I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

[ijumpedthegun]

I've been firmly in the "I won't buy" camp this year, but decided to give the game a chance with the trial and free weekend.

I am getting absolutely shredded on defense and can't figure out why. Haven't had much time to experiment with various teams yet, but here's what I'm experiencing.

Doing offline CFM on all pro (sim mode) with the Cowboys. I'm currently playing the Browns and their passing attack is unstoppable. I'm getting Lawrence or Griffin in Mayfield's face nearly every dropback very quickly. But my CBs keep giving up quick, short to intermediate yardage. No matter what coverage, cover 2, 3, 6, 4, palms, man, press, loose, Baker Mayfield always gets the ball to a receiver wide open right off the line. Thought it was just OBJ but when he went down with injury it kept happening. I finally forced an incomplete incompletion in the 3rd quarter and it felt like I'd won a Super Bowl.

Is it me? I know the Cowboys secondary is rated lower this year, but they shouldn't be this dramatically bad... especially on All Pro, and especially with my pass rush. Is it the roster (I signed Earl Thomas to start next to Woods)? I tweaked the sliders to lower QB accuracy, raise pass coverage, but no luck.

Is it the game? I skimmed the forum and haven't seen any topics about this.

I wish I could explain where the defense breaks down, but it's happening on every. single. play. Usually for quick passes in the first second and a half of the play, but sometimes downfield too.

I don't think I'll figure out if the game is worth the buy before my trial ends because my pass d is that awful. I know 19 and 20 had unrealistic QB completion percentages, but I cannot keep Mayfield below 90% no matter how many times I play this game. It's driving me crazy, especially considering Dak's in-game accuracy has been all over the place (that's unique to this year--my pass offense is usually quite good and I stay aware of pressure, throwing with feet set, etc)

Can anyone help me figure out what's going wrong? Anybody else experiencing this?

[Kramer5150]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

Out of curiosity...do you play a no switch defense? The reason I ask is because what you have described here is exactly what I had witnessed during the beta, and now I'm experiencing the same thing in the trial version I downloaded.

There simply is no defense in this game, I had started a game using my Steelers in their Monday night matchup against the G-Men, and at the half (I quit out of disgust) the score was Pitt-31 and the Giants-21.

I was on AP default also....it's like the defense is slower than the CPU Offense, and the sliders are so unresponsive as far as the defense goes it's comical.

Trust me, It's nothing you're doing that's wrong based on what you've mentioned...as like I mentioned their was no defense in the beta, and it seems to have carried over into the full game.

[ray52fan]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

No you aren't the only one. It's tough. I have tried different settings with different teams with man or zone just like yourself and nothing seems to work. I don't think its a robo qb problem because the passes I'm seeing completed are wide open throws that most qb's would make 9 out of 10 times.

They definitely need to tighten up coverage and have cpu qb's make bad decisions and bad throws once in a while. I can't remember the last time i actually saw the cpu throw a bad ball.

[Jagsfan24]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

If you have gone through the slider part of the forums you would see that the pass defense for the user is bad this year, really bad. I complain all the time really, but I would suggest looking at Matt’s slider set, he has a AP and AM set that is really good and kinda helps fix the pass defense problem.

But I’m in the same boat as you

[MattySim247]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

Trust me...you guys aren’t the only ones experiencing this problem. I’ve been playing Madden for almost 30 years and I’ve never seen anything this alarming. No matter what I do, the CPU has wide open receivers. This must be tuned and fixed, as I’m already losing interest in this game.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[oneamongthefence]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

I run exclusively cover 1 in passing situations. The CPU doesn't go deep very much. It brings a safety down and covers up the middle some. Or you can user a safety to take away the middle.

Sent from my LM-G820 using Tapatalk

[Hooe]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

So far it's my opinion that all the spot drop zones are pretty much worthless against the CPU for a few reasons.

On the ratings front, all the linebackers have had their coverage ratings nuked. They also have lower Change Of Direction ratings. So on top of being across-the-board worse in zone in the first place (with a few notable exceptions), linebackers also are more sluggish to move once their AI tells them it's time to react; they simply don't have twitch reflexes anymore. On passing downs, if you don't have great cover linebackers, get them off the field. Play dime or put a safety in at nickel outside linebacker instead, especially to take away the TE quick out the CPU loves to throw.

