For Realism with dribble moves. Size ups can't be One Button Helper Moves

[splashmountain]

For Realism with dribble moves. Size ups can't be One Button Helper Moves like it always is every year.

Do you 2k dribblers understand this? Or do you not care?

People talk about how great 2k's dribbling system is. but in reality a lot of the fancy dribbling you see is a combination of tape the right stick in one direction or another. i'm not talking about actually moving the stick where the ball is supposed to go to perform these moves. i'm talking what you call a one movement Macro button.

those who dont know what a macro button is. its when you perform a few moves with your controller and you save those moves to one button on that controller.

you guys may or may not know this but thats what the size up moves are. when you only have to tap the stick up and watch your guy go thru a series of moves without you touching anything else.

To ME. for realisim and competition/stick skills sake. Everyone should have to control their own Size ups from the star to the finish.

what makes size ups unique is not the basic dribble move done. its HOW its done. harden with the slow low cross pitter patter.
everyone does a cross over. but everyone doesnt do the slow pitter pater to set people up.

2k and even the other game could make it so that when using certain nba players or when choosing certain dribbling animations. it only applies to FORM, or HOw you dribble. but it doesnt put in certain dribble combos in for you. if you want to see that move done like he does it during the game. you have to perform those moves with the right stick. just when you're doing it, you will have harden's posture with the ball and/or how low he dribbles vs another guy that may do a similar move but dribble much higher with the ball further out.

I hate watching quote un quote, dribble gawds, just spamming the different size up moves and not actually doing those moves themselves. if they had to do those moves it would mean they would have to know when to trigger them and how to use them to their advantage. but it would take time meaning I would also have a better chance of countering if i know what i'm doing on defense. again, this is how you setup the foundation for more realism as you guys keep hearing me say in other threads.

[loso_34]

Quote: Originally Posted by splashmountain

For Realism with dribble moves. Size ups can't be One Button Helper Moves like it always is every year. Do you 2k dribblers understand this? Or do you not care? People talk about how great 2k's dribbling system is. but in reality a lot of the fancy dribbling you see is a combination of tape the right stick in one direction or another. i'm not talking about actually moving the stick where the ball is supposed to go to perform these moves. i'm talking what you call a one movement Macro button. those who dont know what a macro button is. its when you perform a few moves with your controller and you save those moves to one button on that controller. you guys may or may not know this but thats what the size up moves are. when you only have to tap the stick up and watch your guy go thru a series of moves without you touching anything else. To ME. for realisim and competition/stick skills sake. Everyone should have to control their own Size ups from the star to the finish. what makes size ups unique is not the basic dribble move done. its HOW its done. harden with the slow low cross pitter patter. everyone does a cross over. but everyone doesnt do the slow pitter pater to set people up. 2k and even the other game could make it so that when using certain nba players or when choosing certain dribbling animations. it only applies to FORM, or HOw you dribble. but it doesnt put in certain dribble combos in for you. if you want to see that move done like he does it during the game. you have to perform those moves with the right stick. just when you're doing it, you will have harden's posture with the ball and/or how low he dribbles vs another guy that may do a similar move but dribble much higher with the ball further out. I hate watching quote un quote, dribble gawds, just spamming the different size up moves and not actually doing those moves themselves. if they had to do those moves it would mean they would have to know when to trigger them and how to use them to their advantage. but it would take time meaning I would also have a better chance of countering if i know what i'm doing on defense. again, this is how you setup the foundation for more realism as you guys keep hearing me say in other threads.

you're fighting a losing battle man this community doesnt want a realistic game. that maybe how you guys at OS think but the kids who buy VC and play my career all day dont want to shoot 30% they dont want to have to protect the ball or chain different moves.

I go on reddit and occasionally read stuff like, " we need less RNG". this is a community that doesnt care about ratings i cant wait until mike introduces this layup meter they are going in the direction of timing over ratings.

[coolcras7]

Quote: Originally Posted by splashmountain

For Realism with dribble moves. Size ups can't be One Button Helper Moves like it always is every year. Do you 2k dribblers understand this? Or do you not care? People talk about how great 2k's dribbling system is. but in reality a lot of the fancy dribbling you see is a combination of tape the right stick in one direction or another. i'm not talking about actually moving the stick where the ball is supposed to go to perform these moves. i'm talking what you call a one movement Macro button. those who dont know what a macro button is. its when you perform a few moves with your controller and you save those moves to one button on that controller. you guys may or may not know this but thats what the size up moves are. when you only have to tap the stick up and watch your guy go thru a series of moves without you touching anything else. To ME. for realisim and competition/stick skills sake. Everyone should have to control their own Size ups from the star to the finish. what makes size ups unique is not the basic dribble move done. its HOW its done. harden with the slow low cross pitter patter. everyone does a cross over. but everyone doesnt do the slow pitter pater to set people up. 2k and even the other game could make it so that when using certain nba players or when choosing certain dribbling animations. it only applies to FORM, or HOw you dribble. but it doesnt put in certain dribble combos in for you. if you want to see that move done like he does it during the game. you have to perform those moves with the right stick. just when you're doing it, you will have harden's posture with the ball and/or how low he dribbles vs another guy that may do a similar move but dribble much higher with the ball further out. I hate watching quote un quote, dribble gawds, just spamming the different size up moves and not actually doing those moves themselves. if they had to do those moves it would mean they would have to know when to trigger them and how to use them to their advantage. but it would take time meaning I would also have a better chance of countering if i know what i'm doing on defense. again, this is how you setup the foundation for more realism as you guys keep hearing me say in other threads.

