Peyton Manning is our MVP

[SportsTop]

Quote: Originally Posted by Olson-for-Heisman

Yep. The old "Manning is a leader and he has excellent intangibles" argument. People tend to use that when the stats are lacking. I'm not sure how you could make a conclusive judgement that Manning has more value to his team than Brees, after watching what Brees has done this year...without his top WR, RB, and TE for a significant stretch.

Ah, so you're willing to give Brees credit for intangibles (lacking the WR, RB, TE), but not Manning?

How do we know the Saints weren't a better team without Shockey than they were with Shockey (see NY Giants). Pierre Thomas was a better between the tackles runner than Reggie Bush. How do we know if he'd had a shot the entire season that the Saints wouldn't have been better off?

We can go back and forth, but the actuality is that when you have an OPOTY and MVP Awards that there is going to be a line of delineation between them and the writers tend to include intangibles when deciding on MVP.

[Chip Douglass]

Quote: Originally Posted by Squint

Ah, so you're willing to give Brees credit for intangibles (lacking the WR, RB, TE), but not Manning?

I am, but not to the point where I disregard Brees' insane passing yardage (higher than Manning), QB rating (higher than Manning), and TDs thrown (higher than Manning).

Once more, I'd have probably voted for DeAngelo Williams/Rivers.

Quote:

How do we know the Saints weren't a better team without Shockey than they were with Shockey (see NY Giants). Pierre Thomas was a better between the tackles runner than Reggie Bush. How do we know if he'd had a shot the entire season that the Saints wouldn't have been better off?

I can ask the same questions of the Colts' key skill positions.

But I disgress.

Quote:

We can go back and forth, but the actuality is that when you have an OPOTY and MVP Awards that there is going to be a line of delineation between them and the writers tend to include intangibles when deciding on MVP.

Fair enough. But I think the bottom line is that voters diminish the value of great players on bad teams, while increasing that of good players on good teams. I just think it's ironic that Manning's intangibles are an overwhelming reason for his MVP award, yet the intangibles of other QBs (Brees, Rivers) aren't even brought up and at the expense of superior production on the part of Brees and Rivers.

I'm not surprised though, since most MVP awards go to the best players on good teams. Once more, I still don't see how the Saints' record should be relative to Brees' MVP chances. The value to his team shouldn't be any less just because he is surrounded by less than Manning.

[z Revis]

Quote: Originally Posted by Olson-for-Heisman

Once more, I think that's the problem with judging the MVP based upon "value." Instead of relying largely on statistical output, we're here second-guessing how much value Manning has to his team relative to Brees has to his team. The term "value" is way too vague and there's no way that you could diminish Brees' value simply because his team is 8-8. How do we really quantify value? I'm not sure how you could make a conclusive judgement that Manning has more value to his team than Brees, after watching what Brees has done this year...without his top WR, RB, and TE for a significant stretch.

Once again...

Because look at how Peyton played down the stretch compared to Brees. And look at how Brees led them to a mere 8-8 record and missed the Playoffs. Peyton carried his team, as did Brees. But Peyton carried his team further and won games simply because of him. Peyton engineered SEVEN game winning drives in the 4th quarter(would've been eight if it weren't for his defense in week 3 against the Jags). Peyton brought his team back from 3-4, and brought his team back FOUR times after being down by 10 or more points...that's an NFL record. Also, in a game where the Colts had to win to clinch a Playoff spot, they were down by 14 points and Peyton comes out and completes 29 of 34 passes, 364 yards, and 3 TD's with a 141 passer rating. He played magnificent down the stretch, while Brees was inconsistent throwing 2 or 3 INT's in games where they had to win to save their season.

[SportsTop]

Quote: Originally Posted by Olson-for-Heisman

I can ask the same questions of the Colts' key skill positions. But I disgress.

But there's already an answer to that question for the Colts. They won a Superbowl with a healthy Saturday, Harrison, and Addai. Three of their four losses came in their last five games in 2006 as opposed to winning their last nine this season.

[Spectre]

Congrats to Chad, 2nd place in MVP balloting after being dumped by the Jets

Ah, the beauty of being a Jets fan- Chad probably is the closest a Jet came to winning the MVP

[clerks37]

WOW I am going to start passind out huggies to all you crybabies I mean really it had to be Manning look at what he did for the colts coming of TWO knee surgeries get over it Brees was not the player Manning was down the stretch look at all the comebacks he led us on this year and doing it with a difrent o-line every game and no running game all season

[bkrich83]

I see the homers have shown up.

The way I see it 4 or 5 guys have legit claims to the award. I have no problem with Manning winning it. I probably would have voted for him or Pennington if I had a vote.

[J0nnD0ugh]

I'd given it to Pennington. But as I've said before, I find it hard to call anyone the "league MVP". No one is on the field the whole game, the positions are so diversified, team philosophies so varied, to call just about anyone MVP is to overrate him. What Peyton is asked to do is not the same as what Eli is asked. What's expected of LT is different from AP. And that tackle you always run behind when you need a yard, that kicker who gets you field position & always hits from inside 50, that safety who scares ballcarriers & QB's from going his way can be just as impactful as any of your offensive skill players.