APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

[RogueHominid]

For the record, I've cleared this thread topic with Millenium, who has given it the green light so long as discussion remains civilized. Please let's do that. No ad hominem or reductio ad absurdum, please.

What I want to discuss is the general reactions to Madden by APF fans. What are those of us who have played this game and loved it feeling/thinking about Madden?

To focus the discussion, I'll ask a few starter questions, and we'll see where it goes.

1) Do you think APF will remain relevant after Madden drops; i.e. will it still get serious gaming time from you.
2) What have you seen from Madden 10 that makes you say "they moved the sport forward" just like you saw APF and said "they moved 2k5 forward"?
3) What still seems to stand out about APF from the evidence we have so far about Madden?
4) Are you planning on spending serious time with Madden 10?
5) This one is purely for self-interest: how many would be interested in an online franchise with APF players--in other words, playing online in Madden with guys who play APF whom we know are real football-heads?

So there goes. Talk amongst yourselves.

[NFLHITMAN]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

For the record, I've cleared this thread topic with Millenium, who has given it the green light so long as discussion remains civilized. Please let's do that. No ad hominem or reductio ad absurdum, please.

What I want to discuss is the general reactions to Madden by APF fans. What are those of us who have played this game and loved it feeling/thinking about Madden?

To focus the discussion, I'll ask a few starter questions, and we'll see where it goes.

1) Do you think APF will remain relevant after Madden drops; i.e. will it still get serious gaming time from you.
2) What have you seen from Madden 10 that makes you say "they moved the sport forward" just like you saw APF and said "they moved 2k5 forward"?
3) What still seems to stand out about APF from the evidence we have so far about Madden?
4) Are you planning on spending serious time with Madden 10?
5) This one is purely for self-interest: how many would be interested in an online franchise with APF players--in other words, playing online in Madden with guys who play APF whom we know are real football-heads?

So there goes. Talk amongst yourselves.

1. I plan on playing the hell out of Madden 10!
2. Presentation, Online Franchise, Trading, Drafts and more!
3. Player movement and momentum.
4. YES!
5. I will always love playing any game with my APF brethren simply because most are cool guys who like REAL football.

I have a league set up all ready in my blog. 32 owners so hopefully it does well!

[gjsii13]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

For the record, I've cleared this thread topic with Millenium, who has given it the green light so long as discussion remains civilized. Please let's do that. No ad hominem or reductio ad absurdum, please.

What I want to discuss is the general reactions to Madden by APF fans. What are those of us who have played this game and loved it feeling/thinking about Madden?

To focus the discussion, I'll ask a few starter questions, and we'll see where it goes.

1) Do you think APF will remain relevant after Madden drops; i.e. will it still get serious gaming time from you.
2) What have you seen from Madden 10 that makes you say "they moved the sport forward" just like you saw APF and said "they moved 2k5 forward"?
3) What still seems to stand out about APF from the evidence we have so far about Madden?
4) Are you planning on spending serious time with Madden 10?
5) This one is purely for self-interest: how many would be interested in an online franchise with APF players--in other words, playing online in Madden with guys who play APF whom we know are real football-heads?

So there goes. Talk amongst yourselves.

1. NFL 2k5 Gets more of my gaming time nowadays (I played APF nonstop for a year).

2. Honestly, nothing. 2k5 set too high of a standard for presentation. The new Pro-Tak system, is the biggest joke I have seen so far. I love how it is being sooooooo hyped. If I want a good engine for tackles, I will go with Backbreaker.

3. The Pocket looks much better to me in APF. The natural player movement as well. Madden players still move like robots. Look at Sanchez's feet in this vid:
http://www.operationsports.com/forum...-gameplay.html

They shuffle like he is on ice.

4. No.

5. Maybe. With the engine Madden runs on, doubtfully. I prefer to enjoy a true football experience in APF.

*Just for consideration*

I am extremely excited to see what Backbreaker can bring to the table. That is a game that I am excited for. I need a new, fresh take on football.

[Pappy Knuckles]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

Online franchise has me very intrigued (go Colts!) and the clips look pretty good. I don't think APF will ever totally die but I actually look forward to trying this years Madden. If it plays well on the field I can see myself putting in a lot of time with it.

