The sorry state of sports gaming

[ThePride1987]

Guys, why do we continue to allow this? Those of us who are franchise mode truthers are getting boned right now. Micro transactions are not just the future, we're living in it. Modes like DD and MUT (or even PT for you OOTP ppl out there) have gutted our precious franchise modes. A lot of you either make excuses or desparately try to find work-arounds though instead of putting your foot diwn and saying....enough!

Teams like SDS and OOTP are companies, they exist to make money...I think you forget that sometimes. I see people in the OOTP forums blindly hoping Perfect team will merely mean better developing and more resources, when The Show fans would tell you that's a load of crap. If people want to continue blowing 100s into digital cards that grossly depreciate over a year...then the sad truth is those game modes will be the future, and franchise modes will eventually disappear.

I for one do not want to continue supporting this type of behavior, $60 should be plenty to expect a proper, functioning baseball game. I wish instead of defending this new behavior of loyal consumers getting the shaft, that we in the gaming community actually draw a line in the sand, and not let companies run roughshot on us. I'm disgusted that I paid my $60 for the show, I was lied to that there would be franchise mode. What I got was a broken mess.

[Gagnon39]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

Not sure why you’re surprised. All sports games have been trending toward catering to online modes for years now. But being lied to about having franchise mode? Um, not sure about that. We all knew it would be there, just essentially unchanged, as per usual.

I’ve said for many years that until they can figure out how to monetize franchise mode it will continue to get less and less attention.


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[kinsmen7]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

But being lied to about having franchise mode? Um, not sure about that. We all knew it would be there, just essentially unchanged, as per usual.

Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

Agree 100%.

I held off buying for a month or so because of the feedback here.

The google machine provides a ton of reviews for this game, as does this forum. I'm not sure how someone could go into this "surprised" as to the result.

[JHodges57]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

This is why I'm slowly but surely getting away from sporting games. In fact, I am spending about 95% of my time with RDR2. I paid a set price for RDR2 and can play it for what seems like forever without spending one more cent.

As far as sports games, I'd rather pay $100 or $150 up front for the game and have a player that's good enough to compete so I can earn upgrades through playing rather than having to pay to get my player up to a level higher than a high school player so I can compete (NBA2k). With 1 year cycles in sports games, you have no choice but to pay up if you plan on playing a season before the next version comes out.

I feel this is the last The Show I buy since I really haven't been playing it much at all. Maybe 1 game every week or 2. I am a franchise player (MoM). I do have a text based game I prefer (not OOTP) which I play when I'm in a baseball mood.

[shawn306]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

I am going to sit and wait and see what Madden 20 looks like and if they really overhaul franchise mode. Maybe if SDS sees that maybe it gets them to overhaul their Franchise mode

[FSanchez12]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

While I don't think it's too much to ask for minor QOL improvements to Franchise mode, I also am realistic in my expectations for this mode. Microtransactions rule the sports gaming world, and will continue to rule this landscape until they run their course, or legislation is passed that bans it/makes it more difficult for a 13 year old to run up their dad's Credit Card on stubs. You'd be surprised how much adding just a few more steps to completing a microtransaction would turn off buyers.

Personally, I moved to upgrading titles every other year. It makes the smallest YoY improvements seem that much more magnified. I'm happy with Franchise mode and the improvements made on The Show 19. I wish there were more QOL improvements to the mode like I mentioned, but I'm still pleased with the final project.

[Iron]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

I do not entirely agree when it comes to OOTP. The size of that company is in no way comparable to SDS. The staff at OOTPd are true baseball fans and they have definitely improved the product year after year. I think the whole game benefits from PT, unlike bigger titles like The Show. Maybe I’m wrong, but that’s how I see it.


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[TheWarmWind]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

Kind of a catch 22 here. If I do buy the Show, SDS may think "hey, we're doing a great job", but if I don't buy the Show SDS will think "hey, less people are playing franchise, let's pay even less attention to it".

There really is no action I can take as a consumer that leads to a win in this situation. It's kind of a big reason why I support microtransactions coming to franchise. I've even suggested a few ideas on how to hook the whales without ruining the experience for players that don't want to pay extra.

