NFL moves umpires to offensive backfield

[shotgun styles]

Quote: Originally Posted by Alliball

He can't because we all know the rule does not exist. I can't even imagine the dude on the playground as a kid.

Still ringing that bell.

Legalized cheating is still cheating. Any unfair advantage, legal or not, is cheating. That's called "sportsmanship".

[Alliball]

Quote: Originally Posted by shotgun styles

Still ringing that bell. Legalized cheating is still cheating. Any unfair advantage, legal or not, is cheating. That's called "sportsmanship".

No it's not. If there is no rule against it, it is not cheating.

[shotgun styles]

Quote: Originally Posted by Alliball

No it's not. If there is no rule against it, it is not cheating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheating

Quote: Originally Posted by wiki

In sport there in implicit agreement among participants that they will play by the rules and eschew unfair measures to win. Cheating occurs when actions are taken that violate the rules of competition in order to gain an advantage. These violations can take many forms including the taking of substances to improve performance (doping), using equipment that does not conform to the rules or illegally altering the condition of equipment during play, and deliberate foul play with the aim of avoiding sanction.

Dude, you are flatly wrong. If there's no rule specifically stating that shooting your opponent with a shotgun is a foul, that does not mean it's not cheating. There is such a thing as common sense. If you are intentionally trying to gain an unfair advantage you're cheating.

[WSU151]

Quote: Originally Posted by shotgun styles

There is such a thing as common sense. If you are intentionally trying to gain an unfair advantage you're cheating.

First, I can't believe you quoted wikipedia as your ethical guide and/or proof. But to highlight a point you conveniently forgot: Cheating occurs when actions are taken that violate the rules of competition in order to gain an advantage. Pick plays don't violate the rules of competition, there are no sanctions to avoid, nor do they violate the laws of society, because there are no rules against pick plays. It's legal. Shooting someone is not legal because it violates societal law, just so we are clear in your other brilliant "example".

Second, how is it an unfair advantage when all teams can use the ref as a pick without being penalized? If everyone has access to the advantage, then it's not cheating. I'd say it's not an unfair advantage...but rather the use of an opportunity based on circumstances. And the biggest thing is THERE'S NO PENALTY against it. Everything else in the game there's a penalty for cheating...holding, facemask, clipping, tripping, leg whip, pass interference, horse collar, et al. I have yet to see the ref turn on his microphone and say "Using the umpire as a pick on the offense...15 yards from the previous line of scrimmage...remains third down."

Let's take a look at one debatable example...Are stiff-arms cheating? The offense has an unfair advantage, because when the defense does the same thing, it's 15 yard penalty. Yet its legal if the offense does it. Is it cheating, or part of the game?

And really...are you really telling us that a criminal act such as shooting someone to gain an unfair advantage it the same as running a pick play? C'mon man. Apples to oranges. You're right, there is a thing as common sense...please show us you have some and don't be an idiot.

[KBLover]

Quote: Originally Posted by shotgun styles

Dude, you are flatly wrong. If there's no rule specifically stating that shooting your opponent with a shotgun is a foul, that does not mean it's not cheating. There is such a thing as common sense. If you are intentionally trying to gain an unfair advantage you're cheating.

I think shooting someone would fall under a personal foul, would merit an ejection...and an immediate arrest.

No one is talking about committing felony assault on the football field...

That said, picks are illegal. The maneuver is outlawed by NFL rules (falls under offensive pass interference). It's a loophole that it doesn't apply when it's a ref and not another player. Exploiting a loophole is not cheating (and there's no rule saying everyone can't do it either - if I can exploit a loophole and you can too, it's not unfair - as was said, we both have the option to do so), but it is poor sportsmanship, just like it would be if I exploited an AI loophole in Madden. I'm not cheating (not using cheat codes, not using glitches, no hax), and it's not unfair (you can exploit the same problems I can), but I'm not playing within the spirit of the game and sportsmanship.

[WSU151]

Quote: Originally Posted by KBLover

I think shooting someone would fall under a personal foul, would merit an ejection...and an immediate arrest. No one is talking about committing felony assault on the football field... That said, picks are illegal. The maneuver is outlawed by NFL rules (falls under offensive pass interference). It's a loophole that it doesn't apply when it's a ref and not another player. Exploiting a loophole is not cheating (and there's no rule saying everyone can't do it either - if I can exploit a loophole and you can too, it's not unfair - as was said, we both have the option to do so), but it is poor sportsmanship, just like it would be if I exploited an AI loophole in Madden. I'm not cheating (not using cheat codes, not using glitches, no hax), and it's not unfair (you can exploit the same problems I can), but I'm not playing within the spirit of the game and sportsmanship.

You said it better than me. Well done.

[SouthernBrick]

Quote: Originally Posted by KBLover

I think shooting someone would fall under a personal foul, would merit an ejection...and an immediate arrest. No one is talking about committing felony assault on the football field... That said, picks are illegal. The maneuver is outlawed by NFL rules (falls under offensive pass interference). It's a loophole that it doesn't apply when it's a ref and not another player. Exploiting a loophole is not cheating (and there's no rule saying everyone can't do it either - if I can exploit a loophole and you can too, it's not unfair - as was said, we both have the option to do so), but it is poor sportsmanship, just like it would be if I exploited an AI loophole in Madden. I'm not cheating (not using cheat codes, not using glitches, no hax), and it's not unfair (you can exploit the same problems I can), but I'm not playing within the spirit of the game and sportsmanship.

Yeah I can agree with that. Not cheating but, poor sportsmanship and not playing within the spirit of the game. All 32 teams can use this if they choose to and so I don't see how it is cheating or unfair If the both teams can do the same thing and not be penalized.

[Alliball]

Quote: Originally Posted by shotgun styles

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheating Dude, you are flatly wrong. If there's no rule specifically stating that shooting your opponent with a shotgun is a foul, that does not mean it's not cheating. There is such a thing as common sense. If you are intentionally trying to gain an unfair advantage you're cheating.

I'm sorry Dude but that was an epic fail. I like how you cherry picked my first post in this thread and left out something I said about how football was played when the goalposts were in the front of the endzone. Again I'll ask, were they cheating back then when WR's used the goalposts to pick off defenders?

Your idea of cheating is laughable at best and using a ref as a pick and shooting your opponent is almost the same thing.

I knew you were going to make an epic leap in logic like that, it fits you.