[NovaStar]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

Well. I am a big 2k football fan (especially 2k5). I haven't purchased a madden game since 2003(the one with Marshall Faulk on the cover). I have been observing pretty much everything that has been going on with Madden10. I must say I am intrigued, but am reserved to the fact that when it comes to madden, you have to play it first to really see what the game offers.

The cutscenes look good (basically a copy of 2k5 cutscenes with updated next gen power), the tackling looks good. Graphics seem for the most part well done. What is getting me is the qb motions. In the jet/seattle footage ( I think that who it was) the qb's feet move entirely too fast. It is tolerable, but after playing apf and 2k5, you get spoiled by how the qb's move in that game compared to other games.

Also, how do you not really appreciate the signature qb's in APF? concering madden10, are the qb's going to have different qb motions or different qb ability? In APF, the signature play of say Dan Marino is two fold, first the apf qb has the exact playing stlye of marino, and second, it has the exact ability of dan marino. One gets two entirely different experiences if you play with dan as opposed to Steve Young, or Randall Cunningham. I am curious by what madden means when they say signature qb style. Time will tell.

Lastly, I am very curious about the presentation, this is the one thing that sets the great 2k5 apart from any other football game (including APF), from the opening espn tease, to the tailgating, to people taking their seats(or others for that matter) to the pregame warm ups, to the halftime hightlights etc...2k5 broke the freakin mold inregards to presentation.

The one presentation package that really keeps me going back to 2k5 is the halftime and postgame highlights. Unlike other people, I never get tired of sitting back at halftime or post game and watching how my game unfolded while playing, of watching that great pass I completed or that great run I pulled off. It never gets old to me. So if madden can get a halftime/postgame highlight package like 2k5, I might consider buying the game for the first time in 2 years. We will see.

[Valdarez]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

I have been following Madden 10 pretty closely now for going on a couple of months. They have closed the gaps in some areas, expanded in others, but still trail in many key areas in the game.

1) Do you think APF will remain relevant after Madden drops; i.e. will it still get serious gaming time from you.

Yes. From what I have seen of the game play, I don't believe Madden 10's game play will be able to keep me interested. The lack of proper momentum / physics and route based passing will always put Madden behind APF2K8 in my book.


2) What have you seen from Madden 10 that makes you say "they moved the sport forward" just like you saw APF and said "they moved 2k5 forward"?

Procedural Tackling aka Pro-Tak (many call gang tackling, but its far more than gang tackles). The ability to procedurally manipulate the tackles is huge. We have seen really poor examples thus far, but the idea is sound, and once they get it polished it will add a lot to the realism of the game.

Another area is Fight for the Fumble. Some fans like this feature, others don't. The mechanics aside, the fact that it does happen is neat (and the graphics look good too). This is something we have never seen in a football game.


3) What still seems to stand out about APF from the evidence we have so far about Madden?

• Momentum / Physics (locomotion)
• Route Based Passing
• Touch Passing (Madden still looks like it's fire or lob)
• Route/Coverage Reads (problems in Madden due to lack of momentum/physics)
• Pocket (APF2K8 just has it right, Madden is still struggling to get there)
• Commentary (Hammond is down and out horrible)
• Swagger (slowing down players as they enter the end zone)
• QB Avoid (Madden supposedly has this, but no video evidence to support the claim yet)
• Kicking Mechanism (many don't like it, but it's more realistic)
• Replays (madden is better, but their cameras need a LOT of work... there's way too much jerking/snapping going on, even in Madden 10)
• League Websites (we have not evidence that Madden 10 has anything to compete with APF2K8 League websites)

4) Are you planning on spending serious time with Madden 10?

I plan on giving it a try, once I can get a copy off of eBay for a decent price (used). Because of EA's play for the NFL license, I just can't ever see giving them my money straight up again.

Without the momentum/physics and especially the route based passing, I don't think Madden will be able to hold my attention. Passing is a huge part of the game, and after enjoying APF2K8's route based passing mechanism, it's difficult to take a step back and play Madden's straight line throwing one. I will always feel like I'm playing a last gen game game without the momentum/route based passing.