On the CPU quarterbacking front, my impression of the CPU read-coverage AI is that it is very quick to identify and throw to the first open read without consideration of depth unless it needs a certain line to gain on a later down. You've got to make the CPU hold on to the ball longer, and with how porous spot drop zones are right now, I can't imagine playing effective defense against the CPU with Cover 3 Sky (based on my experience, a lot of people when playing defense in Madden just dial up Cover 3 Sky repeatedly and call it a day).

In addition, on All Madden, I don't think I have seen the CPU roll a clean-pocket inaccurate pass dice roll, regardless of player ratings or game style. So if you're playing on All Madden, there's that to contend with as well; getting pressure on the QB is paramount if you want to force inaccurate passes.

I would recommend calling more pattern-matching coverages and also learning the pattern matching rules yourself so you can confidently user players in the back end of your defense and help your AI teammates out. You have to force the CPU quarterback to hold on to the ball to buy time for your pass rushers to beat blocks. The coverages you want to consider are Cover 2 Sink (vs 2x2 pass sets), Cover 3 Match / Cover 3 Buzz Match (vs 2x2 pass sets), Cover 4 Quarters, Cover 4 Palms, Cover 6, and Cover 9. Knowing which guys you can safely hot route into blitzes while calling these coverages is also extremely helpful.

On the flip side of things, my brother is having a fair amount of success playing lots of press-man (Cover 1 Hole / Robber, Cover 2 Man). He's using the Rams and has Jalen Ramsey at his disposal, along with three good pass rushers, which all helps. He users Aaron Donald most of the time, who, well, is Aaron Donald so he just bulldozes pass blockers sometimes.

[oldmanfootball]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

Out of curiosity...do you play a no switch defense? The reason I ask is because what you have described here is exactly what I had witnessed during the beta, and now I'm experiencing the same thing in the trial version I downloaded.

There simply is no defense in this game, I had started a game using my Steelers in their Monday night matchup against the G-Men, and at the half (I quit out of disgust) the score was Pitt-31 and the Giants-21.

I was on AP default also....it's like the defense is slower than the CPU Offense, and the sliders are so unresponsive as far as the defense goes it's comical.

Trust me, It's nothing you're doing that's wrong based on what you've mentioned...as like I mentioned their was no defense in the beta, and it seems to have carried over into the full game.

I play no switch on AP default sim and only give up about 150 passing yards and less than 50 rushing a game.

[JoshC1977]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

It's been a wonderfully fantastic process this year for me on AP default. You really have to dig into your arsenal of tools and have a deep understanding of your team's strengths and weaknesses. You can't sleepwalk through defense this year; you have to be smart and there is going to be a learning curve. I'm definitely practicing more and honing my calls and pre-snap adjustments while spending more time studying my players.

[sccavs64]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

I've had issues here too. Trying to play around with the QB accuracy slider, but I noticed after you drop it past 45, the AI QB just checks the ball down to the RB most of the time. They play really conservative, I think I held Winston on the Colts to 30 yards in the first half.

Frustrating to say the least.

[tg88forHOF]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

Some really great stuff

Probably the biggest takeaway I've had so far this year, and that meshes with Hooe's great writeup, is that the nuances of different coverage calls matter this year.

It's been my experience that a lot of Madden players have a solid understanding of basic coverage shells (Cover 2/3/4 etc), but don't have a solid grasp of the different variants within those coverages (Sky vs. Buzz, Robber vs. Hole, Sink vs Tampa 2, Cover 6 vs. Cover 9, etc) or, as was mentioned, what the different assignments in match zones are.

Especially combined with the changes to coverage LBs, those nuances matter. A safety and a LB in the same zone aren't the same thing...Robber vs. Hole has more weight this year than it has in the past. The same play out of nickel and dime plays very differently.

