open person to throwing to a person next to me and him no actually getting the ball?
Come on now. if I'm winning because of how I'm playing, I should keep the same amount of success if the problems that would stop me don't. If I'm loosing because of how I'm playing, I should continue loosing. Why because I have a streak, do I have to miss 10 A- free throws in a row??? wtf why is it an A- then. 1 maybe 2, but literally 9-10 in a row? come on now

[Coach2K]

Quote: Originally Posted by primegamer

So, the defense changes strategies, and my wide open men go from making every shot to 1 in 7? go from throwing passes across court to wide open person to throwing to a person next to me and him no actually getting the ball? Come on now. if I'm winning because of how I'm playing, I should keep the same amount of success if the problems that would stop me don't. If I'm loosing because of how I'm playing, I should continue loosing. Why because I have a streak, do I have to miss 10 A- free throws in a row??? wtf why is it an A- then. 1 maybe 2, but literally 9-10 in a row? come on now

You do have to have recognition to adjust. Basically, what you are saying is I don't want to have to think while I play, I want to be able to the same thing I always do every time down regardless of the defense.

I've never missed that many free throws in row or at least it's rare and what you describe as far as turnovers go can be avoided by recognition. In past forum posts people have asked for turnovers to happen and they built it in as well as missing wide open shots.

Also keep in mind that I didn't design the game. I'm trying to help you understand how to read what's happening. If you don't want to do that you don't have to.

But refusing to adjust just because isn't viable either.

The game is always going to require that as long as theres opponent on the other side who job it is to stop you.

[primegamer]

Quote: Originally Posted by www.Coach2K.com

You do have to have recognition to adjust. Basically, what you are saying is I don't want to have to think while I play, I want to be able to the same thing I always do every time down regardless of the defense. I've never missed that many free throws in row or at least it's rare and what you describe as far as turnovers go can be avoided by recognition. In past forum posts people have asked for turnovers to happen and they built it in as well as missing wide open shots. Also keep in mind that I didn't design the game. I'm trying to help you understand how to read what's happening. If you don't want to do that you don't have to. But refusing to adjust just because isn't viable either. The game is always going to require that as long as theres opponent on the other side who job it is to stop you.

I want it to be realistic. What I DONT want, is for the cpu to say. hmmm.... his opponents are horrible, so let me take away his skill, and give them super human powers.
Imagine a bike race, you're 6 blocks ahead of your opponent for a quarter of the race all of a sudden, they get an engine on their bike and you loose one of your wheels WTF

For the record. If a team adjusts their offense, its because the defense adjusted their defense. If I'm driving the ball to hoop on every play because your entire time is on the outter perimeter. Instead of your team getting in the post, the game just automatically makes me start missing every dunk. Although his defense didn't come closer? yea, I call bull****, on that bull****!

[Rockie_Fresh88]

Quote: Originally Posted by www.Coach2K.com

Let me first start by explaining that I didn't design the game so why it matters is a developer issue. For my part, I am just a user. There will be people who disagree with how I think it works and that's fine. As far as the POE's go and the defensive settings before them, I think over the last three years or so, I've probably played more games "user v user" on 12 minute quarters, hof, sim sliders than probably anyone in the community. That's A LOT of time. And that doesn't count the number of hours I've studied the HOF CPU play which probably might be more than my user play and probably more than anyone in the community. And I mean really studied it, not just played games against it. Just a quick note, just so no one gets confused. That doesn't mean that I think that I am the most awesome 2K player, I'm far from it. But - what it does mean is that I understand pretty well what is happening to me on the floor, as good as anyone. Now there are people that have certainly played tons of quick match that could rival the amount of time I have spent playing 2K but they only play a handful of teams - the Thunder, the Heat etc where I've faced nearly all of the other teams in the league more often than not. I say that only because I feel the perspective I can bring here is important even if it's not agreed with because of my experience playing the game is pretty extensive, especially against some pretty tough users who play the game how it was meant to be played and that play really good defense on top of that. I've often read on the forum this problem people have. They get off to a good start, things are going great and then all of the sudden, things change. You work hard to get a clean look doing the same things you were doing before, take the shot and then you can't knock them down anymore. This also applies to going inside all of the time. You were pounding it inside and now you can't score in there. Why? My feeling is the defense adjusted. Now it's not the only thing that matters but it does matter in my opinion. Momentum, consistency, who took the shot, who is nearby all also matter. Momentum can overcome settings. The first mistake that I think people make is thinking that the game is constant from the beginning to end. That an open shot is the same in every situation and that the other side makes no adjustments. But my feeling is that it's not and people do adjust and when they make changes it matters. When I miss a wide open shot that I normally hit, my first thought is that the POE has been changed to limit shots or key on that person. And, regardless of why I miss that shot, if I am on my game, I immediately move to going inside. Experience has taught me that the defense changed and the mere fact that it did change affects all shots even if, there is no defense nearby. I know it's not logical to think it works this way, but I've also used this technique with success against other users. So my hypothesis that a change in defensive settings, CAN affect all players on the floor JUST because it is changed. Now here's the problem, it doesn't affect every player the same way and just like calling a timeout to stop momentum, changing defensive settings doesn't do it automatically either, you still have to execute. I first noticed this a while back when the Pacers had Gerald Green. Green was a monster yet Granger was extremely sensitive. Really it didn't matter what defensive changes were made, Green operated at will except in certain situations that I learned when he would miss. Granger however, a better shooter even with the deadeye sig skill would start to miss wide open shots and I couldn't figure out why. And the answer to me was defensive settings changed on the other side. But if that's the case, why did defensive setting change not affect Green but affect Granger. That's because the computer didn't recognize Green as a shooter like it did Granger. I also noticed the same thing occur this year with Orlando Johnson and Solomon Hill to some degree. People think that shooting is all perfect releases but I don't think it is really. It can be. It is certainly important. Open space is by far the most important. Some superstar players are going to hit everything regardless of the defense and when you play people who know the spots to go to they will hit those shots at a higher degree as well even though they shouldn't. A guy like Durant, he isn't bothered by what you do because he is just so good and guys that aren't rated high aren't either. It's those guys in the middle, like over 80 that get affected more. That's why people play those teams. Because they are easier to use and not affected as much by defensive changes. So this isn't a hard and fast rule, but it is a factor. I have hard time reconciling what people can do in quick match with this, but I think this is the single reason I miss shots in quick match more often than not. Often a zone is employed, with the defensive POE to limit my shots and I miss the wide open corner three. Even though it isn't a hard and fast rule though, you've got to take the information on the floor as a clue to what the defense is trying to take away, read it each time down the floor, act accordingly and do the opposite of what you feel the defense is trying to stop.

