I think I may have figured out why play action pass gets blown up so often

[Segagendude]

If there's a gripe I have about this otherwise stellar game, this is it.

PA doesn't work for me either. I set it up with the run.......I use the paper-clipped setup plays......tried everything. No sooner I select a PA pass, I'm sacked before I even get a chance to go thru my reads.

I play as the Buckeyes. Prior's a good scrambler, except when doing a PA play. No matter WHO I play, I know NOT to select PA plays, and that does away with over half my playbook.

Frustrating, to say the least...

[EZ Esquire]

Quote: Originally Posted by Bwnarrow3

In what way does this "work"?

That play is a perfect example of the LB blitzing. Which has been said you should not run the PA when the CPU blitzes.

It certainly may not be perfect but I do not think it is broken.

The game was designed to require the User to make adjustments game to game. You must consider all the factors.

OL/DL fatigue, home/away, ratings, play frequency, conservative/aggressive game plans, etc are all factoring into play success.

If you play at home with aggressive pass catching you may do fine – go away to Bama and watch your WR drop everything. This does not mean the game is broken or the pass catching slider needs adjusting. When I play a tough away game I always go conservative.

Same with Pass defense. Go aggressive and you may make the WR drop the ball more with hits. Go conservative and the CPU holds on to the ball when hit but you may knock down more passes before they get there.

Go aggressive running and you will fumble. Go conservative and you fumble less. Each game may be different. There does not need to be a fumble fix.

A big one is the LB jumping and knocking down/intercepting passes. People complain but then I see videos of people dropping their QB back 20 yards and then trying throwing a 10 pass over a LB. Does the game need fixing or the User?

You could play an entire season, but if you do not use the game plans you might assume things need to be adjusted or fixed. Not always the case.

I am not saying all these things work perfectly but they designed the game to factor in all these things and to make you make adjustments for each game. Do not expect the game play to be exactly the same for every game.

The PA fits into this as well. Honestly, look at what you are doing. Did the CPU blitz? Did they jump the snap? Did they play run first? Is your OL tired?

The play above had a blitzing LB show exactly what the CPU will do when you call PA during a blitz.

[White Out]

Quote: Originally Posted by EZ Esquire

That play is a perfect example of the LB blitzing. Which has been said you should not run the PA when the CPU blitzes. It certainly may not be perfect but I do not think it is broken. The game was designed to require the User to make adjustments game to game. You must consider all the factors. OL/DL fatigue, home/away, ratings, play frequency, conservative/aggressive game plans, etc are all factoring into play success. If you play at home with aggressive pass catching you may do fine – go away to Bama and watch your WR drop everything. This does not mean the game is broken or the pass catching slider needs adjusting. When I play a tough away game I always go conservative. Same with Pass defense. Go aggressive and you may make the WR drop the ball more with hits. Go conservative and the CPU holds on to the ball when hit but you may knock down more passes before they get there. Go aggressive running and you will fumble. Go conservative and you fumble less. Each game may be different. There does not need to be a fumble fix. A big one is the LB jumping and knocking down/intercepting passes. People complain but then I see videos of people dropping their QB back 20 yards and then trying throwing a 10 pass over a LB. Does the game need fixing or the User? You could play an entire season, but if you do not use the game plans you might assume things need to be adjusted or fixed. Not always the case. I am not saying all these things work perfectly but they designed the game to factor in all these things and to make you make adjustments for each game. Do not expect the game play to be exactly the same for every game. The PA fits into this as well. Honestly, look at what you are doing. Did the CPU blitz? Did they jump the snap? Did they play run first? Is your OL tired? The play above had a blitzing LB show exactly what the CPU will do when you call PA during a blitz.

i wish i had more hands so i could give this post 4 thumbs down. calling a playaction results in heavy sacking. every time you call a PA... the chances of a hurry or sack are upwards of 75%. It's broken. Stop trying to make excuses for something that EA obviously didn't do correct in this otherwise wonderful football game.

The problem with PA by the way? Players dont bite on the fake. It's just that simple. Even blitzing players will bite on a PA... that's why playaction accounts for 1/3rd of NFL offences today. Look it up and be real.

