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Old 04-26-2013, 12:40 AM   #713
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Bigtrey are u Still using 0 pull up and atb along with edits
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:23 AM   #714
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

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Originally Posted by jbreeze21
Bigtrey are u Still using 0 pull up and atb along with edits
I use both, pull up can't really go higher than 30 for scorers like Kobe, Dwayne and Parker but players like Rip Hamilton and Allen can have it as high as 50 before it becomes an issue.

And the only time I had attack at 0 was for testing purposes. That is a very important slider for controlling w/ball aggression.

Last edited by bigtreydawg; 04-26-2013 at 10:04 AM.
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Old 04-26-2013, 03:19 AM   #715
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

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Originally Posted by bigtreydawg
Guys, it has been a pleasure testing this game with all of you.

With the new Sim World Roster coming out this Friday (fingers crossed) I plan on going full hermit and applying everything I've learned here to the new Roster.

QPC123 you are a genius and I look forward to playing your retro roster

Serra11 you are so Italian it hurts.lol. Thank you for all your input.

Hype and Sellaz, thanks for popping in and dropping knowledge.

And SLIMM, you make my head hurt. Take care of yourself, friend.

I guess this thread can be left open for questions and testing but I know the direction I want to take with the edits I'm about to implement.

I promised a lot of things that I never got around to but once I get deep into the details I'll cook up a few blogs on floor spacing and playcalling.

Thanks everyone for enduring all of that nonsense.
But you are going to at least release a guideline or roster even with your edits aren't you?
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Old 04-26-2013, 04:53 AM   #716
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

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Originally Posted by bigtreydawg
I'm beginning to think that the inside shot tendency has an effect on whether a player will drive.

With drive the lane at 0 there was signifacantly more 3pt attempts but with it at 100 Miller and Allen would catch the ball the ball and instead of spotting up for their shot they would drive. They would get bumped and they would pass away. This particular scenario happened 4 times in freelance with ample time in the shot clock.

I was careful to only gage situations where the offensive was not being pressured by time constraints.

With ball movement as good as it is now that the freelance tendencies jive so well, I fear my opinions are becoming more subjective.

DTL at 100 makes everyone run the break (off ball), so the pushing from the ball handler is just him getting swept up in the momentum of the action.

Same with pick and rolls, right. Maybe the ball handler is attacking more because the roll man did a great job of drawing the defense away.

I'm gonna do another test but this time with Chalmers as the one on with drive the lane at 100. If he turns into a ball hog this should be good evidence.

Thanks for the coach profile test.

I think the game "rides the hot hand" to a small extent when it comes to play calling.

Hornececk did not get an unrealistic amount of plays called for him and Malone was still very much involved in the offense.

I think raising Stockton's touch tendency resulted in more pick and rolls between him and Malone and since that is considered a play being called for Malone the game was ok with giving Hornececk extra looks.

Don't wear yourself out lol. What do you want to tackle next? Fast break is really interesting to me because its been really consistant the entire time we've been messing with drive the lane.

We both noticed how it tends to "shut off" right before a shot goes up.

Lets see if we can establish a low Tempo Heat team that gets 20+ on the break and still plays decent.

I've been moving offensive tempo to either 0 or 50 for testing purposes and I can say for sure 0 is bad. Way too many close calls with the shot clock leading to spin cycle followed by bad shot. But I think 50 may be too high for the Heat.

Since I now feel comfortable that lowering the coach profile inside and close sliders only affects shot attempts from that location, I really feel like I'm on my way to getting great stats and gameplay without sliders. But I imagine when we're done with this we can say this is a legit coach profile for the Heat. I imagine we'll differ a bit since you have midrange and what not turned up in your in game sliders.

If this has already been considered my apologies. I just stumbled upon this thread and have yet to read through it completely. But given shot tendencies exist both in the coaches profile and under player tendencies, couldn't the 2 work together. For example...Say you take a coach who favors the inside game over the outside.

Could this...1. Encourage players to take inside shots regardless of personal shot/hot spot tendencies? and/or 2. Discourage players with low outside tendencies from firing from deep every chance they get?

You know how you get players in real life who aren't considered 3pt specialists attempting a larger number of them under a coach with a "let it fly" mentality like a Don Nelson than they would under a George Karl-esq drive 1st type? I'm really having trouble finding a name to go with these scenarios but I've seen it play out plenty of times. It even happens with base-stealers in baseball.

Coaches preference or style can dictate a lot. Even a player's production. Which leads me to the last part of my theory. What if the tendencies in the coach's profile, which should reflect his team's play style preference (in the perfect sim world), dictated the type of players the team's front office went after in Association? I mean this would take a massive edit to test, but it'd be cool to discover if it were exactly what would happen.

