Block Timing still needs lot of work

[Kushmir]

Quote: Originally Posted by El_Poopador

But that sacrifices realism, which should not be the end goal. Here are two quick examples I found of the things you don't want to happen in the game happening in real life.

LOL...in data we refer to that as the extreme minority report. You're literally finding the outcomes that happen least often and saying "Hey, lets build a system based on this." This is Tiburon putting the Tyree and OBJ catch in Madden gameplay and having them occur 3x per game. I can find highlights (which are terrible evidence btw) showing Dwight Howard hitting 3pters....should that REALLY be a factor in gameplay? Or something that happens so rarely it barely deserves mention?

Shouldn't we focus systems on things that happen most often? And then maybe design it so those outcomes happen but are super rare? Isn't this how we get non-shooters consistently hitting from deep?

Here's Howard hitting a 3pter btw. Watch how his teammates react...kinda gives you an example of how often it should occur.

[El_Poopador]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kushmir

LOL...in data we refer to that as the extreme minority report. You're literally finding the outcomes that happen least often and saying "Hey, lets build a system based on this." This is Tiburon putting the Tyree and OBJ catch in Madden gameplay and having them occur 3x per game. I can find highlights (which are terrible evidence btw) showing Dwight Howard hitting 3pters....should that REALLY be a factor in gameplay? Or something that happens so rarely it barely deserves mention? Shouldn't we focus systems on things that happen most often? And then maybe design it so those outcomes happen but are super rare? Isn't this how we get non-shooters consistently hitting from deep? Here's Howard hitting a 3pter btw. Watch how his teammates react...kinda gives you an example of how often it should occur.

I never said it should be the norm, or that it happens all the time. I'm simply saying that it shouldn't be a foregone conclusion that just because a player bites on a fake, he is out of the play.

My point is that the way the offensive player reacts to a player jumping needs to be fixed, whether it's the pass animation, or something as simple as pulling the ball back in so it doesn't hit the defender's elbow. If they can get those little things right, it will balance itself out while still keeping the outcomes realistic.

[Kushmir]

Quote: Originally Posted by El_Poopador

My point is that the way the offensive player reacts to a player jumping needs to be fixed, whether it's the pass animation, or something as simple as pulling the ball back in so it doesn't hit the defender's elbow. If they can get those little things right, it will balance itself out while still keeping the outcomes realistic.

Hmmm...this I can definitely get behind. But I still think the core of H2H play is still rewarding players for fooling the other user. I think you never go wrong focusing on that. But sure, I think most reasonable people are ok with say double jumps as long as the outcomes are skewed accurately. The problem now is that they're waaaaaaay off.

[El_Poopador]

Quote: Originally Posted by Kushmir

Hmmm...this I can definitely get behind. But I still think the core of H2H play is still rewarding players for fooling the other user. I think you never go wrong focusing on that. But sure, I think most reasonable people are ok with say double jumps as long as the outcomes are skewed accurately. The probably now is that they're waaaaaaay off.

That I agree with. They just need to focus more on these underlying issues for 2K20 than what new minigame to add to the Neighborhood.

[triplechin]

I agree the jumping is wild. I like your posts you bring some good analysis imo and I hope the 2k devs are looking at them

[awg811]

I agree that double jump blocks are definitely possible irl. But, 99% of the time it’s a good defender that pulls them off, not a 6’3” pure sharp pg. Even the best defenders are only going to be successful at them, maybe, 30% of the time.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[Kushmir]

The lack of Accountability on bad timing is far, far from fixed...but i've seen some promising interactions lately.







Those are obvious instances, but fouls in those situations are so rare.

I do have to stress however, that the defender missing and being out of the play should be the most frequent outcome. Obviously we want to see more fouls from bad timing but not everytime someone mistimes. As long as the outcome punishes the defender its acceptable.

[Kushmir]

On the other hand here's a great animation of the defender's momentum taking him out of the play after mistiming the block.