Oraeons slider testing for slider makers

[Oraeon1224]

I finished testing the sliders again this year here is the summary of how they work, and there are some significant changes.

Threshold slider:
Same as last year. Decent HB 40 time is 4.6seconds and default MLB is 5.1 seconds. At a threshold of 100 MLB 40 time is 4.9 sec and at threshold 0 was 5.6 sec. Meanwhile the HB stayed at 4.6 sec at 0 and changed to 5.0 sec at 100. This shows that it levels playing when raised by slowing faster players and when lowered it slows slower players further, probably by adjust standard deviation around a mean value perhaps of 90. Gap is about right by NFL combine data on default with an deal gap 0.3-0.4 so I am bumping to 53-60range and on testing this at 60 narrowed MLB speed to 5.0. I wouldn't change by more than 10 from default.

With regards to its impact on deep pass coverage there was not much difference at 0 (CB and WR are too comparable for this sort of adjustment to mean much). However, at threshold 100 LBs smothered tight ends/HBs (not realistic) and at 0 tight ends/HBs were open more against LB. A lower setting results in more open non WR recievers and a higher setting results in less open TE, HB routes. I.E. don't adjust this slider to affect deep passing routes run by WR, tt doesn't work that way.

Pass blocking:
At default 5 sec before sacked against a 4 man rush, and DEs had about 3/4 of sacks. At 100 the QB had 10 seconds to throw on average and DEs had 50% of sacks. At 0 slider the QB had 3-4 seconds (worse against blitz) with DT having majority of sacks coming straight up the middle. decreasing pass blocking results in an unrealistic preponderance of DT sacks. Raising it did not result in increased pancakes this year (visually, it never effected in game stats). Against the 4 man rush I like default at this time but it needs in game testing to reduce increased sacks against the CPU.

Interception:
Same as prior years. Adjust this slider down to avoid too many interceptions especially since deflections and coverage are the only options to reduce quarterback accuracy.

WR catching:
Since coverage seems to few options to improve except increasing threshold slider to improve TE/HB coverage and Pass coverage slider doesn't actually do what it says, this is the main slider to effect QB completion percentages. Unfortunately it will make your WR look like a dufus and give bad stats for them.

QB accuracy:
Pretty useless for players and AI again this year. Deep routes are unaffected (0 overthrown balls even at 0, but power markedly less). Overall some missed short routes out of bounds (effects touch) at settings of 20 or less. Mainly it seems to nerf arm strength more than accuracy and at very low settings there are a lot of under-thrown deep balls. Overall a big disappointment, and I am setting at 15 player and 20 CPU. To change accuracy again this year you need unrealistic deflections and dropped passes.

Pass coverage:
I reviewed every route combo at 0 and 100 against man and zone. I can say definitively that I don't actually see any improvement in coverage of man or zones at any setting. However, I did note that bump and run is more effective and that the defense reacts faster to the ball when its in the air. I couldn't tell if this actually effected completions (it didn't seem to) but it did result in less YAC. To clarify defense is out of position the same at all settings but closes the gap faster at a setting of 100 and may stall the route with a better bump.

RB Ability:
Effects HB speed mildly but did not effect fumbles or broken tackles. Biggest difference seems to be in the CPUs ability to pick the right hole and it may be controlling ball carrier vision. Very useful for CPU but didn't matter much to my play between 0 and 100 though things were a little more sluggish. At 0 the AI would sometimes just sit in a hole confused at 100 it chose the right hole most of the time. This slider appears important for making the CPU a smart runner but didn't really make any difference for the human. I am unsure of its impact on the CPU option.

Run blocking:
Since last year big change. Doesn't effect pancakes (like last year) and getting to the second level. Instead it just increases the time a defender is stuck blocked. Even then I didn't notice a big difference between 0 and 100 on yards gained for me or the CPU. Powerful last year but minimal impact this year.

