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Old 05-02-2015, 02:22 PM   #1
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PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

Tired of griping about every aspect of this game. Passing, shooting, contact dunks, foot planting. Everything in this game could be drastically improved with a comparable (not perfect) physics system with other sports titles like madden and FIFA. Those games are Lightyears ahead of 2k in the "feel" of the game, regardless of minor complaints with either title.

Let's go 2k. if not by 16, 17 has to have this.
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Old 05-02-2015, 04:14 PM   #2
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Re: PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

This kind of goes along with what I posted in another thread but


Aside from that, lets see some damn tangibility and no warping. Right now there are tons of moments where a play skates on the floor (Like literal ice skating). Things never touch. Players posting each other up, there is always gaps between them. When you block a shot and go into the replay you'll notice your hand never touches the ball. The ball tends to go through players a lot. Players get sucked into each other. There is no tangibility in this game and that has to change. As far as warping goes, that needs to be fixed. Tons of hitchiness by the players and the ball because nothing moves fluid. Nothing makes it more evident than John Walls signature size up. He dribbles with his damn forearms and the ball just warps to his hands
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Bl2OwF3o6k

And one of the jumpshots in the game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-rdbenmJdI

And lets stop this from happening. I get this once every ten games roughly and it's stupid every time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vpk11p1BGug
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDmUyb_-MjY

And lets get some fouls called. This should not be a no call
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-ccNlT9Mg0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKOH0re1jW0

And how about this travel?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLcFrQa7Si8

That would be fine if it wasn't called once in awhile. But several times a game the above happens.

The warping and tangibility issues being fixed would help make this game much better than it is. Seriously takes you out of the experience when you realize there is no contact at all and there are invisible barriers between everything. I've played this game nearly 900 hours so I've noticed a lot of things like this.
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Old 05-02-2015, 04:40 PM   #3
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Re: PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nickthemajin
This kind of goes along with what I posted in another thread but


Aside from that, lets see some damn tangibility and no warping. Right now there are tons of moments where a play skates on the floor (Like literal ice skating). Things never touch. Players posting each other up, there is always gaps between them. When you block a shot and go into the replay you'll notice your hand never touches the ball. The ball tends to go through players a lot. Players get sucked into each other. There is no tangibility in this game and that has to change. As far as warping goes, that needs to be fixed. Tons of hitchiness by the players and the ball because nothing moves fluid. Nothing makes it more evident than John Walls signature size up. He dribbles with his damn forearms and the ball just warps to his hands
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Bl2OwF3o6k

And one of the jumpshots in the game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-rdbenmJdI

And lets stop this from happening. I get this once every ten games roughly and it's stupid every time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vpk11p1BGug
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDmUyb_-MjY

And lets get some fouls called. This should not be a no call
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-ccNlT9Mg0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKOH0re1jW0

And how about this travel?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLcFrQa7Si8

That would be fine if it wasn't called once in awhile. But several times a game the above happens.

The warping and tangibility issues being fixed would help make this game much better than it is. Seriously takes you out of the experience when you realize there is no contact at all and there are invisible barriers between everything. I've played this game nearly 900 hours so I've noticed a lot of things like this.
The animation where the guy gets tackled, has to try to throw the ball over his head, and there's no foul call is definitely ridiculous. The other videos you posted, in my opinion, are nit-picking. You'll see a lot of weird things in any video game if you slow it down and go frame by frame.

Some of the clipping issues are frustrating, but I also understand the necessity of some clipping to help facilitate smoother, dare I say more realistic, gameplay. If the average game consisted of 20+ turnovers by both teams because the ball was jarred loose from every minor contact, it would be an ugly, frustrating experience. There are so many subtle movements that go into handling/protecting the ball in real life that just simply can't be mapped to a controller, and CPU AI still isn't at a level where I would want these kinds of subtle movements to be automated. People already complain about the "skipping" animation the ball handler can go into. Imagine if you had the computer doing things like that all the time, and constantly trying to pick out the best animation to protect the ball.

Now, if a pass goes right through my body, that's a problem. If I'm in good defensive position and the offensive player phases through half my body, that's a problem. But subtle hitches and foot shuffling during/between animations are the very least of my worries. That's just something that's going to occur in video games. They don't effect the outcome of a play in any way. They're just a little perplexing visually.
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Old 05-02-2015, 04:59 PM   #4
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Re: PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokes404
The animation where the guy gets tackled, has to try to throw the ball over his head, and there's no foul call is definitely ridiculous. The other videos you posted, in my opinion, are nit-picking. You'll see a lot of weird things in any video game if you slow it down and go frame by frame.

Some of the clipping issues are frustrating, but I also understand the necessity of some clipping to help facilitate smoother, dare I say more realistic, gameplay. If the average game consisted of 20+ turnovers by both teams because the ball was jarred loose from every minor contact, it would be an ugly, frustrating experience. There are so many subtle movements that go into handling/protecting the ball in real life that just simply can't be mapped to a controller, and CPU AI still isn't at a level where I would want these kinds of subtle movements to be automated. People already complain about the "skipping" animation the ball handler can go into. Imagine if you had the computer doing things like that all the time, and constantly trying to pick out the best animation to protect the ball.

Now, if a pass goes right through my body, that's a problem. If I'm in good defensive position and the offensive player phases through half my body, that's a problem. But subtle hitches and foot shuffling during/between animations are the very least of my worries. That's just something that's going to occur in video games. They don't effect the outcome of a play in any way. They're just a little perplexing visually.
I noticed John Walls dribbling problem the first time I used him. The second I flicked up to get him in his signature dribble I realized something felt wrong. And when I slowed it down I realized that he dribbles with his forearms. There really is no excuse for something that common like dribbling on superstar level player to always be messed up like that.