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[Caulfield]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

I wouldn't mind having a college football game but other than that I can live with state of sports video games. Is it an overall A+ experience? No, but its at least a solid B- . Or C+ at worst.

[JoshC1977]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

I disagree that 'sports gaming' is in a 'sorry state'. Sports gaming is a heterogeneous amalgam of gamers who enjoy franchise, player career modes, H2H online, and card collecting modes. They range from true casuals to diehards, but most importantly, the 95% of the audience who buy the game that doesn't interact about the game in any sort of online forum or social media outlet. That silent majority is the most important, because the bulk of the money comes from them. Without them, the games would tank....and they haven't (with the exception of the attempted rebirth of the NBA Live series).

Now, I can see an argument that the FIFA and NBA 2k series are resting on their laurels, offering the same stale offerings year after year with minimal attempt at innovation. But other games have done much better: NHL offering the innovative 'Fog of War' system in their franchise mode and World of Chel, MLB 19 offering the highly innovative March to October along with a major re-tooling of RTTS, and surprisingly, even the new Madden is offering an (if executed well) immersion-creating scenario system to franchise and overhauled player trait system across all game modes. Sports gaming is changing, no doubt about that. But, I think these companies are just now scratching the surface of just how creative they can be not only within the existing modes, but in creating new modes.

As for franchise modes specifically, I don't want upgrades to what we have; I want something innovative that focuses on the franchise story-telling, role-playing and team building. "Spreadsheet Stat Simulator 2020' style franchise modes like we have now (aside from true text sims like Football Manager and OOTP) need to die; the technology is there for SO much more than just play game, look at stats, rinse/repeat. We're beginning to see the start of that shift by innovations made by MLB and Madden teams and that truly excites me. I know some people won't adapt and will be left behind, but I am genuinely excited about where 'sports gaming' is now and will be in the future.

[Roscosuper]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

I disagree that 'sports gaming' is in a 'sorry state'. Sports gaming is a heterogeneous amalgam of gamers who enjoy franchise, player career modes, H2H online, and card collecting modes. They range from true casuals to diehards, but most importantly, the 95% of the audience who buy the game that doesn't interact about the game in any sort of online forum or social media outlet. That silent majority is the most important, because the bulk of the money comes from them. Without them, the games would tank....and they haven't (with the exception of the attempted rebirth of the NBA Live series).

Now, I can see an argument that the FIFA and NBA 2k series are resting on their laurels, offering the same stale offerings year after year with minimal attempt at innovation. But other games have done much better: NHL offering the innovative 'Fog of War' system in their franchise mode and World of Chel, MLB 19 offering the highly innovative March to October along with a major re-tooling of RTTS, and surprisingly, even the new Madden is offering an (if executed well) immersion-creating scenario system to franchise and overhauled player trait system across all game modes. Sports gaming is changing, no doubt about that. But, I think these companies are just now scratching the surface of just how creative they can be not only within the existing modes, but in creating new modes.

As for franchise modes specifically, I don't want upgrades to what we have; I want something innovative that focuses on the franchise story-telling, role-playing and team building. "Spreadsheet Stat Simulator 2020' style franchise modes like we have now (aside from true text sims like Football Manager and OOTP) need to die; the technology is there for SO much more than just play game, look at stats, rinse/repeat. We're beginning to see the start of that shift by innovations made by MLB and Madden teams and that truly excites me. I know some people won't adapt and will be left behind, but I am genuinely excited about where 'sports gaming' is now and will be in the future.

No, it is in a "sorry state". The paradigm, from a business philosophy perspective, has shifted from "Lets make greats games" to "let's figure out how to tweak gameplay to manipulate the players into spending more money on micro transactions".

Most of the best talent work for these companies and they're really just being used to create and uphold another scam that people have a hard time getting away from.

There might be some innovation from time to time, but priority number one is increasing micro-transactions and that's where the focus has been for the last 6 or 7 years and it hasn't been on making high quality stable products.