Yeah I get what you're saying now . Weird programming though

[sdtjfjxiao]

Do any of you feel there are some games online where the computer is giving your opponent every break and there's nothing you could do about it. Even Timeouts don't work. This happens to me every time ive played the Heat and Thunder.

[sdtjfjxiao]

Do any of you feel there are some games online where the computer is giving your opponent every break and there's nothing you could do about it. Even Timeouts don't work. This happens to me every time ive played the Heat and Thunder.

[El_Poopador]

Quote: Originally Posted by www.Coach2K.com

Let me first start by explaining that I didn't design the game so why it matters is a developer issue. For my part, I am just a user. There will be people who disagree with how I think it works and that's fine. As far as the POE's go and the defensive settings before them, I think over the last three years or so, I've probably played more games "user v user" on 12 minute quarters, hof, sim sliders than probably anyone in the community. That's A LOT of time. And that doesn't count the number of hours I've studied the HOF CPU play which probably might be more than my user play and probably more than anyone in the community. And I mean really studied it, not just played games against it. Just a quick note, just so no one gets confused. That doesn't mean that I think that I am the most awesome 2K player, I'm far from it. But - what it does mean is that I understand pretty well what is happening to me on the floor, as good as anyone. Now there are people that have certainly played tons of quick match that could rival the amount of time I have spent playing 2K but they only play a handful of teams - the Thunder, the Heat etc where I've faced nearly all of the other teams in the league more often than not. I say that only because I feel the perspective I can bring here is important even if it's not agreed with because of my experience playing the game is pretty extensive, especially against some pretty tough users who play the game how it was meant to be played and that play really good defense on top of that. I've often read on the forum this problem people have. They get off to a good start, things are going great and then all of the sudden, things change. You work hard to get a clean look doing the same things you were doing before, take the shot and then you can't knock them down anymore. This also applies to going inside all of the time. You were pounding it inside and now you can't score in there. Why? My feeling is the defense adjusted. Now it's not the only thing that matters but it does matter in my opinion. Momentum, consistency, who took the shot, who is nearby all also matter. Momentum can overcome settings. The first mistake that I think people make is thinking that the game is constant from the beginning to end. That an open shot is the same in every situation and that the other side makes no adjustments. But my feeling is that it's not and people do adjust and when they make changes it matters. When I miss a wide open shot that I normally hit, my first thought is that the POE has been changed to limit shots or key on that person. And, regardless of why I miss that shot, if I am on my game, I immediately move to going inside. Experience has taught me that the defense changed and the mere fact that it did change affects all shots even if, there is no defense nearby. I know it's not logical to think it works this way, but I've also used this technique with success against other users. So my hypothesis that a change in defensive settings, CAN affect all players on the floor JUST because it is changed. Now here's the problem, it doesn't affect every player the same way and just like calling a timeout to stop momentum, changing defensive settings doesn't do it automatically either, you still have to execute. I first noticed this a while back when the Pacers had Gerald Green. Green was a monster yet Granger was extremely sensitive. Really it didn't matter what defensive changes were made, Green operated at will except in certain situations that I learned when he would miss. Granger however, a better shooter even with the deadeye sig skill would start to miss wide open shots and I couldn't figure out why. And the answer to me was defensive settings changed on the other side. But if that's the case, why did defensive setting change not affect Green but affect Granger. That's because the computer didn't recognize Green as a shooter like it did Granger. I also noticed the same thing occur this year with Orlando Johnson and Solomon Hill to some degree. People think that shooting is all perfect releases but I don't think it is really. It can be. It is certainly important. Open space is by far the most important. Some superstar players are going to hit everything regardless of the defense and when you play people who know the spots to go to they will hit those shots at a higher degree as well even though they shouldn't. A guy like Durant, he isn't bothered by what you do because he is just so good and guys that aren't rated high aren't either. It's those guys in the middle, like over 80 that get affected more. That's why people play those teams. Because they are easier to use and not affected as much by defensive changes. So this isn't a hard and fast rule, but it is a factor. I have hard time reconciling what people can do in quick match with this, but I think this is the single reason I miss shots in quick match more often than not. Often a zone is employed, with the defensive POE to limit my shots and I miss the wide open corner three. Even though it isn't a hard and fast rule though, you've got to take the information on the floor as a clue to what the defense is trying to take away, read it each time down the floor, act accordingly and do the opposite of what you feel the defense is trying to stop.

I really hope this isn't how it actually works, because that's really backwards. It's almost like they couldn't program the implementation of defensive strategies, so they just handicapped the offense when a specific strategy is selected. That's not how it should work at all. Would be nice to get a dev in here to clear up why this happens.