Rush defense:
Critical this year as it controls AI correctly reading trick plays (it does not appear to have any impact on correct positioning against routine running plays). At 0 on a counter play the AI massively overplays to the fake but never bites at 100. Same for option they seem to play it correctly most of the time. Coolest of all is the slider name is misleading as it effects all trick plays not just running plays. Against the play action pass (a bust in many prior years) is where it most shines. Nearly 100% int or deflections when set to 100 during a play action but a huge gain or touchdown every play if set to 0. At 0 the defense massively bites on the run leaving the receiver wide open. Very cool now we can adjust success of draws, counters, options, play action and other trick plays with this slider. Just don't believe it is going to effect routine running (i.e. don't adjust this slider too low unless you want the game to be breeze. At a setting of 0 you can march down the field with trick plays easily).

Kickoff in practice seems fine
Punt seems fine
Field goal power fine
Field goal accuracy 30-35 result in some misses at 45 yards for CPU. 35 a bit too accurate and 30 too poor. Pick your poison. Human FG accuracy doesn't matter.

Difficulty sets: As in prior iterations the game doesn't actually improve AI at Heisman. What it does is provide a STAT boost to the CPU and a penalty to the Human (you can test this by speed testing running backs with human). Varsity applies a penalty to the CPU and a boost to the human. As in prior years after 2 test games on default All American is about right for the CPU offense (too many slider corrections to get QB accuracy right at Heisman) ,but offense is too easy for human. This year we have split sliders so I am recommending All american for CPU offense with possible boost to CPU run game to compensate in the future and Heisman for CPU defense.

[DNMHIII]

Nice work.....Thanks

[skundy]

Great work man. I used some of your theory in tweaking my sliders:
http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2045229055

Thanks

[BearsNVA]