5) This one is purely for self-interest: how many would be interested in an online franchise with APF players--in other words, playing online in Madden with guys who play APF whom we know are real football-heads?

I would play it, but if the game doesn't hold my interest, I'm not sure I could commit to finishing it. I tried offline franchise in Madden '09 and only made it 8 games in before the gameplay, repetitive commentary basically ruined it for me.

BTW if you're wondering what I meant by route based passing in my answers above, here's an example.

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[Phobia]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

1) It will always remain in my collection, but APF will get less play time.

2) I think the presentation is a good step forward for madden. But the big addition I am happy for is Pro-Tak and a much better pocket.

3) I think APF will always remain as more of a "Thinking mans" football game. Were madden will be more action based. So i think APF will always have its place.

4) I am playing to play through my first complete season in madden since 05......whooaaa what a year this will be lol

5) Like Hitman mentioned. I will be bringing the Vikings up to the superbowl in the ONLINE franchise Hitman got setup. We have a good bit of guys from the APF boards. Schemer, hitman, Mkoz, creatinkasey, andromada, boxboy, and then a bit from the madden boards.

[DJ]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

I like Ian (anyone that rolls with an LT avatar is cool in my book) and think he has the Madden franchise pointed in the right direction.

The gang-tackling addition looks cool; I just hope we don't see a ton of 9-man tackles each game. If we get 2-4 players wrapping up guys on several plays a game, I'll be very happy.

The presentation looks like it's received some attention as well, so that's good. I actually played a good bit of 09 but eventually stopped because the game couldn't hold my attention.

I recently picked up NFL Head Coach 09 and LOVE that game! Seriously, it's going to be hard for me to put that game down and I'd imagine I'll be playing that as my main source of NFL football this year. I'll certainly give Madden 10 a look, but until I actually play it and get a feel for the game, I can't say yet how long I'll stick with it.

I'll always have room for APF but with Head Coach and a few other games eating up my time, it's not getting the run it did 6 months ago.

[DCMC]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

1. I'll play APF every now & then so my record won't reset
2. Nothing really, lol
3. Presentation & route running
4. Yes
5. I'd be interested in that

[mKoz26]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

1) It will always remain in my collection, but APF will get less play time.

2) I think the presentation is a good step forward for madden. But the big addition I am happy for is Pro-Tak and a much better pocket.

3) I think APF will always remain as more of a "Thinking mans" football game. Were madden will be more action based. So i think APF will always have its place.

4) I am playing to play through my first complete season in madden since 05......whooaaa what a year this will be lol

5) Like Hitman mentioned. I will be bringing the Vikings up to the superbowl in the ONLINE franchise Hitman got setup. We have a good bit of guys from the APF boards. Schemer, hitman, Mkoz, creatinkasey, andromada, boxboy, and then a bit from the madden boards.

You will never see a division title, I can assure you of that.

[ANDROMADA 1]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

well,like every year of madden I will check it out(rent) and go from there.From the vids that have been posted it still seems for a lack of a better word generic and robotic.It appears that all the players move the same no matter the attributes,but like I said I will play it myself and reserve my final judgements.One of the many great things about APF is you actually have to practice using the diff legends cause no two play exactly alike,that alone makes the game seem more authentic.We'll see what happens when the gm finally drops.Either way I will always enjoy playing APF.I have meet some great football minds just by playing a gm that is over 2yrs old and that to me is priceless.

[Phobia]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

You will never see a division title, I can assure you of that.

Don't worry when I run all over you with Adrian Peterson it will feel like old times for you. Trying to stop "All day" will remind you of APF all over again

[elgreazy1]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

1) Do you think APF will remain relevant after Madden drops; i.e. will it still get serious gaming time from you.

I've already started backing away from APF due to 2K completely turning it's shoulder to the entire core group of folks that helped it become a hit. For a company to just turn tail & run and never seem to offer support, let alone information regarding a title really turned me sour on 2K. The way 2K treated the community & the supporters was downright disgusting, in my book.

As much as I loved ESPN2K5 & APF, I'm not a brand elitist, and I will happily put my money towards any product I deem worthy. It appears, though, that APF is dying a slow death.

2) What have you seen from Madden 10 that makes you say "they moved the sport forward" just like you saw APF and said "they moved 2k5 forward"?

