PS2 Troubles: Heisman Too Easy!!

[pbtiger]

Undefeated,

Have you played any test games with the zero sliders? I played a little with zero PB, RB, and BB and noted the pancakes were not out of control. I didn't adjust too much else so I am curious how the game played out with more adjustments to zero. I wish there was some magic formula to input to essentially level the playing field to true attributes (i.e., players play at their in-game ratings with no boosts). I have tired all sorts of things to see if maybe their is some secret code (e.g., "EA" for offense code; "SPORTS" for defense, etc). So far I haven't hit on something that felt like the one, although the aformentioned code did provide a challenging gaming experience against even competition. Funny thing is I have never been an OL stat person, but I seem to be obsessed with keeping pancake totals in line. Thing is, I don't know and can't find anywhere what in line pancake totals would be.

I agree with your points above. I wish there were individual aspect sliders. I love the power and accuracy for some of the QBs at or near default, but they are too accurate on 50 yard bombs. A slider to make this feel more real without altering the short game would be an example of an individual slider I would like.

[Hill Hokie]

Quote: Originally Posted by pbtiger

Undefeated, Have you played any test games with the zero sliders? I played a little with zero PB, RB, and BB and noted the pancakes were not out of control. I didn't adjust too much else so I am curious how the game played out with more adjustments to zero. I wish there was some magic formula to input to essentially level the playing field to true attributes (i.e., players play at their in-game ratings with no boosts). I have tired all sorts of things to see if maybe their is some secret code (e.g., "EA" for offense code; "SPORTS" for defense, etc). So far I haven't hit on something that felt like the one, although the aformentioned code did provide a challenging gaming experience against even competition. Funny thing is I have never been an OL stat person, but I seem to be obsessed with keeping pancake totals in line. Thing is, I don't know and can't find anywhere what in line pancake totals would be. I agree with your points above. I wish there were individual aspect sliders. I love the power and accuracy for some of the QBs at or near default, but they are too accurate on 50 yard bombs. A slider to make this feel more real without altering the short game would be an example of an individual slider I would like.

Dude you are playing with a A plus team. Also, turnovers are part of football. Remember FSU's Heisman winner Charlie Ward? He threw five INTs in a game his junior year. It happens. Vinnie Testeverde threw five against PSU in the MNC game. You are being unrealistic. Turnovers happen. There are usually a fair amount of fumbles in college ball and at the same time your tackling sliders are low for a guy who claims to be so great.

[Village Idiot]

Quote: Originally Posted by Hill Hokie

Dude you are playing with a A plus team.

I guess you missed the part where I talked about playing with a C+ BYU team and experiencing the same problems. And just because I'm playing with an A+ team doesn't mean I should be able to yawn my way to 600 total yards and 45 points against quality opponents - yawn being the key word.

Quote:

Also, turnovers are part of football. Remember FSU's Heisman winner Charlie Ward? He threw five INTs in a game his junior year. It happens. Vinnie Testeverde threw five against PSU in the MNC game. You are being unrealistic. Turnovers happen.

Thanks. That solves all my problems.

Quote:

...your tackling sliders are low for a guy who claims to be so great.

You're right, I'm the type of guy who would start a thread like this just to make complete strangers think I'm good at a video game. I already said, all having the tackle slider jacked up seems to do is promote big hits - which are already too frequent. It's not like having the tackle slider 'low' is causing them to miss tackles or take bad routes to the ball.

Quote: Originally Posted by pbtiger

Undefeated, Have you played any test games with the zero sliders?

I won't say I've given up, but I've pretty much put the game down for the time being. I will say that in some test games (playing with some lesser teams, like Washington and Illinois) I was losing (even lost a game 63-10), so that's a good sign, at least in the context of this thread. But I was still beating the crap out of teams if I was able to get the early lead - damn momentum.

One thing that might be of benefit: the new clock rules. Now 55-60 plays might be more the rule, so 9 or 8 minute quarters might be more realistic, and that means less scoring overall. So, that might be a surefire way of getting ppg down.

Otherwise, visiting this thread has given me something of a jones to put the game back in, so maybe tonight I'll mess around some more. Bottom line is, though, no, I haven't really done any work lately. The minute I do, though, I'll update.

