HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

[sicksteen]

Here is my biggest problem with 2K12 and it actually stems from 2K11.

Test:

Start a regular game any difficulty, have the point guard run around the perimeter, in the paint, just run around the court. Eventually, one of your players will "help" stop the penetration. That means sprint from one side of the court all the way to the other side for no apparent reason.

Yes! There are plays that have proper help defense to stop penetration. But 9/10 you'll be playing someone who isnt running an offense or calling plays. They're just doing crossovers trying to get to the hoop. As they randomly run around the court, your players confuse this with you being beat, and they run over to help.

They leave 3pt shooters open and this just puts you at a major disadvantage. I will put up videos eventually but I wanted to see if anyone esle noticed this?

[whigsplittaz]

G

Here is my biggest problem with 2K12 and it actually stems from 2K11.

Test:

Start a regular game any difficulty, have the point guard run around the perimeter, in the paint, just run around the court. Eventually, one of your players will "help" stop the penetration. That means sprint from one side of the court all the way to the other side for no apparent reason.

Yes! There are plays that have proper help defense to stop penetration. But 9/10 you'll be playing someone who isnt running an offense or calling plays. They're just doing crossovers trying to get to the hoop. As they randomly run around the court, your players confuse this with you being beat, and they run over to help.

They leave 3pt shooters open and this just puts you at a major disadvantage. I will put up videos eventually but I wanted to see if anyone esle noticed this?

While this maybe be true, no game ever will truly simulate the sport it is. Tiger woods golf, Madden, NBA 2K......... on down.

There will always those who will play this game like NBA Jam and give 2 thumbs down when in fact it is a very very sound game no doubt. Does it have flaws? What game does not?

[coolcras7]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

Here is my biggest problem with 2K12 and it actually stems from 2K11.

Test:

Start a regular game any difficulty, have the point guard run around the perimeter, in the paint, just run around the court. Eventually, one of your players will "help" stop the penetration. That means sprint from one side of the court all the way to the other side for no apparent reason.

Yes! There are plays that have proper help defense to stop penetration. But 9/10 you'll be playing someone who isnt running an offense or calling plays. They're just doing crossovers trying to get to the hoop. As they randomly run around the court, your players confuse this with you being beat, and they run over to help.

They leave 3pt shooters open and this just puts you at a major disadvantage. I will put up videos eventually but I wanted to see if anyone esle noticed this?

That situation is impossible to code with regards to help defense, but 2k has allowed us the ability to turn it down and even off when playing against someone who has decided to play the game unrealistically, help defense should never be made into a easy fix for not playing proper defense, meaning never switching over to the man cutting to assist and just hoping the AI does the job for you.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

I dont think help defense was thst bad in 2k11....if I got beat of the dribble 2k11 the AI would at least have the center there in position to affect the shot....at least 8/10 times...

now...if my center even comes over at all....hes out of posiiton to affect the shot....or animated through for the score...

The AI rather leave a shooter to help on the man your already staying in front of...

[sicksteen]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

That situation is impossible to code with regards to help defense, but 2k has allowed us the ability to turn it down and even off when playing against someone who has decided to play the game unrealistically, help defense should never be made into a easy fix for not playing proper defense, meaning never switching over to the man cutting to assist and just hoping the AI does the job for you.

LOL I see I'll need to add a video to really show what I'm talking about. I'm not talking about help defense in general, im talking about excessive help defense. When you're standing with your man, and another teammate comes from across the court for no reason.

You think its fair for us, the players to guard our man, switch over to the over reactive AI computer cutting man if he helps, run him back, then switch BACK over and guard the ball handler? Thats WAY too much! 2K needs to fix this error because sliders, game difficulty, nothing can stop this from happening.

[Jano]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

I know exactly what your talking about brother and it makes absolutely NO sense to me either.

[ffaacc03]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

The teams coaching sliders, among them, help defense ... edit to lessen this effect. Also, the general sliders section can be edited in this regard.

[locoast2coast]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

LOL I see I'll need to add a video to really show what I'm talking about. I'm not talking about help defense in general, im talking about excessive help defense. When you're standing with your man, and another teammate comes from across the court for no reason.

You think its fair for us, the players to guard our man, switch over to the over reactive AI computer cutting man if he helps, run him back, then switch BACK over and guard the ball handler? Thats WAY too much! 2K needs to fix this error because sliders, game difficulty, nothing can stop this from happening.

I know what you mean, I was playing the John Stockton challenge yesterday, Shaq had the ball just inside the 3 pt line so I was manually sagging off of him since it was Shaq, until one of my teammates randomly decides to come over and guard Shaq, leaving Eddie Jones wide open for 3, and he splashed it of course.