I like the "gang tackling" idea but I won't state a final judement until I play (rent) the game. I'm also a big fan of the Online Franchise, which is something that people will absolutely love if implemented right. The presentation finally looks like it might have caught up to NFL2K5 -- yes, a 5 year old game -- but regardless, Ian clearly has stated that a lot of what Madden is trying to do is replicate a lot of what 2K did right.

But we know EA and we know how bad they can fudge things up on first-time installments.

3) What still seems to stand out about APF from the evidence we have so far about Madden?

The players & game engine. Simply put, APF plays as close to real life football as you can get with player movement & momentum, playcalling & schemes, and animations (blocking, running, route running, etc).

Another big plus in APF is that players "come alive" in that they perform much like their real life counterparts. Emmitt is versatily, Means/Campbell/Okoye are beasts, Derrick Thomas is speedy & rangy, Lott is downright dominate, etc. On the flip side, I've never felt any Madden player "feels" like his real-life counterpart. For example, when playing with the Cowboys, not once did running with Barber feel any different than running with Jones except for a slight difference in speed. Those players have dynamically different run styles, yet it wasn't captured at all.

That being said, this is one of Madden's supposed key points of interest this year. Ian & the development team have stated they've gone the extra mile to attempt to replicate the real NFL, so we shall see.

4) Are you planning on spending serious time with Madden 10?

Yes, I will rent it (Gamefly or local store) and if it's worthy of a purchase, I'll definitely purchase the game. But as Val stated, because I don't agree with monoplies myself, I will only purchased used.

5) This one is purely for self-interest: how many would be interested in an online franchise with APF players--in other words, playing online in Madden with guys who play APF whom we know are real football-heads?

I'd prefer my fellow APF brethren over any other. I've got to know alot of these guys in the last 2-3 years and it's been a pleasure. I'm a big fan of the personal rivalries, the homerism, the sharing of knowledge, etc because we are all real people who love real football. Plus, these guys all do play a real game of football and have developed their own schemes & playstyles over the years so in essence, it actually feels like you are playing against other "coaches": some guys love the 3-4, others love the ground & pound, others air-strike, west coast, etc. We all play different versions of real football.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

Honestly, if all pans out, NCAA may be the game that retires me from APF. Create a School, online dynasty, offline dysnasty and never ending recruiting.

Madden? Who knows. The gang tackling-running back interactions have me worried. I cant get that image of Willie Parker dragging tacklers out of my head.

If Madden pans out, and Online Franchise is the real deal, then I'm Ghost. I'll be busy in Hitman's online franchise, developing Mark Sanchez into a super star =o)

[TheShizNo1]

Re: APF Players' Response to Madden 10 News

1) Do you think APF will remain relevant after Madden drops; i.e. will it still get serious gaming time from you.

I think it will remain relevant to those mainly on this board. The ones on this board, IMO, repsect this as an authentic football game and not just a video game. I will definitely still play it. I've actually commited to playing my 1st season all the way through. I'm having a great time w/ it. When I 1st got this, I thought their was really no replay value to it b/c of not franchise. But then I discovered w/ all the ways to design a team, This games life is limitless for me.

2) What have you seen from Madden 10 that makes you say "they moved the sport forward" just like you saw APF and said "they moved 2k5 forward"?

The pro tak, player models, lighting. This may be unfair for me to judge also, b/c I haven't been keeping up w/ the recent videos or blogs.

3) What still seems to stand out about APF from the evidence we have so far about Madde

Player movement. WR/DB, OL/DL interaction. The pocket. W/ the way this game sets up a pocket, how a pocket can shift to the left or to the right, I love sitting in the pocket throwing.

4) Are you planning on spending serious time with Madden 10?

Eh...I rented 08, played 09 for a little more than 2 weeks. Didn't like 07. Probably not. Head coach, APF, NCAA09 on the PS2 (I may give the next gen a chance b/c I love college football) and 2K5 are enought to hold my football appettite.

5) This one is purely for self-interest: how many would be interested in an online franchise with APF players--in other words, playing online in Madden with guys who play APF whom we know are real football-heads?

Nope. I don't see myself spending much time w/ it.