top 5 QB's of all time

[canes6812]

1. Marino
2. Montana
3. Elway
4. Unitas
5. Manning

[Bighoff]

1. Joe Montana
2. Johnny Unitas
3. Dan Marino
4. Brett Favre
5a. John Elway
5b. Roger Staubach

[z Revis]

1. Joe Montana
2. Johnny Unitas
3. Peyton Manning
4. Dan Marino
5a. Tom Brady
5b. John Elway

[jeremym480]

1. Montana
2. Farve
3. Brady
4. Manning
5. Marino
6. Young
7. Elway

[Motown]

No love for Bert Jones?

[hipster.doofus7]

Quote: Originally Posted by CW McGraw

Dan Marino played with one Hall of Famer for four seasons. Elway played with Hall of Famer Gary Zimmerman along with future Hall of Famer's Shannon Sharpe, Terrel Davis, and Steve Atwater.

You're talking about Elway in the 1990s --- he had Zimmerman, Sharpe, Davis, and several other pro bowlers with him on offense. There's no question he had more support then than Marino ever had.

However, I was comparing Marino to Elway in the 1980s. When Elway "willed" his team into the 4 conference championship games and 3 superbowls. No probowl WR, TE, or RB in all that time. In fact, Elway had a 1000-yd WR only once in the 1980s, which is sad. Marino had one every year, sometimes even two. Elway's offensive line was porous as best, and Elway was getting killed every week because of Dan Reeves's 7-step-drop offense. Elway was sacked 200+ times in the 1980s, compared to only about 100 for Marino. IIRC, neither Elway nor Marino had a 1000-yd rusher in the '80s. The Broncos did have a talented defense (Dennis Smith, Atwater, Mecklenburg). But Marino had a talented supporting cast too, but mostly on offense. His WRs and OL were far superior to anything Elway had in the 1980s.

I would say that Elway and Marino had comparable supporting cast through the 1980s. They both had great coaches (Don Shula, Dan Reeves). The difference? Elway took his team to 3 superbowls and 4 AFC Championship games. Marino made it past the divisional playoffs just once in his entire career. This is with two of them playing in the same conference, in the era, against the same opponents.

And that's just Elway in the 1980s, when Marino got the stats and Elway got the wins. In the 1990s, Elway got it both ways. Elway's statistical and championship record in the 1990s were clearly ahead of Marino's.

[Alliball]

Every time I see one of these threads I come away fairly certain that most of the guys responding never actually saw Elway play.

[CW McGraw]

Quote: Originally Posted by hipster.doofus7

You're talking about Elway in the 1990s --- he had Zimmerman, Sharpe, Davis, and several other pro bowlers with him on offense. There's no question he had more support then than Marino ever had. However, I was comparing Marino to Elway in the 1980s. When Elway "willed" his team into the 4 conference championship games and 3 superbowls. No probowl WR, TE, or RB in all that time. In fact, Elway had a 1000-yd WR only once in the 1980s, which is sad. Marino had one every year, sometimes even two. Elway's offensive line was porous as best, and Elway was getting killed every week because of Dan Reeves's 7-step-drop offense. Elway was sacked 200+ times in the 1980s, compared to only about 100 for Marino. IIRC, neither Elway nor Marino had a 1000-yd rusher in the '80s. The Broncos did have a talented defense (Dennis Smith, Atwater, Mecklenburg). But Marino had a talented supporting cast too, but mostly on offense. His WRs and OL were far superior to anything Elway had in the 1980s. I would say that Elway and Marino had comparable supporting cast through the 1980s. They both had great coaches (Don Shula, Dan Reeves). The difference? Elway took his team to 3 superbowls and 4 AFC Championship games. Marino made it past the divisional playoffs just once in his entire career. This is with two of them playing in the same conference, in the era, against the same opponents. And that's just Elway in the 1980s, when Marino got the stats and Elway got the wins. In the 1990s, Elway got it both ways. Elway's statistical and championship record in the 1990s were clearly ahead of Marino's.

I'm keeping Elway's mediocre individual passing stats for a reason. He didn't have weapons for most of his career. But weapons aren't going to win you playoff games. While Elway's teams were centered around the running game and defense, the Dolphins were a passing team with a bad defense. That's the exact wrong way to win playoff games. You're fooling yourself if you think WRs are more important to a team's success than a good defense.

WRs and QBs have a symbiotic relationship. I'm not gonna say Marino was the only reason for the Marks Brothers' success, but you didn't hear much about either of them after they left Miami. Marino was consistently statistically dominant. For a decade and a half, the only constant on that offense was Marino. He was good no matter who they put out there. How could you possibly say that Marino was the one benefiting from that relationship?