NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

[PhantomLord]

Hi all,

I'm noticing a serious problem going on here at OS, and I wanted to try to do something to help fix it. There are a few fantastic threads highlighting issues with NBA 2K17. The problem is, there is FAR TOO MUCH undeserving praise and high reviews going on, and that's an issue. Like you guys, I want the best basketball game possible. 2K basketball has been the gold standard for years, and it no longer is.

Please read on, and don't judge me or just say I'm hating. That is not what this is about.

The problem is summed up simply. Imagine if you are playing FIFA, or PES, and randomly, several times a game, your goalie or the AI goalie just randomly runs away from the net when the offense gets close, allowing an easy, free goal.

Would that be fun to you? Would you keep playing it? Would you be able to, with a straight face, say the game is a 9 out of 10?

Well, that's NBA 2K17's defense in a nutshell. It is flat out broken. All the 8.5, 9, 9.5 review scores are sending a terrible message to 2K - it's OK to release a broken game, because we don't care. The developers need to know what's wrong, and they need to know it isn't OK to just let this happen and not fix it. This game was NOT ready for release, and so far, through all the threads, tweets, YouTube videos, etc., I've yet to see a single developer acknowledge the defensive problems.

I don't know if the issue is people not having basketball knowledge, or just being blind to the issues, or what. The game is fun, no doubt. It plays great in many ways, no doubt. But it has fundamental, massive, glaring problems that make it unplayable to me, and many others on this site.

Pick and roll defense doesn't work properly. Transition defense doesn't work properly. Defensive rotation doesn't work properly. Defenders randomly, literally, run AWAY from their man and stand far away from them, doing nothing, allowing easy, wide open shots.

Have you ever noticed that the AI (if you're playing the computer) seems to get a lot of WIDE OPEN shots? Have you ever taken the time to look at a replay of what happened? You should. It's eye opening and incredibly disappointing. It's not an organic thing. It's not bad defense. It's not great offense. It's BROKEN programming in the defensive AI causing many issues.

Some videos to demonstrate, courtesy of 33JAF, Smoove, and some others...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/5whUDJRHS7I" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/FQHUZBW93yY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/jhVGWc6SZhc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/1fnJXemPP2c" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Please don't dismiss this as random occurrences or "just bad defenders." This is a problem. It's not every play... but it's a lot more often than people seem to realize. All I want is to keep attention called to this, and make sure the devs see what's going on. Because this game is great in so many ways, but it needs some big fixes to actually represent the game of basketball.

[phriscaul]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

Mike Wang and the other guys know that these are legitimate issues. Anything from anybody here that says otherwise is coddling.

[Marty Funkhouser]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

Most reviewers aren't that invested in sports titles and thus don't bother to really put forth the analysis to properly review these titles.

[RunN1st]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

Why oh, why did I open this thread? Ignorance is bliss but I can't un see this.

[PhantomLord]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

Why oh, why did I open this thread? Ignorance is bliss but I can't un see this.

Ugh, I'm sorry my man. While I want people to see this, obviously, I also don't want to ruin someone's fun experience. It's a fine line, but I really want to see this stuff fixed, because this game is SO FREAKING GOOD in so many ways and I want to play it and have fun!

[Vni]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

I don't doubt that the AI and Ace does a lot of stupid ****. I don't doubt that MyCareer is a mess because you have no control.

But if you turn ace off and set your team properly it's working fine.

Look at the settings I set before this game and look how the AI applys them. No one is leaving their man besides Drummond who I have on gap on Noah just so he can be in the paint.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/raf5Kqlguv0" allowfullscreen="" height="315" frameborder="0" width="560"></iframe>

I'am willing to upload the other quarters if need be.

[de_jesus]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

I don't doubt that the AI and Ace does a lot of stupid ****. I don't doubt that MyCareer is a mess because you have no control.

But if you turn ace off and set your team properly it's working fine.

Look at the settings I set before this game and look how the AI applys them. No one is leaving their man besides Drummond who I have on gap on Noah just so he can be in the paint.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/raf5Kqlguv0" allowfullscreen="" height="315" frameborder="0" width="560"></iframe>

I'am willing to upload the other quarters if need be.

Thanks for this. I sometimes flio flop between Defense works and it doesn't. But I think it works but there are obvious breakdowns and those can be frustrating.

I think players who post this video should be required to post their defensive settings amd player ratings. I like to use D. Russell or Clarkson as an example. No matter what their settings are they are terrible defenders and expecting good defense from them is lunacy. Same with LOTS of other players

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[335TDC]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

These issues are legit, but I THINK that a lot of them can be obviated by using Defensive Settings in game from the pause menu. Now...

