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Old 04-14-2013, 01:48 PM   #385
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

I forgot to add that double teams are at 0 for both teams.

@bigtreydawg, Shaq was doubled team on set plays even with Rodman at 89. I will adjust some ratings to see how often a mismatch will occur.
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Old 04-14-2013, 01:56 PM   #386
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtreydawg
So even when you corrected the sliders the defense was still winning outright? 90% of the time? Without venturing into the can of warms that is attack tendencies and roster edits? Did the ball handler optional choose to pull back or was he bumped hard and lost his dribble?

Edit: which perimeter guy has an 80?

When I'm editing ball handling attributes there is a clear picture in my mind of a young Shaq running the fast break as a ballhandler and getting a dunk in transition. He crossed over Raef Lafretz in an All star game. These guys are the best in the world, please give them 90s. Even the white people get a 90, at least. Lol

Ill take it a step further, I'm sure that I would have a 90% success rate of getting fluidly to the rim against Antwan Jamison. I would get swatted every time. But I would make it there without getting bumped so hard that I pick up my dribble. I may even be stripped on my way to attempting a lay up. But the point is I made it around my defender.

This is why every guard and small forward should be pushing max for ball handling.
He was bumped physically back as the defense beat him to the intended spot everytime, so the ballhandler was either forced to spin to the opposite hand or do a stepback to avoid a charge. This is with ball handlers like Hinrich (80 ballhandler) against Teague (75 defense). And Teague (95 ballhandler) against Nate Robinson (75 defense). Even Harris (90 ballhandler) against Bellinelli (75 defense).

After the first I bumped up the Ball Handling slider 2 clicks without touched the onball defense and the same thing was still occurring.

Interesting to note I was able to generate defense contact with onball d at 55 for the big men and I saw more blow past animations....

UGH. MORE TWEAKING!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyperballer21
I have been doing some testing with 98 Bulls and 98 Lakers about POST PLAY. Here are my opinions and what I feel we should attempt to accomplish.

Pro difficulty.

I put Shaq and MJ at 99 Post Offense during this test.

Rodman, Wennington, and Longley had 74, 69, and 64 in post def, respectively. Everyone else had 49 post def.

All Lakers perimeter players had 49 post def.

Lakers had a starting line up of Van Axel, Fisher, Jones, Fox, and Shaq to space the floor for Shaq.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am trying to find the MINIMUM Post Off and Post Def point differential in which Shaq will command a double team in the post.

So far, even with Rodman at 74 PD and Shaq at 99 PO, Rodman is still being helped out when Shaq post him up.

Will continue editing as I find out more.
To help you with this I found that the computer would double team Josh Smith in the post if he had Boozer on him. Smith has a 70 post offense and Boozer has a 45 in post defense.

They also doubled Boozer once (who I gave a 90 in post offfense) along the baseline when Josh Smith was guarding him (70 post defense). He took a fadeaway jumper away from the double team but it clanked. The second time he tocuhed the ball no double team came and he took another fadeaway post jumper. That clanked too.

Ugh. Just found out both teams had 75 in double team from the coaching profiles. UGH.

I'm probably going to universally lower the on-ball defense down to a 65. Lower the good defenders down to a 70. And have the great defenders rated a 75 because 75 still gives the defense several "win" animations it seems.

If the previous theory of the Ballhandling and On Ball D being 30 means a win for the ballhandler I'm going to be so mad.

So far in the 1st quarter I'm seeing some promising things. Boozer tried to face up on the elbow against Smith and as soon as he tried to drive Teague stripped him of the ball. Very nice.

Last edited by DukeC; 04-14-2013 at 02:14 PM.
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Old 04-14-2013, 02:17 PM   #387
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Duke, those results are too strange to just be related to ball handling, your roster is your roster and I want no say in how you have your sliders but can you think of contributing factors as to why a 95 ball handler is being cold cocked by a 75 defender.

