What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

[harryl]

1. Relentless Finisher

The in-game description of Relentless Finisher says:

A Relentless Finisher can take physical punishment on contact shots near the rim without severely impacting his energy.

There seems to be a popular opinion that Relentless Finisher buffs probability of completing contact dunks, not just simply lose less Energy from the contact. Has anyone ever seen or tabulated anything that would make the case, either way, in a definitive way?

The screen when people earn the HoF Relentless Finisher for their MyPlayer does seem to support the popular opinion:

Your ability to flush on defenders is now on par with some of the greatest dunkers in NBA history.

This text actually seems to imply better completion rate through contact, and also specifies dunking, versus layups.

But I think one can earn this in MyCareer with contact layups, which would imply that it activates on all contact finishes at the rim (dunks and layups).

So my guess is that it helps with completion rate of contact finishes at the rim, regardless of whether that's by dunk, layup, or "difficult" layup. And it blunts the energy drain that comes from the contact.

If so, then it's a key badge to have on any player who will frequently attempt dunks, period. Especially if they'll frequently attempt layups in traffic as well.

2. Acrobat

The game description is:

Can change his shot in air and attempt difficult shots with few consequences.

And the HoF text in MyCareer is:

You're now on par with some of the greatest layup artists in NBA history.

My read on this is that it helps by boosting the completion rate of layups of three types: change-shot layups, reverse layups, and eurostep layups.

But it will not help with contact layups, per se, which is the domain of Relentless Finisher.

Anyone have definitive insight on these two badges?

3. Difficult Shots

Bonus question if you're still reading: I think we all know that Difficult Shots will help with moving shots off the dribble. Jumpshots. So: stepback jumpers, sidestep jumpers, standing fadeaways, leaners.

But does it help with moving jumpshots out of post position? E.g.: post-fadeaways, hop-step post-fades, post-stepbacks, and hoping post-stepbacks?

[PleadtheFoe5th]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Good questions, I'd like to know as well!

[benuetzer]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

3. Difficult Shots

Bonus question if you're still reading: I think we all know that Difficult Shots will help with moving shots off the dribble. Jumpshots. So: stepback jumpers, sidestep jumpers, standing fadeaways, leaners.

But does it help with moving jumpshots out of post position? E.g.: post-fadeaways, hop-step post-fades, post-stepbacks, and hoping post-stepbacks?

this! i also want to know this... how about post action shots?

[Rockie_Fresh88]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Difficult shots doesn't help with post actions. It has popped up for layups and dunks that are contested. But it's mostly for moving shots.

Acrobat does help with difficult layups, euro steps , etc...

Relentless finisher is more about lower the frequency at which your energy gets drained when attempting contact layups /dunks . It almost seems like an answer to bigs with bruiser.

[hanzsomehanz]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Difficult Shots will activate for me in post play be it the fade away or the hop step shot out of the fade. I can all trigger this badge in the paint on certain dunks and layups. This is from experience with my Shot Creator who has it on HOF and Playmaker who has it on Bronze.

Acrobat. This one will also trigger on spin layups.

Relentless Finisher. A badge more so for finishing against any type of contact in the paint on the way to the rim.

Bruiser can also help you offensively when driving to the Tim against contact and in the post.


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[Rockie_Fresh88]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Difficult Shots will activate for me in post play be it the fade away or the hop step shot out of the fade. I can all trigger this badge in the paint on certain dunks and layups. This is from experience with my Shot Creator who has it on HOF and Playmaker who has it on Bronze.

Acrobat. This one will also trigger on spin layups.

Relentless Finisher. A badge more so for finishing against any type of contact in the paint on the way to the rim.

Bruiser can also help you offensively when driving to the Tim against contact and in the post.


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Cool didn't know that Difficult shots can trigger on post play . That's good to know

[benuetzer]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

I wonder especially when doing a post hop shot fade away from the rim. Such a nice and strong move. But I don't know what do you need at best. Shooting close? Shooting of the drive? Post fade? Difficult shot badge? Just wondering because I also have a post scorer Center for park, and shot close is quite low for this archetype

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[cablexdeadpool]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

I wonder especially when doing a post hop shot fade away from the rim. Such a nice and strong move. But I don't know what do you need at best. Shooting close? Shooting of the drive? Post fade? Difficult shot badge? Just wondering because I also have a post scorer Center for park, and shot close is quite low for this archetype

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I think Shot Close and Contested Shot Midrange...

[hanzsomehanz]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

I wonder especially when doing a post hop shot fade away from the rim. Such a nice and strong move. But I don't know what do you need at best. Shooting close? Shooting of the drive? Post fade? Difficult shot badge? Just wondering because I also have a post scorer Center for park, and shot close is quite low for this archetype

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Ya, I don't have any strong finding on this one.

I know you need post fade for post fade but beyond that? I know Difficult Shots badge will indeed boost your scoring chances on certain post moves such as the fade. I know this with hard evidence because it triggers for me in Career and Park when I attempt these shots.

I don't know for certain however if Mid Range rating has an influence or partnership with post scoring on the mid range and Shot Close has an influence of partnership on shot close post shots?

My two Guards with Difficult Shots do not have post scoring upgraded so I have yet to actually experience how well the two can work together. I didn't bother to upgrade the Post Scoring on the Shot Creator because he is so weak in the strength department at like 55 and lower.