Why isn't that menu available in the matchup menu during loading? Sigh...

Why isn't that menu available in the MyGM hub, say the calendar, before choosing to play or sim? Sigh...

WHY ISN'T THERE AN IN-GAME EXPLANATION OF ALL OF THE DEFENSIVE SETTINGS SO PEOPLE CAN UNDERSTAND HOW THEY AFFECT THE GAME?

Sigh...

[PhantomLord]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

I don't doubt that the AI and Ace does a lot of stupid ****. I don't doubt that MyCareer is a mess because you have no control.

But if you turn ace off and set your team properly it's working fine.

Look at the settings I set before this game and look how the AI applys them. No one is leaving their man besides Drummond who I have on gap on Noah just so he can be in the paint.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/raf5Kqlguv0" allowfullscreen="" height="315" frameborder="0" width="560"></iframe>

I'am willing to upload the other quarters if need be.

This is super encouraging. I'm starting to see people question if ACE is causing all the issues, so it's worth looking at more closely.

The only thing I saw that I had an issue with is at 6:50, when Noah just shoves a defender out of the play. That happens pretty often to me, but it's not really a defense issue as it is a collision issue. It should probably be an offensive foul.

This looks good to me. My only question to you - were you seeing the same issues that I posted before? Is that why you're not using ACE?

[335TDC]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

Thanks for this. I sometimes flio flop between Defense works and it doesn't. But I think it works but there are obvious breakdowns and those can be frustrating.

I think players who post this video should be required to post their defensive settings amd player ratings. I like to use D. Russell or Clarkson as an example. No matter what their settings are they are terrible defenders and expecting good defense from them is lunacy. Same with LOTS of other players

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

So true! And the OP needs to consider this very important factor. You can set up the best D in the world with perfect settings, but if D Rose is your point guard, good luck...!

I only wish they would have put in the Harden clueless D animations, that would have been TOO perfect...

[Americas Team]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

Most reviews are based off the "honeymoon stage", due to lack of time with the game. I think OS needs to move away from getting the review out asap just so some (most likely a very small amount) people can make a decision on rather to buy the game or not and they need to wait maybe a month or so after release so they can thoroughly assess these sports titles.

[Vni]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

This is super encouraging. I'm starting to see people question if ACE is causing all the issues, so it's worth looking at more closely.

The only thing I saw that I had an issue with is at 6:50, when Noah just shoves a defender out of the play. That happens pretty often to me, but it's not really a defense issue as it is a collision issue. It should probably be an offensive foul.

This looks good to me. My only question to you - were you seeing the same issues that I posted before? Is that why you're not using ACE?

Yeah Noah pushing me in the paint is annoying but I'am afraid they might go for a quick fix that might hurt the game more than this issue itself. Like making on ball D weaker, making on ball/off ball screens inefective.

As far as Ace I just have turned it off very quickly. I don't want the AI to be making decisions for me.

I have played about 7 online 12 minutes game with it off and unless there was a major breakdown in my defense I don't recall one of theses frustrating moment where you realise the AI has left someone wide open for no reason.

[33JAF]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

I'll be testing with ACE off later today. I hope this helps. Good stuff, vni.

[PhantomLord]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

So true! And the OP needs to consider this very important factor. You can set up the best D in the world with perfect settings, but if D Rose is your point guard, good luck...!

I only wish they would have put in the Harden clueless D animations, that would have been TOO perfect...

You and de_Jesus are really missing the point, here. Mistakes happen, even with awesome defenders. Every play should not be perfectly defended by everyone.

However, what these videos are showing aren't just mistakes. They are broken AI. The one with the classic Bulls is all AI and on highest difficulty. And world class players are running awayfrom their man FOR NO REASON.

[335TDC]

Re: NBA = FIFA, if goalies randomly ran away from the net to let you score

You and de_Jesus are really missing the point, here. Mistakes happen, even with awesome defenders. Every play should not be perfectly defended by everyone.

However, what these videos are showing aren't just mistakes. They are broken AI. The one with the classic Bulls is all AI and on highest difficulty. And world class players are running awayfrom their man FOR NO REASON.

Not missing the point and not arguing, just observing.

Did you use defensive settings in the pause menu before playing? If so, I think that a video showing those things should be accompanied by the defensive settings you're using.

I'm not defending the game or bashing you, and I think that 2k has a lot of work to do in patches. But I MYSELF am trying to understand defensive settings better to avoid seeing these things in my own games.