Low inside shooting tendency

Low attack tendency

Offensive awareness

High circus dribble tendencies as opposed to simple drive

Last edited by bigtreydawg; 04-14-2013 at 02:21 PM.
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Old 04-14-2013, 02:20 PM   #388
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

FINALLY (Still 1st quarter)! Deng tried to drive on Korver. Korver being the terrible defender he is (55 on-ball D and 60 Def Awareness) tried to stop him going baseline (like I said. Terrible). Deng simply spun the other direction to go back middle. He then attempted to go up strong with a layup but Horford came over and sent it back to mid court.

That cushion you guys talked about earlier? It was there as Korver was 2 feet back from him. What's important to note here is that the CPU was actually able to start a layup animation because Korver gave him that much space. With the 100 in Driving Contact I believe Korver was still able to make contact and force Deng into a semi contested layup allowing Horford the time to come over and swat it.


Edit: Hrmm. Even with the On-Ball defense at 65 the defense is getting too many wins IMO. Too many crossovers that don't go anywhere laterally.

Last edited by DukeC; 04-14-2013 at 02:27 PM.
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Old 04-14-2013, 02:45 PM   #389
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtreydawg
Duke, those results are too strange to just be related to ball handling, your roster is your roster and I want no say in how you have your sliders but can you think of contributing factors as to why a 95 ball handler is being cold cocked by a 75 defender.

Low inside shooting tendency

Low attack tendency

Offensive awareness

High circus dribble tendencies as opposed to simple drive

Have you seen the Offensive Awareness effect the dribbling before?

As for the 2nd, no. They all simply try to blow past their man (with the exception of Josh Smith who was trying to get fancy a couple of times ), but the defender beats them to the spot and the defender simply "wins".

Wooh. I just saw another "win" for the offense. Stevenson (70 on ball defense) tried to rip it from Bellinelli (80 ballhandling 43 security) who protected the ball, did a jab step, and blew right past the now out of position Stevenson for a clear lane to the rim. Horford managed to slide over and contest the shot just enough to where Bellinelli misses it and then Stevenson gets the defensive rebound.

Last edited by DukeC; 04-14-2013 at 02:51 PM.
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Old 04-14-2013, 02:46 PM   #390
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

We need to add structure to the thread and/or designate people to work on certain areas. Right now, we have a team of people (THANK YOU!!!) who are dedicated to testing. If we develop a priority list, such as:

1. Fast Break
2. Offensive Tempo
3. Ball Handling/On Ball Defense
4. Low Post Offense/Low Post Defense
5. Low Post Fadeaway/Low Post Hook Success

etc, we can focus on different areas of the game, gather data, develop conclusive definitions, and provide key knowledge to parts of the game to help roster makers give the community an even better product. Once we find who is willling to test what, we can have a group PM conversation about it with me, bigtrey, and whoever else wants to be a part of it. Then we can post the findings in the thread. It's WAY too cluttered right now. If we don't get some structure, we run the risk of people walking away from testing.

That being said, we already have definitions for Attack the Basket (on-ball tendency that effects driving to the basket), Drive the Lane (off-ball tendency that effects cutting/rolling to the basket), Triple Threat Shot (on-ball tendency that effects mid-range and 3PT shots. I am going to work on testing the Pull Up Tendency. I know it's an on-ball tendency, but I want to determine what areas of the court it is activated in and how touchy it is.

Please pick an area of testing by posting what you are going to experiment with and begin a PM group discussion by adding my name and bigtrey's name to the recipients field. If we receive more people who want to work on that area, we'll add their names to the discussion as well.
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Old 04-14-2013, 02:53 PM   #391
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Quote:
Originally Posted by DukeC
Have you seen the Offensive Awareness effect the dribbling before?

As for the 2nd, no. They all simply try to blow past their man (with the exception of Josh Smith who was trying to get fancy a couple of times ), but the defender beats them to the spot and the defender simply "wins".
Offensive awareness does a plethora of things, but mostly it makes a defender more aware of where the ball is. This is why you see more blocked shot from people with high offensive awareness. But I through that out there without really having a solution.

What is your quickness slider at?
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Old 04-14-2013, 02:56 PM   #392
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

I saw another "win" for the offense. Teague was pushing the ball up court after the defense rebound and Boozer, who was slow getting back tried to stop him with a forearm, only for Teague to continue dribbling past him as he dipped his shoulder. It was perfect matador defense by Boozer.
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