[bfrombleacher]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

Maybe next year they can have coach sliders without pressing START (on the direction pad and timeouts hopefully) with stuff like lockdown shooters and help defense. A large part of what coaches in real life do is tweaking the defense and the offense as the game goes along...or whining about it throughout the game like Stan Van Gundy :P

[sicksteen]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

I know what you mean, I was playing the John Stockton challenge yesterday, Shaq had the ball just inside the 3 pt line so I was manually sagging off of him since it was Shaq, until one of my teammates randomly decides to come over and guard Shaq, leaving Eddie Jones wide open for 3, and he splashed it of course.

EXACTLY What I'm talking about. When ppl bring up their issues with 2K12, and even my own, I try to find a way around it.. it is a game after all..

But this glitch is the WORST glitch I have ever seen, just like my man abotve quoted, they randomly leave great shooters open, and this can happen several times throughout the game.

Nothing is worse than playing somebody YOU KNOW is not running an offense, not penetrating the paint, not doing anything effectively, but they keep finding open players at the 3 pt line.

I honestly believe if they fix this last glitch.. 2K will be an almost perfect game, they nuked the hop step, they made the shot timing easier, they gave the defense more options..

THIS IS THE LAST GLITCH TO SOLVE!!

[TheKasmar]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

Help defense does help and this certainly isnt a glitch. Yes, you can get the cpu to bite when posted up or on the drive, but that hppens in the NBA. If you are playing another human opponent then you have to change settings in order to get the proper amount of help defense.

[Pared]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

This is very true (not the title, the content of the first post).

I would add it also leads to mismatches on the perimeter through simple screens. I like to take an off-ball defender like the SG and run through picks, following my man. Often the CPU defenders just get completely screwed up and will start guarding anyone, without any sort of "preferred defender" settling in trying to return to their original cover.

It's been a bit frustrating at times, especially when a weak side defender bombs down into the paint for no reason leaving his man open. If I were driving and he was a help defender it makes sense, but they'll do this for no apparent reason....

[rockchisler]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

Here is my biggest problem with 2K12 and it actually stems from 2K11.

Test:

Start a regular game any difficulty, have the point guard run around the perimeter, in the paint, just run around the court. Eventually, one of your players will "help" stop the penetration. That means sprint from one side of the court all the way to the other side for no apparent reason.

Yes! There are plays that have proper help defense to stop penetration. But 9/10 you'll be playing someone who isnt running an offense or calling plays. They're just doing crossovers trying to get to the hoop. As they randomly run around the court, your players confuse this with you being beat, and they run over to help.

They leave 3pt shooters open and this just puts you at a major disadvantage. I will put up videos eventually but I wanted to see if anyone esle noticed this?

In the future I would like to see Players that overdribble turn it over more by themselves or travel to deter running around like a idiot.

[SIZEqueen]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

This is very true (not the title, the content of the first post).

I would add it also leads to mismatches on the perimeter through simple screens. I like to take an off-ball defender like the SG and run through picks, following my man. Often the CPU defenders just get completely screwed up and will start guarding anyone, without any sort of "preferred defender" settling in trying to return to their original cover.

It's been a bit frustrating at times, especially when a weak side defender bombs down into the paint for no reason leaving his man open. If I were driving and he was a help defender it makes sense, but they'll do this for no apparent reason....

I'm going to mess with 2 teams today. I'm going to start with actual roster edits, because, well, I have to laugh at Calderon having a 70 on ball defense rating and Bargnani having a 93 tendency to do a euro step. Primarily, attributes I think are what will directly effect the game play, since I have yet to see a defense slider tendency.

Too many players have very high defensive awareness and on ball defense. Also a culprit for a high rating is 3 point shot. If I can find the numeric value where the defender turns from real good to average, and then from there to kinda not good, I'll be in business. Then I'm going to adjust coaching profiles and all things defense.

The 2 teams I'm going with are the Raps and the Celtics. I know both teams very, very well, and they also serve as a good analogue for both ends of the defensive spectrum and will also lend themselves to testing tendencies rather nicely. Both teams are pretty diverse in that regard with players like Barbosa, Rondo, Bargnani, Pierce, Davis etc.

I do not care how a players overall rating is affected. If the player drops 10 points, I really don't care, nor do I care if they go up 15. I want a realistic game experience. If Calderon stops Rondo on 1 more drive, I'm just gonna walk away in anger. Calderon would lose an iso match up to Rondo 100 times out of 100. I also don't want to see Bargnani being the primary help defender, unless it's due to positioning and acceptable contextually. If he does help, I pretty much want it to suck.

I'll keep anyone who's interested posted.

[GodzSoulja]

Re: HELP DEFENSE Doesnt Help At All!

pull and hold LT AND THE RT AND USE THE RIGHT STICK TO CUT OFF THE OFFENSIVE PLAYER.there's your defense.