That was Live's thing, 2k gives you the freedom to chain moves together, but it also give you the ability to do signature size up moves particualr to certain players, i perfer it the way it is. If I am playing with Kyrie Irving i want to feel like I am playing with him and having skills specific to him helps with the imersion, NBA Elite was sold on hey you have full control and it failed because no one wants full control if it makes the game generic.

[splashmountain]

Quote: Originally Posted by loso_34

you're fighting a losing battle man this community doesnt want a realistic game. that maybe how you guys at OS think but the kids who buy VC and play my career all day dont want to shoot 30% they dont want to have to protect the ball or chain different moves. I go on reddit and occasionally read stuff like, " we need less RNG". this is a community that doesnt care about ratings i cant wait until mike introduces this layup meter they are going in the direction of timing over ratings.

i dont want to see 30% shooting either. unless a defender makes me shoot 30%.

see there is Sim and there is what i call Nerf to Sim. some sim people think since the game's foundation was never developed for realism to begin with, just nerf certain things to bring down the percentages to match real life. and that will make for a realistic game because the stats produced will almost always resemble a realistic game's stat line. Thats not the school i'm in. I'm in the lets make it Real Real. meaning, you dont nerf anything. you dont over power anything. you allow each individual thing work on its own as it should. then when these things cross one anothers path make that realistic to how it works in real life.

I wont miss layups at the rim with no one there i dont care what your stats say about layups in the paint. those stats are only gathered during games. which means sometime the player is open and sometime they're not. so whatever in paint percentage you get is partially based on people guarding you. what happens if i'm playing a dumb team that refuses to guard the paint. should i still only average 60% in the paint just cause thats what the real life stats say about paint scoring? NO. i should be around 98% until some defenders MAKE me shoot worse. TRUE REALISM.

If you go the TRue realism route, the stats will eventually pan out to more realistic games once everyone gets a hang of it on offense and defense.

[splashmountain]

Quote: Originally Posted by coolcras7

That was Live's thing, 2k gives you the freedom to chain moves together, but it also give you the ability to do signature size up moves particualr to certain players, i perfer it the way it is. If I am playing with Kyrie Irving i want to feel like I am playing with him and having skills specific to him helps with the imersion, NBA Elite was sold on hey you have full control and it failed because no one wants full control if it makes the game generic.

what you just said makes no sense.

You said nba elite was sold on full control and it failed because no one wants full control it makes it generic.

NBA elite failed because its animations were HORRIFIC. where it excelled was in TOTAL CONTROL. Yes some of us want TOTAL control even if it's hard. some of you dont because its super difficult to figure out and it takes time to practice. you can't just hop in and spam something and watch your guy play like the nba player of choice.

again, if i want to do the james harden size up. I watch enough baskeball to know exactly what he does and when he explodes to the basket or hits people with step backs.
2k SHOULD put james' posture in a dribble package, and put his style in there. meaning if he makes his cross overs quick but high, or wide and low(Allen Iverson.) Then ME the user can do the same moves from start to finish on my OWN. i dont need 2k giving me 4 moves in one up stick move. that is so CPU controlled its not even funny.

What you like is for the CPU to HELP you. I dont want the CPU's help at all with this kind of stuff. You were probably born and raised on the cpu helping you so thats all you know. I know better so I want better. and I know this aint for everyone . But it should be for so called PRO players. there is nothing PRO about you spamming the size up moves without you having to do a quarter of the actual dribbling work since 2k's cpu is doing most of the moves for you.
Remember what i said earlier. 2k wants their game to at times LOOK realistic. not actual PLAY realistic. from a distance you will see the moves and think wow he just broke dues ankles. not realizing he didnt have to do much but tap up once and to the side twice. and it went thru a 15 step dribbling animation sequence. 3 stick moves = 15 moves. L o L. you didnt make him fall. the CPU did.

See a lot of this started with play now players going from trying to really guard you man v man to intentionally ducking you by switching off the defender to make the cpu do all the hard work. That mentality has been brought into the my player world(pro am/Jrec-walk on/park).

There was something satisfying about ELITE when you would make a nice dribble combo move and you shook a defender. you knew... "I DID THAT".