[Caulfield]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

No, it is in a "sorry state". The paradigm, from a business philosophy perspective, has shifted from "Lets make greats games" to "let's figure out how to tweak gameplay to manipulate the players into spending more money on micro transactions".

Most of the best talent work for these companies and they're really just being used to create and uphold another scam that people have a hard time getting away from.

I havent spent one red cent on microtransactions. IMO its a myth you have to spend extra money on games with microtransactions

[BJSands]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

Sports video games are nowhere near what they should be in 2019. And it all traces back to the original EA/NFL exclusivity deal.

Flaws are too many to count in each game. Franchise modes are getting neglected, and new modes tend to be iffy and poorly implemented.

To me, the reason is obvious.

With no competition, what's the incentive for games to actually improve? There's only one real console baseball game, so SDS knows they own the market. They can bleed people dry with DD and make just incremental changes elsewhere to an already-flawed product.

If there was a true competitor, The Show would be light-years ahead of where it sits now. That's what competition creates. If a competitor was out there, DD AND franchise would get equal attention. We'd never have to hear about how SDS doesn't have the resources for this or that. They'd either find the resources or get creative, or consumers would find a company with more ability to produce a complete game that better serves different audiences.

Alas...

Or, perhaps multiple options in the market would've led to some kind of split: online/DD players prefer a game like The Show that caters to those gamers. Meanwhile, things could've evolved to where the offline/franchise types drifted to MVP.

Don't know if that's actually what would've happened, but it's certainly impossible now.

Until there's true competition, The Show (and Madden) will continue down their mediocre paths. 2K is already slipping, and if EA gets out of the NBA business that will be even worse news for basketball-game players. FIFA has stagnated after pretty much beating PES in the marketplace. NHL 19 took some steps forward, but isn't where it needs to be.

Without true competition, sports games will never advance too far.

[Caulfield]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

...With no competition, what's the incentive for games to actually improve? There's only one real console baseball game, so SDS knows they own the market. They can bleed people dry with DD and make just incremental changes elsewhere to an already-flawed product.

If there was a true competitor, The Show would be light-years ahead of where it sits now. That's what competition creates. If a competitor was out there, DD AND franchise would get equal attention. We'd never have to hear about how SDS doesn't have the resources for this or that. They'd either find the resources or get creative, or consumers would find a company with more ability to produce a complete game that better serves different audiences.


Alas...


Or, perhaps multiple options in the market would've led to some kind of split: online/DD players prefer a game like The Show that caters to those gamers. Meanwhile, things could've evolved to where the offline/franchise types drifted to MVP.


Don't know if that's actually what would've happened, but it's certainly impossible now.


Until there's true competition, The Show (and Madden) will continue down their mediocre paths. 2K is already slipping, and if EA gets out of the NBA business that will be even worse news for basketball-game players. FIFA has stagnated after pretty much beating PES in the marketplace. NHL 19 took some steps forward, but isn't where it needs to be.


Without true competition, sports games will never advance too far.

If what madden, nba 2k and the show is pursuing is the casual gamer and not the diehards, then they have competition. like fortnite, c.o.d., Spiderman, God of War etc. etc. etc.
but what the casual gamer sees as advancement/improvement definitely will never be what diehards see as advancement/ improvement. If say, the Show had serious competition other than RBI, I'm almost positive the competition would go after the casual gamer and not settle for a very small niche like us diehards are. thats a tough pill to swallow but it is what it is

[JHodges57]

Re: The sorry state of sports gaming

If what madden, nba 2k and the show is pursuing is the casual gamer and not the diehards, then they have competition. like fortnite, c.o.d., Spiderman, God of War etc. etc. etc.
but what the casual gamer sees as advancement/improvement definitely will never be what diehards see as advancement/ improvement. If say, the Show had serious competition other than RBI, I'm almost positive the competition would go after the casual gamer and not settle for a very small niche like us diehards are. thats a tough pill to swallow but it is what it is

It is a good point that for casual players, like me, there is plenty of competition, even though none of the competition is a sports game. There are a few non sports games that I spend 95% of my game time on and have gotten to the point where I no longer wish to spend money on sports games, of any sport.