Quote: Originally Posted by Oraeon1224

I finished testing the sliders again this year here is the summary of how they work, and there are some significant changes. Threshold slider: Same as last year. Decent HB 40 time is 4.6seconds and default MLB is 5.1 seconds. At a threshold of 100 MLB 40 time is 4.9 sec and at threshold 0 was 5.6 sec. Meanwhile the HB stayed at 4.6 sec at 0 and changed to 5.0 sec at 100. This shows that it levels playing when raised by slowing faster players and when lowered it slows slower players further, probably by adjust standard deviation around a mean value perhaps of 90. Gap is about right by NFL combine data on default with an deal gap 0.3-0.4 so I am bumping to 53-60range and on testing this at 60 narrowed MLB speed to 5.0. I wouldn't change by more than 10 from default. With regards to its impact on deep pass coverage there was not much difference at 0 (CB and WR are too comparable for this sort of adjustment to mean much). However, at threshold 100 LBs smothered tight ends/HBs (not realistic) and at 0 tight ends/HBs were open more against LB. A lower setting results in more open non WR recievers and a higher setting results in less open TE, HB routes. I.E. don't adjust this slider to affect deep passing routes run by WR, tt doesn't work that way. Pass blocking: At default 5 sec before sacked against a 4 man rush, and DEs had about 3/4 of sacks. At 100 the QB had 10 seconds to throw on average and DEs had 50% of sacks. At 0 slider the QB had 3-4 seconds (worse against blitz) with DT having majority of sacks coming straight up the middle. decreasing pass blocking results in an unrealistic preponderance of DT sacks. Raising it did not result in increased pancakes this year (visually, it never effected in game stats). Against the 4 man rush I like default at this time but it needs in game testing to reduce increased sacks against the CPU. Interception: Same as prior years. Adjust this slider down to avoid too many interceptions especially since deflections and coverage are the only options to reduce quarterback accuracy. WR catching: Since coverage seems to few options to improve except increasing threshold slider to improve TE/HB coverage and Pass coverage slider doesn't actually do what it says, this is the main slider to effect QB completion percentages. Unfortunately it will make your WR look like a dufus and give bad stats for them. QB accuracy: Pretty useless for players and AI again this year. Deep routes are unaffected (0 overthrown balls even at 0, but power markedly less). Overall some missed short routes out of bounds (effects touch) at settings of 20 or less. Mainly it seems to nerf arm strength more than accuracy and at very low settings there are a lot of under-thrown deep balls. Overall a big disappointment, and I am setting at 15 player and 20 CPU. To change accuracy again this year you need unrealistic deflections and dropped passes. Pass coverage: I reviewed every route combo at 0 and 100 against man and zone. I can say definitively that I don't actually see any improvement in coverage of man or zones at any setting. However, I did note that bump and run is more effective and that the defense reacts faster to the ball when its in the air. I couldn't tell if this actually effected completions (it didn't seem to) but it did result in less YAC. To clarify defense is out of position the same at all settings but closes the gap faster at a setting of 100 and may stall the route with a better bump. RB Ability: Effects HB speed mildly but did not effect fumbles or broken tackles. Biggest difference seems to be in the CPUs ability to pick the right hole and it may be controlling ball carrier vision. Very useful for CPU but didn't matter much to my play between 0 and 100 though things were a little more sluggish. At 0 the AI would sometimes just sit in a hole confused at 100 it chose the right hole most of the time. This slider appears important for making the CPU a smart runner but didn't really make any difference for the human. I am unsure of its impact on the CPU option. Run blocking: Since last year big change. Doesn't effect pancakes (like last year) and getting to the second level. Instead it just increases the time a defender is stuck blocked. Even then I didn't notice a big difference between 0 and 100 on yards gained for me or the CPU. Powerful last year but minimal impact this year. Rush defense: Critical this year as it controls AI correctly reading trick plays (it does not appear to have any impact on correct positioning against routine running plays). At 0 on a counter play the AI massively overplays to the fake but never bites at 100. Same for option they seem to play it correctly most of the time. Coolest of all is the slider name is misleading as it effects all trick plays not just running plays. Against the play action pass (a bust in many prior years) is where it most shines. Nearly 100% int or deflections when set to 100 during a play action but a huge gain or touchdown every play if set to 0. At 0 the defense massively bites on the run leaving the receiver wide open. Very cool now we can adjust success of draws, counters, options, play action and other trick plays with this slider. Just don't believe it is going to effect routine running (i.e. don't adjust this slider too low unless you want the game to be breeze. At a setting of 0 you can march down the field with trick plays easily). Kickoff in practice seems fine Punt seems fine Field goal power fine Field goal accuracy 30-35 result in some misses at 45 yards for CPU. 35 a bit too accurate and 30 too poor. Pick your poison. Human FG accuracy doesn't matter. Difficulty sets: As in prior iterations the game doesn't actually improve AI at Heisman. What it does is provide a STAT boost to the CPU and a penalty to the Human (you can test this by speed testing running backs with human). Varsity applies a penalty to the CPU and a boost to the human. As in prior years after 2 test games on default All American is about right for the CPU offense (too many slider corrections to get QB accuracy right at Heisman) ,but offense is too easy for human. This year we have split sliders so I am recommending All american for CPU offense with possible boost to CPU run game to compensate in the future and Heisman for CPU defense.

You wrote, " This year we have split sliders so I am recommending All american for CPU offense with possible boost to CPU run game to compensate in the future and Heisman for CPU defense."

Do you mean O should be AA and Def on Heisman.

I was confused by the use of CPU Offense, and CPU Defense. Are you talking about "all the players you don't control," or are you saying the CPU other team?

Sorry if this is confusing, but.......I'm confused.

Nice explanations everywhere else though. This a very helpful post and will be great to use.

[dsmi155]

This may be too much to ask, but as exhaustive as your testing seems to be is there any way you would be willing to research the effect penalty sliders have on gameplay? This way we could have a definitive answer and guide to what these do this year once and for all. We are finding we are having to mix penalty settings with slider settings for the best outcome.

Either way, thanks for this great work/guide.

