Test: Dribble Penetration

[Kushmir]

Yeah man I put it down a month ago. It was easily the best 2K in terms of fluidity and some of the intuitive elements they tried to implement with shooting, passing and and it has the usual advance in overall gameplay.

But in regards to dealing with legacy issues (paint passing ,double team, long pass, block and steal spam) its easily my worst 2K experience in years. On top of that, the defensive blog was overpromising/under-delivering in its purest form. PNO took 5 steps backwards with the myriad of loopholes it had--chief among them the game-breaking utterly ridiculous belief that everyone has the skillset to get to the rim.

I can't put into words how badly dribble penetration was done. Listening to people trying to defend it is laughable....those of you with reading comprehension issues please note: the premise has always been that DP was once-size-fits-all....wasn't balanced well and didn't have consequences...not that it should be impossible.

Please get a clue.

[alabamarob]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kushmir

Yeah man I put it down a month ago. It was easily the best 2K in terms of fluidity and some of the intuitive elements they tried to implement with shooting, passing and and it has the usual advance in overall gameplay. But in regards to dealing with legacy issues (paint passing ,double team, long pass, block and steal spam) its easily my worst 2K experience in years. On top of that, the defensive blog was overpromising/under-delivering in its purest form. PNO took 5 steps backwards with the myriad of loopholes it had--chief among them the game-breaking utterly ridiculous belief that everyone has the skillset to get to the rim. I can't put into words how badly dribble penetration was done. Listening to people trying to defend it is laughable....those of you with reading comprehension issues please note: the premise has always been that DP was once-size-fits-all....wasn't balanced well and didn't have consequences...not that it should be impossible. Please get a clue.

I have never played a pno game, so i cant speak on that. On HOF, I think the dribble penetration defense is decent. However, i do think that:

1. The ball should be more tangible when driving into a defender.
2. The speed dribble rating should have a bigger effect on the ballhandlers. To many players are able to dribble thru and around defenders.
3. MORE CHARGES SHOULD BE CALLED.
4. They should just add a penetration rating that control the ability to trigger the blow by or hip ride animation.
5. Poor ball handlers should get stone walled when dribbling into another person.
6. USERS SHOULD HAVE TO MANUALLY SWITCH THE BALL FROM ONE HAND TO ANOTHER. THERE SHOULD BE NO AUTO CROSS OR AUTO HAND SWITCH.

So i agree that the dribble drive game could use some work. But, i think the issue is the ballhandler not the defenders.

[Hustle Westbrook]

Quote: Originally Posted by UnbelievablyRAW

The game is mostly fine in H2H in PNO. This issue is really only prominent in MyTeam where the game modes are on All-star and player ratings are inflated. Having a young Kobe or Penny start a hip ride on you by running straight into your defender, then dunking on both you and your help big because his dunk tendecny is like 95 makes the game boring as hell to play. It just turns into people running into defenders until they trigger an animation that will give them enough space to do animation dunks over and over again. In PNO, players are much slower and its easier to stop that BS from happening although it still can happen from time to time. I haven't lost a game yet in PNO yet (only played 30 games though) I lose about 10-20% of my games in Myteam because some games the penetration spam is unstoppable Edit: This is what I'm talking about in MyTeam. The game sliders online allow you to just run directly into people and the game often moves defenders out of the way almost automatically to favour the offense. This forces you to have to heavily sag players, and with the inflated 3pt ratings, people can just pull up for open 3's.

This is my EXACT issue with MyTeam. There seems to be some sort of force field around offensive players that pushes you away from them. Completely frustrating.

[VAWereWolf65]

Quote: Originally Posted by The 24th Letter

He's talking from an online stand point particularly Play Now Online. I dont feel any different from when the thread was originally made TBH. There definitely needs to be a balance, but going back to suction defense isnt the answer. It's essentially the other extreme. Whether it was intentional or not, 2k has stripped away some of the things you could do to counter this along the way unfortunately..

Well that’s where problems begin to arise. I feel like if anyone who works at 2k were to see this thread, their instinct would be to go back to the original “suction” defense that was in 2k17. If not, then they’d probably go back to some version of the brick wall/no penetration defense

[The 24th Letter]

Quote: Originally Posted by VAWereWolf65

Well that’s where problems begin to arise. I feel like if anyone who works at 2k were to see this thread, their instinct would be to go back to the original “suction” defense that was in 2k17. If not, then they’d probably go back to some version of the brick wall/no penetration defense

Hopefully thats not the extreme they take.

I would prefer more of a 2K16ish type balance

I just wish they wouldnt have messed with layup success and loose ball this year. You had to at least think a lot more about driving into a crowded paint when the game first dropped IMO..

[alabamarob]

Quote: Originally Posted by The 24th Letter

Hopefully thats not the extreme they take. I would prefer more of a 2K16ish type balance I just wish they wouldnt have messed with layup success and loose ball this year. You had to at least think a lot more about driving into a crowded paint when the game first dropped IMO..

You think layups are too easy?

[harryl]

Quote: Originally Posted by UnbelievablyRAW

The game is mostly fine in H2H in PNO. This issue is really only prominent in MyTeam where the game modes are on All-star and player ratings are inflated. Having a young Kobe or Penny start a hip ride on you by running straight into your defender, then dunking on both you and your help big because his dunk tendecny is like 95 makes the game boring as hell to play. It just turns into people running into defenders until they trigger an animation that will give them enough space to do animation dunks over and over again.

Yeah, anyone who has been playing MyTeam knows how Penny was/is almost unguardable and how dismayingly effective mindless spamming of drives was/is.

He can be stopped, but it takes an elite, burly wing sort of a defender to do this well. And the problem is, to go back to what Kushmir has been saying, there is not enough risk to go along with the very high odds of reward.

Cheesy players will take guys like Penny, T-Mac, LeBron, and just spam turbo drives. They can do this three or four times in a single possession. And while they can be stopped entirely, or at least limited to a contested layup, the problem is that this takes perfect or near-perfect on-ball defense. Meanwhile, they can attempt their drives with basically no real skill and the likelihood of losing the ball is extremely low, so there's no real risk to their drive spamming.

Any considerable slip-up in defense and the driver gets an easy dunk or layup. It's pretty hard to play near-perfect on-ball defense possession after possession, defending multiple drives per possession. It has been pretty classic to run into cheeseballs who literally just try to drive with Penny and Rex Chapman or whomever over and over and over again, all game long. And in MyTeam, there is no real letup in the tactic, because when T-Mac gets tired, then here comes Penny, or LeBron, or Giannis, or whomever.

Also in MyTeam, one cannot really use help defense on drives. Because players have full control over their lineups and can have 3-point shooting threats at all other four positions. So if your Center goes into the paint to stop the drive, then say hello to the wide-open three-point bomb from Boogie or Brook Lopez, or even Thon Maker.

But this problem being especially a problem in MyTeam is just classic MyTeam gameplay balance issues. Probably less of an issue elsewhere, though I'm sure it's a general issue in online PvP play.

I don't have any strong feeling about how to balance things out, but I do wish that MyTeam online PvP were set at Superstar, like PNO.

[Gideon TruthChaser]

Great Post