Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

[somecoach]

Hey, folks, I tried to find information about what it means when a player is a gem or a bust in College Football 25, but I wasn't able to come up with any detailed answers. Here's my plan:
1. I'm going to track what the overalls are for players I end up landing.
2. I'm going to track if the player was called a gem/bust by the scouting system.
3. I'm going to track what the players' dev traits are.
4. I'm going to track the player's star level.
5. I'm going to track the player's position.

I really want to find out what the difference between a gem/bust is at different star levels so I can actually be informed on the topic. If anyone wants to add data to mine, please go ahead and contribute.

[jdb7623]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

They explained in the deep dive that a gem is basically 1 star above and a bust is 1 star below. It would be great to understand what that translates to with the data

[CoachGunns]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

They explained in the deep dive that a gem is basically 1 star above and a bust is 1 star below. It would be great to understand what that translates to with the data

Someone actually disproved this, a bust wasn't actually a bust and a gem wasn't a gem. Same start rating. Curious what results we see.

[DL1287]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

From what I've seen, a green gem means a higher chance of a good dev trait and the bust gem means they have a higher chance at normal.

The green gems and non-gems have around the same overall.

[Hipster-Doofus]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

Someone actually disproved this, a bust wasn't actually a bust and a gem wasn't a gem. Same start rating. Curious what results we see.

Yes I’ve seen this. According to some, busts and gems mean pretty much nothing. Possibly a very very small difference in rating. But actual data will help


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[Kyleimb]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

I'd need to look at a way bigger sample size but from my experience, busts seemed to have a lot more ratings caps than non busts. Since obviously they can still come in with solid ratings, I just assumed bust meant they didn't have a high ceiling. And I've also had guys with good dev traits but still a good bit of ratings caps. The way I see it, dev traits = how fast a guy earns XP and can progress but ratings caps actually determine a guys max potential. Not totally confident in that though, still a lot of unanswered questions with this stuff.

[jdb7623]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

Yes I’ve seen this. According to some, busts and gems mean pretty much nothing. Possibly a very very small difference in rating. But actual data will help


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That can't be what was intended. It must not be working properly and needs to be patched. Basically there's no point in scouting if that's how it works.

[somecoach]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

So I've gone through two recruiting classes so far. Not one 5* recruit, but I'm trying to add a bunch of players in volume. I don't really care about 2* players right now, because I don't think many people are going to actively recruit them outside of one here. Here are the early results:

4* Gem
Number: 4
Average Overall: 74.5
Dev Traits: 1 elite, 1 star, 2 impact, 0 normal

4* Normal
Number: 13
Average Overall: 74.3
Dev traits: 1 elite, 5 star, 3 impact, 4 normal

4* Bust
Number: 6
Average Overall: 73.2
Dev Traits: 0 elite, 0 star, 0 impact, 6 normal

3* Gem
Number: 14
Average Overall: 67.8
Dev Traits: 0 elite, 6 star, 8 impact, 0 normal

3* Normal
Number: 18
Average Overall: 66.6
Dev Traits: 0 elite, 1 star, 7 impact, 10 normal

3* Bust
Number: 8
Average Overall: 67.1
Dev Traits: 0 elite, 1 star, 1 impact, 6 normal

I wonder if busts and gems only impact the dev traits? If you don't care about the stars at all, which seem to have a much stronger correlation to overalls, then it looks like:

Gem: 1 elite, 7 star, 10 impact, 0 normal
Normal: 1 elite, 6 star, 10 impact, 14 normal
Bust: 0 elite, 1 star, 1 impact, 12 normal

I avoided JuCo players and treated ATH players like the position they showed up on when you flip through recruiting tabs.

[Kyleimb]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

Good stuff, results seem to reflect what you'd expect. I'm sill curious what a comparison of the caps would look like too.

[somecoach]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

Good stuff, results seem to reflect what you'd expect. I'm sill curious what a comparison of the caps would look like too.

Like overalls? So far, this is what I have

4* gem: 74-76 overall
4* normal: 73-76 overall
4* bust: 72-75 overall

3* gem: 65-70 overall
3* normal: 61 (athlete, next lowest was 64)-69 overall
3* bust: 65-72 overall (next highest is 68, might have been an athlete too)

Generally, it seems like the star rating is around the same ballpark no matter gem/normal/bust. What changes is the rate of dev traits. I only have a sample size of 63 players so far. I'll keep cranking out some data when I'm back on the PS5.

[Tweeg]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

The whole thing is just silly. You shouldn’t know if they’re a gem or bust until they show up on campus and are already on your team.

[Ghost Of The Year]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

The whole thing is just silly. You shouldn’t know if they’re a gem or bust until they show up on campus and are already on your team.

And maybe played some games too?

[Kyleimb]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

Like overalls? So far, this is what I have

4* gem: 74-76 overall
4* normal: 73-76 overall
4* bust: 72-75 overall

3* gem: 65-70 overall
3* normal: 61 (athlete, next lowest was 64)-69 overall
3* bust: 65-72 overall (next highest is 68, might have been an athlete too)

Generally, it seems like the star rating is around the same ballpark no matter gem/normal/bust. What changes is the rate of dev traits. I only have a sample size of 63 players so far. I'll keep cranking out some data when I'm back on the PS5.

No, not overalls. The caps on how high the rating groupings or whatever the hell you wanna call them can increase. The second page on the player card. You'll notice the grey blocks at the end of some of the groups which is where that player can no longer increase those ratings. Some players have a lot of them, meaning even if they progress quickly, there's a hard ceiling that will keep them from progressing further at certain points.

My experience and I guess loose theory is that this may also be an effect of a guy being a bust. More caps on the ratings groups so a lower ceiling than similarly rated players that aren't busts. I just haven't tracked this in any meaningful way to say for sure.

[fballturkey]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

The whole thing is just silly. You shouldn’t know if they’re a gem or bust until they show up on campus and are already on your team.

I mostly agree, but the way the game is handling it, where it’s pretty opaque but maybe nudges OVR a tad higher or means a potential improvement in dev trait, seems pretty fair as to what your scout could be telling you.

[iceman43]

Re: Let's Figure Out What Gems/Busts Mean

I believe it's about their ceiling and floor. Of how well they will develop

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