YOu knew, you made the dude lean one way and think you were going another to hit him with another move and back again. ALL YOU. it just looked like trash because the animations were horrible.

I've said many times NBA ELITE was so far ahead of its time with the dribbling just with awful animations overall.

[jetsman92]

People say they want realism all the time but that's truly not the case... Because realism =\= fun most of the time... Do you want it to be more skill based? Sure... I'll roll with that... But tbh realism in sports games has become a buzzword that "sim heads" use all the time in most arguments vs the "casuals"... It's a videogame at the end of the day and replicating everything in real life isn't always that easy to do

[ForeverVersatile]

Quote: Originally Posted by splashmountain

For Realism with dribble moves. Size ups can't be One Button Helper Moves like it always is every year. Do you 2k dribblers understand this? Or do you not care? People talk about how great 2k's dribbling system is. but in reality a lot of the fancy dribbling you see is a combination of tape the right stick in one direction or another. i'm not talking about actually moving the stick where the ball is supposed to go to perform these moves. i'm talking what you call a one movement Macro button. those who dont know what a macro button is. its when you perform a few moves with your controller and you save those moves to one button on that controller. you guys may or may not know this but thats what the size up moves are. when you only have to tap the stick up and watch your guy go thru a series of moves without you touching anything else. To ME. for realisim and competition/stick skills sake. Everyone should have to control their own Size ups from the star to the finish. what makes size ups unique is not the basic dribble move done. its HOW its done. harden with the slow low cross pitter patter. everyone does a cross over. but everyone doesnt do the slow pitter pater to set people up. 2k and even the other game could make it so that when using certain nba players or when choosing certain dribbling animations. it only applies to FORM, or HOw you dribble. but it doesnt put in certain dribble combos in for you. if you want to see that move done like he does it during the game. you have to perform those moves with the right stick. just when you're doing it, you will have harden's posture with the ball and/or how low he dribbles vs another guy that may do a similar move but dribble much higher with the ball further out. I hate watching quote un quote, dribble gawds, just spamming the different size up moves and not actually doing those moves themselves. if they had to do those moves it would mean they would have to know when to trigger them and how to use them to their advantage. but it would take time meaning I would also have a better chance of countering if i know what i'm doing on defense. again, this is how you setup the foundation for more realism as you guys keep hearing me say in other threads.

What you're asking for is already in the game and has been there for years. There are various dribbles that each player has using the RS. Signature size up's are just and easier way to bring signature like moves to the game without having to motion capture each individual dribble in that one move.

Live has dribble system you're looking for. 2K had a similar system in 2K12-13 I believe.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app

[Keith01]

Quote: Originally Posted by splashmountain

what you just said makes no sense. You said nba elite was sold on full control and it failed because no one wants full control it makes it generic. NBA elite failed because its animations were HORRIFIC. where it excelled was in TOTAL CONTROL. Yes some of us want TOTAL control even if it's hard. some of you dont because its super difficult to figure out and it takes time to practice. you can't just hop in and spam something and watch your guy play like the nba player of choice. again, if i want to do the james harden size up. I watch enough baskeball to know exactly what he does and when he explodes to the basket or hits people with step backs. 2k SHOULD put james' posture in a dribble package, and put his style in there. meaning if he makes his cross overs quick but high, or wide and low(Allen Iverson.) Then ME the user can do the same moves from start to finish on my OWN. i dont need 2k giving me 4 moves in one up stick move. that is so CPU controlled its not even funny. What you like is for the CPU to HELP you. I dont want the CPU's help at all with this kind of stuff. You were probably born and raised on the cpu helping you so thats all you know. I know better so I want better. and I know this aint for everyone . But it should be for so called PRO players. there is nothing PRO about you spamming the size up moves without you having to do a quarter of the actual dribbling work since 2k's cpu is doing most of the moves for you. Remember what i said earlier. 2k wants their game to at times LOOK realistic. not actual PLAY realistic. from a distance you will see the moves and think wow he just broke dues ankles. not realizing he didnt have to do much but tap up once and to the side twice. and it went thru a 15 step dribbling animation sequence. 3 stick moves = 15 moves. L o L. you didnt make him fall. the CPU did. See a lot of this started with play now players going from trying to really guard you man v man to intentionally ducking you by switching off the defender to make the cpu do all the hard work. That mentality has been brought into the my player world(pro am/Jrec-walk on/park). There was something satisfying about ELITE when you would make a nice dribble combo move and you shook a defender. you knew... "I DID THAT". YOu knew, you made the dude lean one way and think you were going another to hit him with another move and back again. ALL YOU. it just looked like trash because the animations were horrible. I've said many times NBA ELITE was so far ahead of its time with the dribbling just with awful animations overall.

True, less CPU the better. Question is can 2K pull it off to make the moves still appear as signature movement. Think I remember reading an article in the past where they said it's a struggle to balance signature moves with more user control.