A Sharpshooter with Post Scoring inn 70s plus Mids in the 90s plus HOF Mid Range Deadeye plus Difficult Shots on bronze with 70s for strength might possibly be very OP for Perimeter post players. A Post Scorer with Difficult Shots on bronze should notice an improvement maybe in consistency alone.

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[harryl]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Thanks for the replies. Glad that I'm not the only one who gets a little crazy wondering about this. If this were a MyPlayer thing, I'd just grind for it all. But in MyTeam, we have limited slots for adding badges to players and it's always a big dilemma.

Difficult Shots: Thanks HandsomeHanz for the reply. I think others have said it does not trigger off stuff like post fades. I thought it might. That it would...actually drives me a little crazy, because now I think it's an essential badge for post-up bigs who will take high volume of post-fades and post stepbacks. Whereas, before, I thought they could just let it go because I won't take moving midrange shots with them. I.e., no stop and turn and fade jumper with Arvydas Sabonis. BUT...I will take post-fades with him, and that's such a critical part of the post arsenal.

Not that I have any reason to doubt you, Hanz, but I guess I'll try to play some games with someone like DeMar or Carmelo with the Difficult Shots badge and post up for post-fades and such and see if I can capture video of it activating.

Acrobat: Okay, it seem consensus that this buffs mid-air change layups, eurosteps, spin layups, and reverse layups. And not just layups period. So I guess I don't have to worry about adding this to big men, so much, as they are mostly going to be taking standing layups and "straight" driving layups. But this makes all kinds of sense for slashers, particularly if they'll attempt a lot of eurosteps and spin layups.

Relentless: Still wish there were conclusive evidence that this buffs completion % through contact at the rim, and not just reduces energy drain. But it seems like that's consensus opinion. This would be supported by the fact that it's perpetually one of the most expensive badges on the Auction House in MyTeam, much more precious than Acrobat.

[hanzsomehanz]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Definitely try it out for your own observations.

The blacktop court vs CPU is also possible. I know some guards have Difficult Shots but not sure about bigs.

Looking forward to your findings

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[BigRussianBoss]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

If we will go to history (Signature Skills 2k13, 2k14) - we will see "Finisher"

"This player is adept at finishing contact layups and dunks at a higher rate than others. There is a shot penalty that all offensive players receive when they make contact with defenders in the air. Finishers decrease this shot penalty by 30%. This skill combined with our existing Draw Foul Tendency lends itself well to creating and-one opportunities." — NBA 2K13

"With this skill, the shot penalty for absorbing body contact during a shot attempt is reduced by 10% is perfect for players who skilled at finishing with contact. The story usually goes like foul, shot counted and one free throw to seal it off." — NBA 2K14

"Takes physical punishment on contact shots near the rim without severely impacting his energy." — NBA 2K17

[NoLeafClover]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Wouldn't it be nice if the actual company who creates the game would explain this, instead of leaving it up to the community to try and guess for several years straight?

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[harryl]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Definitely try it out for your own observations.

The blacktop court vs CPU is also possible. I know some guards have Difficult Shots but not sure about bigs.

Looking forward to your findings

In MyTeam, the nice thing is that we can add basically any badge to any player. (Still should do it logically, of course...hence all the hand-wringing over these badges.)

So I played a couple of games with lineups that allowed me to have at least one guy with Gold Difficult Shots on the floor at any time.

What I saw was very consistent...

Difficult Shots Does Not Activate With:

- Post Fades
- Post Stepbacks

Difficult Shots DOES Activate With:

- Post Hop Fadeaways
- Post Hop Stepbacks

Basically, for the most part, if I made one of the Post Hop shots, Difficult Shots would activate.

I never had it activate with Post Fades or Post Stepbacks.

And I think that the Post Hop shots use Off-Dribble Mid instead of Post Fade as at least their primary rating. Or, at least, it seemed that guys like Shaun Livingston and Jarret Jack were just as good at the Post Hop shots as guys like Bernard King, Kiki Vandeweghe, and DeMar DeRozan...none of whom are elite at Post Fades, but markedly better than Livingston and Jack.

If it's true that Off-Dribble Mid is the main determining rating for Post Hop shots, then there's not so much of a dilemma regarding whether or not to badge up a Center with Difficult Shots. I don't know of any that have good Off-Dribble Mid ratings.

As a side note, I definitely saw Relentless Finisher activate with at least one contact layup.

[Rbk360]

Re: What exactly do Relentless Finisher and Acrobat and Difficult Shots do?

Acrobat: Okay, it seem consensus that this buffs mid-air change layups, eurosteps, spin layups, and reverse layups. And not just layups period. So I guess I don't have to worry about adding this to big men, so much, as they are mostly going to be taking standing layups and "straight" driving layups. But this makes all kinds of sense for slashers, particularly if they'll attempt a lot of eurosteps and spin layups.

This is not *quite* true. Any type of contact layup triggers acrobat for me as a big. I did notice a slight difference in the bronze acrobat boost.

Also, semi off-topic but tear dropper triggers on my big mans contested layups (think the animations that trigger when you try to go for a contact dunk without momentum and end up doing some layup/one handed post shot kind of thimg). Something you might be interested in looking at as well.