Post-E3 pass rush update

[Ian_Cummings]

I know coming out of E3 there were some concerns around the effectiveness of the pass rush. So tonight I wanted to run some tests and see where we stood (as some tuning took place over the week while we were gone).

In practice mode - on All-Pro - I took the Titans offense (the best offensive line in the league) and matched up against the Colts defense (relatively good pass rushing group). On offense, I called a spread formation with the back going out of the backfield leaving me with only the 5 OL to block. On the defensive side, I called a default 4-3 defense - 2 Man Press - which only has the 4 down linemen rushing straight ahead (with no stunts or anything).

I ran 20 straight plays and did nothing with the QB other than stand there. I then ran 20 more plays, but this time I used the QB avoidance stick to step up in the pocket and/or avoid the edge rushers. Sometimes I would break the sack, other times it wouldn't help me at all. Lastly, I moved the CPU pass rushing slider to 100 and ran 20 more plays just standing there waiting for the sack. On all of these plays, I sat here with a stopwatch and timed exactly how long from the snap it took me to get sacked on each play. Here are the results:

PassRushNumbers.JPG

Overall, I am decently happy with these results. After all, I've got the best offensive line in the game, and the Colts are only bringing their 4 down linemen, and it still definitely didn't feel like I had all day back there by any stretch. There were definitely a few weird anomalies here and there that I am going to take in and get addressed by the gameplay guys tomorrow, but it seems that with the recent tuning that happened while we were away at E3 - this luckily doesn't seem to be any kind of "game killer" at the moment.

Just FYI - the two main issues that seemed worth tuning - 1) the set-up depth of the pocket (it goes more 'wide' than 'deep' often times), and 2) getting rid of these random animation anomalies where I'd end up with 6+ seconds.

I'll make sure to update everyone as we make any fixes to the 2 items above.

[J Masta J]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

I know coming out of E3 there were some concerns around the effectiveness of the pass rush. So tonight I wanted to run some tests and see where we stood (as some tuning took place over the week while we were gone).

In practice mode - on All-Pro - I took the Titans offense (the best offensive line in the league) and matched up against the Colts defense (relatively good pass rushing group). On offense, I called a spread formation with the back going out of the backfield leaving me with only the 5 OL to block. On the defensive side, I called a default 4-3 defense - 2 Man Press - which only has the 4 down linemen rushing straight ahead (with no stunts or anything).

I ran 20 straight plays and did nothing with the QB other than stand there. I then ran 20 more plays, but this time I used the QB avoidance stick to step up in the pocket and/or avoid the edge rushers. Sometimes I would break the sack, other times it wouldn't help me at all. Lastly, I moved the CPU pass rushing slider to 100 and ran 20 more plays just standing there waiting for the sack. On all of these plays, I sat here with a stopwatch and timed exactly how long from the snap it took me to get sacked on each play. Here are the results:

[ATTACH]17056[/ATTACH]

Overall, I am decently happy with these results. After all, I've got the best offensive line in the game, and the Colts are only bringing their 4 down linemen, and it still definitely didn't feel like I had all day back there by any stretch. There were definitely a few weird anomalies here and there that I am going to take in and get addressed by the gameplay guys tomorrow, but it seems that with the recent tuning that happened while we were away at E3 - this luckily doesn't seem to be any kind of "game killer" at the moment.

Just FYI - the two main issues that seemed worth tuning - 1) the set-up depth of the pocket (it goes more 'wide' than 'deep' often times), and 2) getting rid of these random animation anomalies where I'd end up with 6+ seconds.

I'll make sure to update everyone as we make any fixes to the 2 items above.

Sounds sexy!

[shotgun styles]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

I'd like to see how tight the pocket is now. In the E3 build the O-line still looked like a wall. Is the pocket surrounding the QB now?

[I Peench]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Sounds great, Ian. Thanks.