[Village Idiot]

Okay ... I suppose it might be worth it to turn this thread into one of those 'slider logs' like a couple others have done. I just popped the game back in and had a pretty nice experience.

Illinois (me) @ Washington

Final: 38-31

I actually trailed in this game, 24-7 at the half, but ripped off 31 straight to take a 38-24 lead before they added a trash-time TD. Despite my 31-0 run, the game played well, and I only made my run because they turned the ball over three times. (Coincidentally, their 24-7 lead was also due in large to my turning the ball over three times.)

The only ran the ball nine times (for nice yardage, though), so that has me worried. As a result, I dominated the clock - something like 23:00 to 13:00. Running-wise, I was under 3 ypc for much of the game, but my RB finished with something like 130 yards on 34 carries and a couple scores. Passing was nice - I had a high completion pct. but didn't throw for too much yardage - I think I went like 20 of 33 for 210 or something.

Overall, like I said, the game was pretty good. I was disappointed that I managed to roll off 31 straight points, but I never got the feeling things were 'too easy'.

As I mentioned above, I'm trying to keep things the same for both user and CPU. As of now, things look like this:

OFFENSE:

QBA: 40
PB: 15
WRC: 55
RBA: 35
RBL: 20

DEFENSE:

AWR: 0
KND: 0
INT: 0
BRB: 0
TKL: 35

The most interesting/intriguing thing is that the game was relatively high-scoring (38-31) but the defenses were mostly zero's. For my next test game, I'm going to leave the offenses alone and bump each defensive slider once and see what happens; maybe get a nice 24-20 or something. That would be great.

[pbtiger]

Thanks for the updates. I went into practice mode so that momentum, etc. would not affect anything and started running the same play against the same defense to adjust sliders from default. I will explain a couple of plays I ran and the results.

1) I ran a short curl against a base 4-3 with the LB playing zone over the outside. The particular LB had an awareness of 98, so I figured he should have very quick reaction to the ball. I started at default and began throwing to the receiver he was playing underneath coverage on. At 50 the LB just stood there while the ball went past even though he was watching the ball come right at him. I kept bumping the slider up in 5 point increments until I felt good that he was following the ball and trying to make a play on it without jumping 10 feet off the ground to pick it off. I ended up at 65 for the AWR, so I set both HUM and CPU at this. I have KND at default since although passes do get deflected, they don't compensate for bad coverage. Maybe it is just me, but I don't see 15 deflected passes by coverage teams on a regular basis.

2) I ran deep fly patterns with the QBA and WRC settings at default. I was using a QB with an overall rating of 89 and ACC of 68. I know from watching this QB that they are deadly at 25yd and under passes, but arm strength does wain a little when they go for the deep passes. Therefore, I wanted to keep the short game accurate without making the deep pass a consistent weapon. I dropped this slider down 5 points until I got to the point that I felt the precision passing really came into play. What I mean is say you want to lob the deep pass over the shoulder of the receiver, you actually have to push the thumbstick up and to the L/R to put it there. If it is off you will overthrow or miss to the L/R. The setting I ended up at was 25 for this. It is a must that you time the pass to the WR break, and even then, too much or too little precision can result in a miss. I would imagine this slider would go up or down depending on the accuracy and strenght of a particular QB, but I don't want a 60 rated QB to come in and go 20-20 (unless maybe his accuracy was 99 and everything else low).

Coinciding with this is the WRC slider. My observation is that this slider not only controls the WR ability to catch a pass, but also their ability to make a play on the ball. At default, I intentionally threw passes completely off their route, and in some instances it appeared they got this incredible burst of speed to make up 15 yds to make a catch. In fact, when I did instant replay to slow it down, I literally saw this cheat on both the HUM and CPU receivers. Here it is, the WR is covered tight by the CB, but when the pass is thrown, while the CB continues to run using both feet, the WR slides on one leg for about a 3 yd. jump before running again and flys to the ball. I dropped the WRC catch setting 5 points until I did not see this on a regular basis. This setting ended up at 35.

