What Exactly makes it where a player just walks off their man?

[hanzsomehanz]

Quote: Originally Posted by phriscaul

i'm all for being proactive. but in almost every case, the AI over-help. in real basketball, you show halfway so you can recover if need be. in 2K, not only do the rotate 100%, but they sometimes sprint over before the player has fully made their move and this is what really screws us lol. what they need is a read and react system altogether, in the entire damn game. I'd rather see a guy rotate halfway, and stay on his toes waiting to see how the play develops and THAT inform how he defends the play than the full sprint rotate leaving the guy wide open.

A legit read and react system 👍

This current help defens programing is not leveraging NBA team defense (basketball) AI LOGIC

Once we have help defense fundamentally addressed we can then start seeing meaningful differences inn help side effectiveness based on IQ - some sleepy and some alert.

How well the player recovers to close out or rushes out to assist a defender should also reveal their athleticism - some quick and some sluggish.

I rather see a legit system or no read and r3act system at all.. this current programming is not a legitimate read and react system. I want to be taken back believing, "okay, that was a legitimate help defense assist". Right now it's the same scripted asinine routine course of action.

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[phriscaul]

Quote: Originally Posted by nuckles2k2

I agree man. I wouldn't mind seeing late rotations in that last scenario you mentioned. That's where defensive awareness/IQ would come in. The better defenders understand the unit concept, & the weaker defenders act like every assignment is it's own island & they over-commit. I've watched it w/ Melo for years.. I would love to see guys not rotating, over-rotating, & rotating appropriately. Variety & accurate representation of what occurs on the court. Basically.. basketball. I like the read & react idea too, but it seems like we're years away from that.. for some reason..

i think we're years away simply bc 2K ignores nuance to cater to the low-hanging fruit. or maybe they don't even understand the nuance at all, which is fine...but hire somebody that does(although i dont consider rotations and read&react, nuance). They focus on things like celebrations after dunks and Ronnie2K style sweaters for park smh.


example of nuance(offensive but albeit the same)....when you run a play or PnR, often, a big will end up wide open. A LOT of the time, they end up open behind the 3 pt line. now i play myteam and i use players from the 90s frequently(Karl Malone is my go-to). When you pass the ball to him on a fade or if he's open, he doesn't automatically step into his range so when you pass him the ball, he's in a high % scoring opportunity for his skillset......he sits his *** at the 3-pt line and you have to manually do it and by that time, the opportunity is gone. smh.

another example of nuance....i'd LOVE some sort of footwork technology added to the game. All of us have had to manually close out on a defender and sprint for our lives to get to the guy....in real basketball, you close out with hands high and slow down as you reach the opposition to protect the drive. in 2K, you literally will sprint past the guy or run into him....because 2K.

We are years away from REAL 'sim' basketball....but bc i think 2K lacks the know-how. Some of these changes are changes that EA makes to FIFA each year, and since it's one of their flagships, they pay close attention to detail every year and bring something new every year. 2K hasnt actually ever done this. they've only added play sets and a couple new animations smh

[Dyslexicphish]

I wonder why they never tried to remedy this. It has been a problem the whole year. I even made a topic about it all the way back in November. If they can change something like how the dribble system works to eliminate speed boosts then why can't they tweak this. It is such a fundamental problem with the game that I'm surprised it wasn't addressed.

[jeebs9]

Quote: Originally Posted by Dyslexicphish

I wonder why they never tried to remedy this. It has been a problem the whole year. I even made a topic about it all the way back in November. If they can change something like how the dribble system works to eliminate speed boosts then why can't they tweak this. It is such a fundamental problem with the game that I'm surprised it wasn't addressed.

I think it was changed because of user that don't know about help defenders. Because think about the general user. Probably doesn't make any adjustment to his team or defense. And he'll just keep letting drivers and rollers into lane.

I think they should keep as is for default. But gave us more control of how the cpu reacts to defensive breakdowns.

[jfsolo]

Quote: Originally Posted by Dyslexicphish

I wonder why they never tried to remedy this. It has been a problem the whole year. I even made a topic about it all the way back in November. If they can change something like how the dribble system works to eliminate speed boosts then why can't they tweak this. It is such a fundamental problem with the game that I'm surprised it wasn't addressed.

The are some things that are aspects of a larger system that simply can't be fixed in a patch. When it wasn't fixed in the big gameplay patch last year it was clear to me that it was something that couldn't be addressed until 2K17.

Quote: Originally Posted by jeebs9

I think it was changed because of user that don't know about help defenders. Because think about the general user. Probably doesn't make any adjustment to his team or defense. And he'll just keep letting drivers and rollers into lane. I think they should keep as is for default. But gave us more control of how the cpu reacts to defensive breakdowns.

IMO, it would a terrible idea to keep it as is by default, it is fundamentally flawed in 2K16, and defense is actually made more exploitable by simply repetitive offensive play calls, which is something that is even harder for casual Users to combat. The wandering into the paint defender has to have been excised. It was one of their biggest gameplay mistakes ever.

[de_jesus]

Quote: Originally Posted by jeebs9

I think it was changed because of user that don't know about help defenders. Because think about the general user. Probably doesn't make any adjustment to his team or defense. And he'll just keep letting drivers and rollers into lane. I think they should keep as is for default. But gave us more control of how the cpu reacts to defensive breakdowns.

I agree with this. I don't mind the rotation when someone comes off a big when I have offball D set to moderate, but leaving KD alone in the corner when offball is set to tight is infuriating. I'd much rather give the lane by having my man sag off a smigden than have KD wide open because my player sprinted to the restricted area and got burned on a kickout.

I also wish Points of Emphasis mattered in this context. If I say limit perimeter shots THEN DON'T GIVE UP EASY SHOTS TO PROTECT THE BASKET. That is a tradeoff I'm willing to make for some teams. If I'm playing the Grizzlies, sure come off the wing and protect the rim, but if I'm playing the Warriors I'm setting it to limit shots on the perimeter. Stay with your man but leave room to not get burned on a cut (tight / tight / limit perimeter shots)

I don't want an overhaul. Just a bit more control.

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[phriscaul]

Here's what they need in 2k17, as i doubt any of our actual concerns will be met.


They need an actual tutorial on what each setting does and how to optimize your defense using these settings. IF these settings do not work as intended and a large % of the community feel there needs to be some sort of tweaking, then they should adjust...early and often. Much like they did shooting this year. Defense is too crucial and I just really dislike where it is in this game. In MyTeam, I had dedicated lineups for defense. I've abandoned those bc, ultimately, defense doesn't even matter anymore. It's literally about trying to outscore your opponent as opposed to out-thinking your opponent.