Video demonstrating a flaw in the ai

[Matt10]

Quote: Originally Posted by dochalladay32

I've seen the magic CB's that know your play in Cover 2/3 against the run in the game. Just have two controllers, pick the same plays he did and watch the computer control your players in the same fashion. You can say it's practice mode and it's different, but it's just easier to show how the AI interacts there; they make the same moves in an actual game.

Yes, and I've seen it as well. I even posted this video in that thread that Oreaon posted in the slider section showing that.



What I'm saying though regardless of these issues - the testing is being done in practice mode. People do not play their dynasty games in practice mode, they do it in actual games. If he's going to post video evidence, do so in a credible arena.

Eitherway, I messaged him on youtube about it, guess he wasn't aware of the issue - from here on out, should be posting videos in-game let's hope.

[pendo]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matt10

Yes, and I've seen it as well. I even posted this video in that thread that Oreaon posted in the slider section showing that. What I'm saying though regardless of these issues - the testing is being done in practice mode. People do not play their dynasty games in practice mode, they do it in actual games. If he's going to post video evidence, do so in a credible arena. Eitherway, I messaged him on youtube about it, guess he wasn't aware of the issue - from here on out, should be posting videos in-game let's hope.

Ok, but the same issues exist regardless? Right? I think most of us agree on that.

If he does, i feel sorry for him, because that will be more annoying and time consuming...

[Matt10]

Quote: Originally Posted by pendo

Ok, but the same issues exist regardless? Right? I think most of us agree on that. If he does, i feel sorry for him, because that will be more annoying and time consuming...

Yessir! Let's hope - but no biggie. The game is improved for me now thanks to sliders, but that's for another thread.

[pendo]

Quote: Originally Posted by MagicMan1315

People like me? I am here saying that he is right, but this is something I see as such a minute detail that you would only find and see if you almost went to the extreme that he went. I have given plenty of ideas on the EA forums that I believed would progress the game. I was on EA boards last year saying that coaches would be nice. I am in no way taking credit for it but don't claim that I am "brain-dead" or "unimaginative." I want advancement in the series as much as the next guy. What I am saying is that I have seen this guy and others do videos about NCAA/Madden for like.. 3-4 years now and I have not seen any improvement on what they complain about. So it is not like he is breaking any ground either. Why? Because his method of going about it is all wrong. My issue with this video is his biased point of view. I have played like 20 games on Heisman now and I can't count the number of times I have ran an Ace TE Twin HB Stretch Rt (or which ever that formation was out of) and have seen that Strong Safety and Linebackers drop into the zone they were supposed to play. Why did they? Because I set up a short to medium passing game which the CPU was respecting. But I did not see anything of the sort in his video. He used practice mode. The CPU is so much more psychic and "reading your controller" in the Practice Mode then in the actual game. So call me crazy or a "brain dead EA Zombie" or whatever name you wish to call people who disagree with you. If it helps you sleep at night, then more power to you. I could care less. But don't get so offended if I do not jump agree with someone who clearly has a vendetta against EA and deliberately presents this biased video to gain supporters.

This part is ridiculous, versuz does not in anyway have a vendetta against ea, what the hell are you talking about? He states in this video "I believe this is the most complete football game on the next gen console." Disagree all you like with the content but do not assume the intentions of someone based on nothing.

[bamaboy082]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matt10

Great post. I told versuz that practice mode and in game played differently. That's why this video lost just a little credibility.

I've seen pre-play recognition countless times by the AI in my dynasty. I don't think this is just a practice mode issue. I thought the video was spot on because I've seen those same type things in my offline dynasty.

[Broncos86]

1) Versuz never presents his video as any kind of hate propaganda. His tone is level and constructive.
2) All of my personal experience is from in-game. I haven't personally touched practice mode for 5 years.
3) Matt and Co. are not saying "it's in practice mode so it doesn't exist." They're simply saying "get the evidence from an actual game so it maintains credibility."

I want to convey to some individuals that just because someone is critical, this doesn't mean they hate. There's a difference between making a video to simply dump on EA and a video to point out critical flaws in order to improve the game. When a man takes the time to do the latter, he is FAR from an EA basher.

[MagicMan1315]

My choice of words were incorrect. He most likely doesn't have a vendetta and like most of us, would like to see continual improvement to this series. I was just reacting to other name calling going on in the thread. My apologies.

As for Versus, he does present it calmly and fairly, but that does not mean he has presented all aspects.

And as I have stated, I do think he is correct, I just believe this detail is not as big of an issue as it is made out to be. I just think people can over look these things because when I play, I have noticed that the majority of time, things like this do not happen like illustrated in his video when I am playing in my dynasty games.

[yoda43]

Okay, so I have read (and enjoyed) everyone's posts in this thread. Some really good points for both sides of the argument. However, i feel like there is sufficient evidence that there is some kind of PRE-PLAY recognition going on by the AI. Now I'm not here to debate why this has been done, but rather offer a possible solution that might fit nicely with some of EA's new features.

My Idea revolves around EA incorporating an actual COACHING STYLE to go along with their COACHING PHILOSOPHY. This would be slightly different than just adjusting sliders for aggresivness, or RUN/PASS consistency. This would actually control what kind of COACH you actually are, which in turn should affect how the team plays. So as an example, COACH Jon Doe might run the spread, and the 3-4. But what style does he incorporate into his offense and defense. Is he an attacking offense with big runs and deep passes, a set-up style offense using a lot of play action or maybe a dink and dunk style incorporating short runs, short passes and screens. Defense could be really interesting. A team that actually has a style and runs it could open up so many possiblities for the entire game, besides the fact that i would actually enjoy watching tape and figuring out what style defense a team plays. There are different types of defenses, from blitzing defenses like the EAGLES
(i know its an NFL reference.), to bend dont break defenses, to coverage based defenses. If EA would spend some time here it could actually add some realism to the game. For example, a matchup in the game would be how will USC's physical attacking defense matchup with OREGONS big play spread offense.

Anyways, i know that was sort of a ramble.....it was a thought that just came to me. It could really add some realism to the game, and acutally make practice worth while.