And how about the no basket dunks?
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Old 05-02-2015, 07:07 PM   #5
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Re: PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

If there's gonna be animations in the game, then they have to be refined a lot...

Like I see people teleporting half way across the paint to suck me into a reach animation. *this is the most annoying to me, because it stops a free bucket and rewards steal mashing*

Getting sucked into block animations, a lot of times because of 2K picking the worst kind of dunk or layup in situations.
Conversely, getting sucked into poster animations. *especially annoying when you're in perfect defense to protect the rim*

On defense, there's a ton of bumping going on on-ball. Basically half those animations would be called blocking fouls...and half the time you can suck a ballhandler into your d by either pressing LT or X for a steal...when in reality it should be an easy blow by..
But they also need to make it where on ball defense is faster than the ballhandler considering it's slower to move with a ball in your hands. (but this is a whole separate topic)

Passes that bring your guy to a complete stop on a fast break.

Running full speed and seeing you're about to get stuffed on a chasedown so you suddenly just completely stop and stand in the paint while the defender's flying by...that's garbage. You can't just stop on a dime fullspeed.

Ever see someone dead to rights on a block while taking a bad shot only to get a double jump Mario Bros style and pass out of it? That needs to be an instant turnover or travel.

There's so many ways to break physics in 2K, break the laws of gravity..and whether or not people online are doing it to be cheesy or just doing it because it's a normal thing to do in the game...it's not realistic and needs to go.
I play a lot of park and rec and see things like this every single game multiple times. I'm always wondering why it's so easy to do such unnatural things and I think the game would benefit from even more realism.
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Old 05-02-2015, 07:49 PM   #6
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Re: PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

The last time 2K Sports introduced live ball physics, it was a complete fail. It was NBA 2K12 pre-patch.
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Old 05-02-2015, 08:41 PM   #7
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Re: PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

He's not talking about live ball physics he means actually weight height and player model physics.

The thing about this is we've been asking for it for years. Only one person has even commented on it and it was Mike Wang in which he basically said NBA 2k isn't ready for a real physics engine. Pretty much because they would have to do everything from scratch since everything in this game is based on animations.

Yesterday I was playing Rec Center and I literally pressed steal when a guy was going for a dunk and instead of my guy reaching he goes up for a contact dunk animation trying to block the shot.

THIS is the problem with 2k and has been forever. I have no control over my player. Ever. The game will decide what animation they want me to use on any given situation at any time. It's ruining the game. It would be cool if they had actual physics to wear if I reach when a guy is going for a dunk I actually slap his leg and reacts as if I slapped his leg. Not suck me into a block animation. There's a button for blocks and if I don't press it my guy shouldn't try to block the shot. It makes no sense for this game to be so heavily controlled by animations that you'll they'll call a reach in foul anytime you get the reach around the back animation. It's frustrating to play.

Also the animations where the defender attempts to draw a charge only to get dunked on or over, or have the guy lay the ball up around him. I didn't press the charge button. Why is my guy going for the charge? And when I actually do press the charge button my guy slides completely out of bounds. 2K needs to fix this. The ball should also be tangible but that's something that will take a lot more work.

But if I go up for a block there's no way a guy should just move me out the way. There should be body to body contact that you can actually see and anticipate. Not that stupid 'Im trying to dunk on you but you're in the way so I'm gonna throw the ball out of bounds or in the hoop' animation. It's sad we have to keep bringing this up.

Great post.
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Old 05-02-2015, 09:02 PM   #8
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Re: PHYSICS. PHYSICS. PHYSICS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 24ct
He's not talking about live ball physics he means actually weight height and player model physics.

The thing about this is we've been asking for it for years. Only one person has even commented on it and it was Mike Wang in which he basically said NBA 2k isn't ready for a real physics engine. Pretty much because they would have to do everything from scratch since everything in this game is based on animations.

Yesterday I was playing Rec Center and I literally pressed steal when a guy was going for a dunk and instead of my guy reaching he goes up for a contact dunk animation trying to block the shot.

THIS is the problem with 2k and has been forever. I have no control over my player. Ever. The game will decide what animation they want me to use on any given situation at any time. It's ruining the game. It would be cool if they had actual physics to wear if I reach when a guy is going for a dunk I actually slap his leg and reacts as if I slapped his leg. Not suck me into a block animation. There's a button for blocks and if I don't press it my guy shouldn't try to block the shot. It makes no sense for this game to be so heavily controlled by animations that you'll they'll call a reach in foul anytime you get the reach around the back animation. It's frustrating to play.

Also the animations where the defender attempts to draw a charge only to get dunked on or over, or have the guy lay the ball up around him. I didn't press the charge button. Why is my guy going for the charge? And when I actually do press the charge button my guy slides completely out of bounds. 2K needs to fix this. The ball should also be tangible but that's something that will take a lot more work.

But if I go up for a block there's no way a guy should just move me out the way. There should be body to body contact that you can actually see and anticipate. Not that stupid 'Im trying to dunk on you but you're in the way so I'm gonna throw the ball out of bounds or in the hoop' animation. It's sad we have to keep bringing this up.

Great post.
Exactly. There should be no sucking, no sliding, no morphing...

Animations are necessary...at least right now. There's no way 2K's gonna just create a new engine without animations that would be nearly impossible. But having your player do all these things when you're trying to do something completely different is the most annoying thing in the whole game.

If they can at least get body to body contact right, I couldn't complain. Blocking/charging fouls, contesting shots, and playing on ball d are all things that can be extremely changed by that..and removing all them poster dunks and strip animations would be a big move in the right direction.
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