[stopper654]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Thans for the update Ian

[JHova1982]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

if the D-line is getting pushed down from engaging the O-line, then thats a game killer too.

ian can u please test a weak D-line crew against the TITANS. IMO thats the true test i need

[Hooe]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Good stuff, thanks for the update.

[Ian_Cummings]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

I'd like to see how tight the pocket is now. In the E3 build the O-line still looked like a wall. Is the pocket surrounding the QB now?

Seemed half and half when I checked tonight. This line alludes to that issue:

1) the set-up depth of the pocket (it goes more 'wide' than 'deep' often times)
I think what's happening is that the Pro-Tak steering stuff isn't quite working correctly all the time...the OL seem to be pushing the DL out laterally instead of pushing them upfield (behind the QB). I am thinking this should be a pretty simple adjustment...will update soon.

[acidraindrops08]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Thank you. Keep up the hard work guys !!

[parrothead]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Dude, your just like one of us. Who hasn't sat with a stopwatch, and timed forty yard dashes all night trying to get it just right? Or charted actual missed blocks in a notebook. I bet this took a good while, thanks for the effort.

Do you get basically the same results with the 3-4 teams?

[cdiddy71323]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Ian, that is just an amazing job. I honestly think that yall are ahead of The Show in terms of developing. I don't think any other game developers would take the time to do something like this. Great job and I love the amount of input you guys are putting into this game.

GREAT JOB!!!!!!!

[Cusefan]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Sounds good Ian, Keep up the good work

[RogueHominid]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

It's great to see some statistical analysis, and those numbers are very good. I did this for the E3 vids, and there were longer times on average. I wonder why the discrepancy.

As long as the average is close to 3 seconds, that's golden. That's where it needs to be.

I think that any tuning to move the rush upfield instead of wide will be a huge boon.

I very much appreciate you addressing this criticism of the E3 vids in such a straightforward and intellectually honest way.

[whoady4shoady]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

I know coming out of E3 there were some concerns around the effectiveness of the pass rush. So tonight I wanted to run some tests and see where we stood (as some tuning took place over the week while we were gone).

In practice mode - on All-Pro - I took the Titans offense (the best offensive line in the league) and matched up against the Colts defense (relatively good pass rushing group). On offense, I called a spread formation with the back going out of the backfield leaving me with only the 5 OL to block. On the defensive side, I called a default 4-3 defense - 2 Man Press - which only has the 4 down linemen rushing straight ahead (with no stunts or anything).

I ran 20 straight plays and did nothing with the QB other than stand there. I then ran 20 more plays, but this time I used the QB avoidance stick to step up in the pocket and/or avoid the edge rushers. Sometimes I would break the sack, other times it wouldn't help me at all. Lastly, I moved the CPU pass rushing slider to 100 and ran 20 more plays just standing there waiting for the sack. On all of these plays, I sat here with a stopwatch and timed exactly how long from the snap it took me to get sacked on each play. Here are the results:

[ATTACH]17056[/ATTACH]

Overall, I am decently happy with these results. After all, I've got the best offensive line in the game, and the Colts are only bringing their 4 down linemen, and it still definitely didn't feel like I had all day back there by any stretch. There were definitely a few weird anomalies here and there that I am going to take in and get addressed by the gameplay guys tomorrow, but it seems that with the recent tuning that happened while we were away at E3 - this luckily doesn't seem to be any kind of "game killer" at the moment.

Just FYI - the two main issues that seemed worth tuning - 1) the set-up depth of the pocket (it goes more 'wide' than 'deep' often times), and 2) getting rid of these random animation anomalies where I'd end up with 6+ seconds.

I'll make sure to update everyone as we make any fixes to the 2 items above.

You need a row in that chart for what happens when you scramble left or right out of the pocket to really prove whether the pocket is doing its job or not. A vid of each scenerio would be nice too, becasue all these vids that have been posted over the past week have been pretty lack luster to awful in the pocket department.

[green94]

Re: Post-E3 pass rush update

Ian is in a league of his own, no doubt. Great work.