3) I think I have tried everything to drop the amounts of fumbles in the game, but found the running game was too powerful if I drop the TKL slider or increase RBA over the TKL slider so I left these settings close to default. I ran some various running plays, specifically counters and toss plays to see how the OL reacted. At default they were too slow to pull. I only had to bump a couple of clicks to 60 to get to the point I felt good that they were effective without being overpowering (pancake heavy). I ran the running plays with these settings against "random all" defense settings in practice and broke a couple of 15 - 20 yd runs and was thinking I may have made it too good. Then a string of TFL or 1 to 2 yd runs brought me back to reality. A good defensive call against the run can stop it. It should be noted I was using a very good RB, so I don't think I should be completely shut down.

So where I am now is I am playing 8 min. QTRs with the following setting:

HUM/CPU

QBA - 25/35 (The CPU doesn't do good at all below 35)
PB - 50/50
WRC - 35/35
RBA - 50/50
RB - 60/60

AWR - 65/65
KND - 50/50
INT - 20/20
BB - 50/50
TKL - 60/60

There you go. I feel like this plays well and I don't feel like I am cheating the CPU and don't feel I am cheating myself. With the QBA where it is I feel it is up to me to get an accurate throw off, so I love this where it is. It is interesting that I first had PB all the way up at 80 for myself, but when I went back in practiced as well as worked at making quick reads I felt like with a 50 setting I had adequate time to get a good pass off. There are definitely rushed passes, some sacks if you roll out too much, take too deep a drop, etc., and I even managed to draw an intentional grounding penalty. I don't know, but it felt right where it was. My goal was to try and keep things balanced without ruining the feel for the gameplay itself. I find these settings very challenging, some may not, but I feel like it has the Heisman level playable and fun. Dynasty starts tonight.

[rudyjuly2]

Quote: Originally Posted by Undefeated

I won't say I've given up, but I've pretty much put the game down for the time being. I will say that in some test games (playing with some lesser teams, like Washington and Illinois) I was losing (even lost a game 63-10), so that's a good sign, at least in the context of this thread. But I was still beating the crap out of teams if I was able to get the early lead - damn momentum.

In last year's game HFA was largely responsible for games to get out of hand so I don't think you can blame it entirely on momentum. Have you tried playing with HFA off to see if it balances out the game and possibly reduces fumbles? You can't turn off momentum so its the only choice you have even if it does remove the feeling of upsetting a good team on the road.

Edit: While this might be utterly useless, have you tried playing on AA and really maximizing the CPU sliders and minimizing the human ones? The two levels are quite different in the run game and while I suspect you would dominate easier than before, maybe there is a tiny chance you could find it enjoyable. The CPU offense is far more potent on Heisman, particularly the passing game.

[Hill Hokie]

Quote: Originally Posted by Undefeated

I guess you missed the part where I talked about playing with a C+ BYU team and experiencing the same problems. And just because I'm playing with an A+ team doesn't mean I should be able to yawn my way to 600 total yards and 45 points against quality opponents - yawn being the key word. Thanks. That solves all my problems. You're right, I'm the type of guy who would start a thread like this just to make complete strangers think I'm good at a video game. I already said, all having the tackle slider jacked up seems to do is promote big hits - which are already too frequent. It's not like having the tackle slider 'low' is causing them to miss tackles or take bad routes to the ball. I won't say I've given up, but I've pretty much put the game down for the time being. I will say that in some test games (playing with some lesser teams, like Washington and Illinois) I was losing (even lost a game 63-10), so that's a good sign, at least in the context of this thread. But I was still beating the crap out of teams if I was able to get the early lead - damn momentum. One thing that might be of benefit: the new clock rules. Now 55-60 plays might be more the rule, so 9 or 8 minute quarters might be more realistic, and that means less scoring overall. So, that might be a surefire way of getting ppg down. Otherwise, visiting this thread has given me something of a jones to put the game back in, so maybe tonight I'll mess around some more. Bottom line is, though, no, I haven't really done any work lately. The minute I do, though, I'll update.

I have a buddy who made the same claims as you then I played him and blew him out. Go figure.

[Hill Hokie]

Something I wanted to add. On AA the CPU has a strength advantage. Make sure the CPU has a +25 advantage on the line play when playing on AA level. Make sure you set the tackling at least at 65 for the CPU. Make sure defensive awareness is at least a 75. These changes make a huge difference. A line man rated 70 should struggle to block a DL rated a 85. With these changes the good players stand out more and the weaker ones struggle like they should. If you keep your line play(run block and pass block) at 50 increase the CPU break block to 75. It's simple and then talent and recruiting will matter.