[southwvboy]

When they say "set up" that's what they mean. You are being set up to get your QB killed.

[tommygunn]

Quote: Originally Posted by White Out

i wish i had more hands so i could give this post 4 thumbs down. calling a playaction results in heavy sacking. every time you call a PA... the chances of a hurry or sack are upwards of 75%. It's broken. Stop trying to make excuses for something that EA obviously didn't do correct in this otherwise wonderful football game. The problem with PA by the way? Players dont bite on the fake. It's just that simple. Even blitzing players will bite on a PA... that's why playaction accounts for 1/3rd of NFL offences today. Look it up and be real.

Wonderfully summarized. If they could fix this and the special teams the game is perfect. COme on EA throw us a bone with patch 3!!!!!

[spit_bubble]

You people seem to be missing the point of why I started this thread...

Quote: Originally Posted by goalieump413

Play Action works in real life because it freezes defenders into thinking the play is a run, but doesn't make the OL suddenly stupid. In normal passing plays, the OL continues to hold their blocks for a reasonable amount of time. In this game, they release their blocks...

Hooray! Someone gets it.

My discovery was that it seems like OL will let d-linemen with high play recognition get through too easily on the play action pass.

That's all I was saying. I may test it more, and if someone else wants to test it, it can be isolated like this:

1. Go to practice mode with a team that has at least one, but no more than two, d-lineman with a high play recognition.

2. On offense choose a random play action pass.

3. For defense choose a non-blitzing play.

4. Watch the d-lineman with high play recognition, and see if your offensive lineman lets him through too easily...

This is what I was seeing, though I haven't fully tested it (didn't have time).

The play action works... Sometimes... I realize that. I don't need video evidence or petty bickering here...

The point is to see if offensive lineman are giving d-linemen with high play recognition a free run to the QB on play action passes.

[goalieump413]

I wonder if the tackle's rating(s) is also a contributing factor. In other words, if the tackle is a lesser rated player, I wonder if he gets beaten more than an All American type guy. I'd love to know the counterbalancing rating for your discovery.

[Ramminyou]

Quote: Originally Posted by spit_bubble

You people seem to be missing the point of why I started this thread... Hooray! Someone gets it. My discovery was that it seems like OL will let d-linemen with high play recognition get through too easily on the play action pass. That's all I was saying. I may test it more, and if someone else wants to test it, it can be isolated like this: 1. Go to practice mode with a team that has at least one, but no more than two, d-lineman with a high play recognition. 2. On offense choose a random play action pass. 3. For defense choose a non-blitzing play. 4. Watch the d-lineman with high play recognition, and see if your offensive lineman lets him through too easily... This is what I was seeing, though I haven't fully tested it (didn't have time). The play action works... Sometimes... I realize that. I don't need video evidence or petty bickering here... The point is to see if offensive lineman are giving d-linemen with high play recognition a free run to the QB on play action passes.

That may have been your explanation, but your overall premise is what's flawed: namely, that the PA pass gets disrupted too often and is thus, not worth using.

You cannot dismiss the video evidence presented to you simply because it does not comport with your view. The fact is the videos I've shown have depicted, in six un-cherry picked examples, that the O-line holds more then well enough for you to run your play. That does not mean that you shouldn't feel pressure or that you never will. Whatever you have seen with O-Linemen letting in defenders easily (a small hint of this can be seen in the first pass in my Mizzou videos) can probably be seen on more plays than you realize, only it's got more of an impact when you have an extra delay with the fake handoff. So if anything, maybe your beef should be with how EA decides to represent the various skills of blocking by the O-Line.

But ultimately, yours and others' assertion that the blocking during the PA Pass is broken more often than not is completely wrong, and I'm trying to at least provide evidence rather than "petty bickering," as you put it. In fact, the "PA is broken" crowd has done far less to prove their point than the other side. So until you engage in the videos and other evidence more intelligently, it will be hard to sympathize with you at all.

It may surprise you to note that I also agree that the PA pass is mostly worthless, but not for the same reason. I think it is worthless because it is not needed - the ineffective CPU playcalling on D renders it unnecessary to even consider since there are other, easier ways to win, and they rarely tailor their playcalling to your tendencies or to anything other than the specific play you called.