[risewithus56]

Quote: Originally Posted by dsmi155

This may be too much to ask, but as exhaustive as your testing seems to be is there any way you would be willing to research the effect penalty sliders have on gameplay? This way we could have a definitive answer and guide to what these do this year once and for all. We are finding we are having to mix penalty settings with slider settings for the best outcome. Either way, thanks for this great work/guide.

I think he has been, but the results are in another thread. I think the thread is called statistical analysis or something?

[NutsackII]

I've been testing sliders for a decade now it seems...

As testers we see a lot of stuff we think is happening lol... we become zombies of these games.

I try to make my sliders a lot harder than default heisman... your testing is always relevant and accurate.

Here is some feedback to what I've come up with this week.

Special Teams:

FG Accuracy/Power always seemed to go hand in hand for my kickers. The lower the accuracy the less power behind the kick especially if you didn't max out the meter on your attempt, no matter what the power was adjusted to.

I think Kickoffs need to be at 35 or higher. This was tested in Dynasty Mode. At 30 the kickers for human and computer would max out at the 10 yard line. 35 allows you to put it at the goalline. At 40 I was kicking into an 18 mile an hour wind and putting it midway through the endzone. 35 Is pretty solid.

Human Punt Power is much like FG kicking, the accuracy has a huge impact on distance you kick the ball IMO. Right now I have my put power accuracy on 25 along with my power at 25. This keeps me under 48 yards into the 42-45 yard range which is where it needs to be. I keep the computers accuracy at 50-100 to limit the shank punts when you go for the block. I think that was a big problem two years ago if you went for the block they punted it 15 yards 2/3 times. I have there power at 40 - keeps it under that 48 avg.

Offense:

For the last 4 - 5 years the human qb accuracy always ends up at 5 - 10 for me. 10 will let you not lead wr's and make solid throws, sometimes 5 will make you throw the ball directly to the safety instead of your wr. I'm sticking with 5.

Usually I can put the computers a little higher than mine but right now I'm sticking theirs at 10 - they are making better decisions with the ball this year.

Defense:

Along with qb accuracy another annual slider for me is INT's at 35. I don't know why but it allows me to drop enough INT's to lower the completion percentage yet allow me to make enough of them.

Other than that I have only moved a couple sliders 5 pts to give the computer more of an advantage on me. Everything is looking solid so far. I love that the computer can finally pound me on the ground. I moved my tack. to 45.


Penalty Sliders

* I can not get anyone to get called for a hold even at 100.

The offsides/false start slider had less of an impact than last year. Even at 100 you may see two called a game.

Facemask at 60 seems to be perfect for me. I get 1-2 a game.
Clipping at 55 seems to get me 1 - 2 a game.

False Start/Holding are the two penalties mostly called in real life. Holding I have yet to see.

Roughing the passer/Pass Inter./Roughing the kIcker I haven't seen the computer do in years. Once in a blue moon you may get P.I. ...>>> Some are saying these pen. sliders effect computer actions; I'm not a believer b/c I know how we tend to think things are happening.


***Note I usually play on fast speed but since the rb/wr get stuck I am playing on normal speed. RB ability is great at 50 - I watched Braxton Miller and Hyde make unreal runs against me today. Hyde made possibly the best computer run I've ever seen in over 15 years playing this game.


****My biggest concerns:

1. CPU pass accuracy/Hum Pass coverage - I want it to be a challenge I'm afraid if I mess with it I will gain an advantage.
2. can the computer beat me on NON-Zone Read running plays?
3. Human deep ball passing... I wonder if the four verticals is still broken (to easy)? Haven't tried it out yet.

[skundy]

In this thread: http://www.operationsports.com/forum...meplay-14.html

KBLover (halfway down page) gives a great analysis of penalty sliders. It really opened my eyes when I was tweaking madden 13. The same rules seem to apply to Ncaa 14

I completely agree with you about the clipping and facemask penalty sliders nutsack, same setting I have in my sliders.

I was playing on very fast, but today I tried fast and wow, it was so smooth. Fast is def the way to go.

I have yet to see an offsides call. I have gotten a roughing the passer and DPI both my fault being too aggressive.