Last edited by elimack; 04-26-2013 at 04:57 AM.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:24 PM   #717
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Player shot location tendencies dictate how often/willing a player will shoot from that location when inside that location. Obviously the higher the number the more likely they will shoot.

Now coach shot location tendencies alter player location tendencies either (+ or -), with 50 being neutral (no alterations to player tends).

So if you want a team to shoot a particular shot more than others (say to make a 3pt heavy team) you would need to jack the 3pt coaching slider way up. So that when the player gets the ball behind the 3pt line they will shoot.

With the gameplay sliders altering rating 1.5 points per 1 click, it is likely that the coaching sliders alter at the same rate. With that said, raising the 3pt coaching slider to 75 (25 point increase from 50) would increase everyone's 3pt shot location tendency by 37.5-38.0 points. So a 50 3pt tendency would now be a 87-88.
  • Roster ratings + tendencies = gameplay.
  • Coaching sliders alter roster tendencies (per team).
  • Gameplay sliders alter roster ratings (attribute section) and tendencies. (all players)
A coaching profile with all sliders at 50 would make no adjustments to the players tendencies and allow the players to play off theirs only.

So a edited roster = best thing to do first, then coaching profiles to match coaches gameplan/style, then gameplay sliders IF NEEDED, they shouldn't be needed with a fully edited roster/coach profiles.
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Old 04-26-2013, 12:40 PM   #718
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Drive the Lane tendency, this dictates whether a player will drive or shoot "spot up" after receiving a pass (other factors play in; hotspot, shot tend, etc). The higher this number the more likely the player is to drive instead of "spotting up" for the shot.

Pull Up or Penetrate, similar to above, except this for when the player is already dribbling/driving, this determines whether the player will pull up for a shot off the 'drive' or continue to penetrate.

Attack or Pass Out, kicks in after the drive has been completed, this determines whether the player will go hard at the rim (attack/try to score) or kick out after the drive. Again this should be base 100, as having both ATT and PO at 90 would tell the CPU that they are a 50/50 chance of happening.

Drive/Spot -> Pull Up/Penetrate -> Attack/Pass
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:17 PM   #719
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonWilliams55
Drive the Lane tendency, this dictates whether a player will drive or shoot "spot up" after receiving a pass (other factors play in; hotspot, shot tend, etc). The higher this number the more likely the player is to drive instead of "spotting up" for the shot.

Pull Up or Penetrate, similar to above, except this for when the player is already dribbling/driving, this determines whether the player will pull up for a shot off the 'drive' or continue to penetrate.

Attack or Pass Out, kicks in after the drive has been completed, this determines whether the player will go hard at the rim (attack/try to score) or kick out after the drive. Again this should be base 100, as having both ATT and PO at 90 would tell the CPU that they are a 50/50 chance of happening.

Drive/Spot -> Pull Up/Penetrate -> Attack/Pass
Not to reopen the whole can of worms discussion again...but wasn't it determined that drive the lane was an off ball tendency that affects what the player does on fast breaks and off pnr... It's only logical given that spot up is off ball and is considered its opposite.
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Old 04-26-2013, 02:13 PM   #720
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Re: Tempo-Freelance-RunPlays

Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonWilliams55
Drive the Lane tendency, this dictates whether a player will drive or shoot "spot up" after receiving a pass (other factors play in; hotspot, shot tend, etc). The higher this number the more likely the player is to drive instead of "spotting up" for the shot.

Pull Up or Penetrate, similar to above, except this for when the player is already dribbling/driving, this determines whether the player will pull up for a shot off the 'drive' or continue to penetrate.

Attack or Pass Out, kicks in after the drive has been completed, this determines whether the player will go hard at the rim (attack/try to score) or kick out after the drive. Again this should be base 100, as having both ATT and PO at 90 would tell the CPU that they are a 50/50 chance of happening.

Drive/Spot -> Pull Up/Penetrate -> Attack/Pass
Where were you when I spent 30+ pages arguing that drive the lane is an on ball tendency?

Sorry man but we conducted a rediculous amount of test, like way too many, probably what can legally be considered a metric ****ton. And we can safely say that drive the lane is an off ball tendency.

And attack and pass out are not based on 100.

They are very much stand alone tendencies. Give a guy 0/0 in attack and pass out and he will stand there like a dummy with the ball in his hand. Give a guy 100/100 and he will run around like a chicken with a severed head passing it to anyone who remotely looks open.

Props go to Serra11 for finding out that the Triple threat tendency acts as a pressure valve for players with a high attack tendency. And it also gives players with a low attack something to do while they're busy not attacking

Last edited by bigtreydawg; 04-26-2013 at 02:49 PM.
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