I agree that a lot of players are used to a world where they call the basic shell they want, then depend on usering to fill in the gaps. It shows when you read posts that are worded the way this one was...where the poster lists the different coverages they've tried and the results they've gotten by shell, like a C3 is a C3.

That's not a knock on anybody, nor am I trying to dismiss anybody's issues with "get gud". It's just a different world than a lot are used to, and there'll be a learning curve.

[xCoachDx]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

Probably the biggest takeaway I've had so far this year, and that meshes with Hooe's great writeup, is that the nuances of different coverage calls matter this year.

It's been my experience that a lot of Madden players have a solid understanding of basic coverage shells (Cover 2/3/4 etc), but don't have a solid grasp of the different variants within those coverages (Sky vs. Buzz, Robber vs. Hole, Sink vs Tampa 2, Cover 6 vs. Cover 9, etc) or, as was mentioned, what the different assignments in match zones are.

Especially combined with the changes to coverage LBs, those nuances matter. A safety and a LB in the same zone aren't the same thing...Robber vs. Hole has more weight this year than it has in the past. The same play out of nickel and dime plays very differently.

I agree that a lot of players are used to a world where they call the basic shell they want, then depend on usering to fill in the gaps. It shows when you read posts that are worded the way this one was...where the poster lists the different coverages they've tried and the results they've gotten by shell, like a C3 is a C3.

That's not a knock on anybody, nor am I trying to dismiss anybody's issues with "get gud". It's just a different world than a lot are used to, and there'll be a learning curve.

I’ve yet to see a blue zone cover consistently as they still just get stuck in their backpedal and cover nothing, hook zones still let receivers cross their face and stand behind stationary receivers, man coverage is unusable against the CPU, it’s the same stuff we are used to seeing.

[tg88forHOF]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

I’ve yet to see a blue zone cover consistently as they still just get stuck in their backpedal and cover nothing, hook zones still let receivers cross their face and stand behind stationary receivers, man coverage is unusable against the CPU, it’s the same stuff we are used to seeing.

I guess we're playing different games.

[Hooe]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

I’ve yet to see a blue zone cover consistently as they still just get stuck in their backpedal and cover nothing, hook zones still let receivers cross their face and stand behind stationary receivers, man coverage is unusable against the CPU, it’s the same stuff we are used to seeing.

I strongly reject the bold.

As I said earlier in the thread, man coverage is literally all my brother plays. Our online league plays on All-Madden, simulation game style, default sliders. He's doing just fine so far in the games I have watched him play against both users and the CPU.

What man coverage is dependent on is pass pressure, which again since he's the Rams he's having a pretty easy time doing that (Aaron Donald, Samson Ebukam, and Leonard Floyd is about as good trio of pass rushers you will find in the game). With the stock rosters, no coverage is going to hold up for 3.5 seconds or longer this year; the chain is going to eventually break. You have to affect the quarterback.

I do agree that the deep blue zones being too static is still a problem, but honestly they are better this year than they've been in the past. In the past they'd never come off their strict zone assignments, they actually do sometimes now.

[tg88forHOF]

Re: I cannot play good pass defense this year... is it me?

I strongly reject the bold.

As I said earlier in the thread, man coverage is literally all my brother plays. Our online league plays on All-Madden, simulation game style, default sliders. He's doing just fine so far in the games I have watched him play against both users and the CPU.

What man coverage is dependent on is pass pressure, which again since he's the Rams he's having a pretty easy time doing that (Aaron Donald, Samson Ebukam, and Leonard Floyd is about as good trio of pass rushers you will find in the game). With the stock rosters, no coverage is going to hold up for 3.5 seconds or longer this year; the chain is going to eventually break. You have to affect the quarterback.

Plus, as discussed, "man coverage" is a pretty broad term.

Running C1 Hole out of nickel against 11-personnel trips, where one LB is manned up on the RB and the other is supposed to take the TE from a 3Rec Hook? Yeah, that's probably not going to function very well no matter what the pass rush looks like.

C1 Robber Press out of dime is probably going to have much better results....as it should.

Like I said, calling man coverage "completely unusable against the CPU" is so different than what I've observed that I simply have to assume we're playing completely different games.