How Can YOU Tell How Good A Player Is Without Looking At Stats?

[ProfessaPackMan]

Just like the title asks, how can you tell how good a player is without looking strictly at stats? I'm sure by now most of us go by the "Eye Test" but when performing that, are there certain things that you are looking at in a player to determine if they're good or to measure how big of an impact they make for their team?

Reason why I'm asking folks is because I've seen a few posts in a few threads already saying "Oh just because Player x has better ______ than Player Y doesn't mean he's better than Player Y" or "Player X makes a BIGGER impact on his team than Player Z does on his team even though Player X's numbers are better".

So what factors do you use to see how much of an impact a player makes without looking strictly at stats or going by the "Eye Test"?

[Senator Palmer]

I think tonight's game is a prime example of a player having a good season without eye popping stats. I give you Julius Frazier Peppers and his whopping 2 sacks. Now it's easy to look at that number and say that he has been a disappointment, given the $90 million contract. But that's only if you haven't seen him play, because he has impacted the Bears defense in so many other ways. He has an interception, 2 forced fumbles, 4 passes defensed.

The first game I saw him play this year was against the Giants, he completely controlled that game and led that d. He moved from one side of the line to the other. He pushed the pocket on passing downs, flushing Eli. He batted a pass. He played the run. He played the game the way you want a defensive end to play; a complete game.

I was so caught up and went to look at his stats after the game, expecting him to have like three sacks, and do you know what his line looked like --

4 tackles
1 sacks
1 pass defended
1 forced fumble

Good game on paper, but not really Sportscenter stuff.

It's easy to look at the raw sack numbers and say that this man hasn't brought his game, but his presence and effort down after down, forcing the offense to account for him has created so many other problems for the opposition. There's a reason the Bears lead the league in turnovers, 14 of them coming from interceptions. Something that can't be measured by individual stats.


***now I concede that I haven't seen every game the Bears have played. Bears fans can chime in a little better. But Peppers is a impact guy that coordinators have to worry about on every snap***

[ImTellinTim]

Quote: Originally Posted by Senator Palmer

***now I concede that I haven't seen every game the Bears have played. Bears fans can chime in a little better. But Peppers is a impact guy that coordinators have to worry about on every snap***

Spot on analysis. The guy is an impact player. He even has a field goal block. I expect another impactful game from him tonight with the Dolphins missing their anchor.

[Dog]

Another good example of to piggy back off of Senator Palmer is Trent Cole. Sure he has 7 sacks this year, but his impact is WAY more than than. He is doubled or chipped almost every play, which leads to one less blocker for the other lineman/blitzers. The Eagles as a defense would have a lot more than just 7 less sacks if he wasn't on the field.



I'll give you 2 stat lines:


Completions: 97
Attempts: 153
Completion %: 63.4
Yards: 1,035
YPA: 6.8
TD: 6
--------------
Completions: 96
Attempts: 153
Completion %: 62.7
Yards: 1,350
YPA: 8.8
TD: 8


So which one is Michael Vick and which one is Kevin Kolb?



You can't tell how big a players impact is simply by looking at certain stats

[Palo20]

Quote: Originally Posted by jnes12eaglesfan

Another good example of to piggy back off of Senator Palmer is Trent Cole. Sure he has 7 sacks this year, but his impact is WAY more than than. He is doubled or chipped almost every play, which leads to one less blocker for the other lineman/blitzers. The Eagles as a defense would have a lot more than just 7 less sacks if he wasn't on the field. I'll give you 2 stat lines: Completions: 97 Attempts: 153 Completion %: 63.4 Yards: 1,035 YPA: 6.8 TD: 6 -------------- Completions: 96 Attempts: 153 Completion %: 62.7 Yards: 1,350 YPA: 8.8 TD: 8 So which one is Michael Vick and which one is Kevin Kolb? You can't tell how big a players impact is simply by looking at certain stats

I actually think those stats are very telling. 8.8 YPA vs 6.8 YPA. That is very significant and YPA has been determined statistically to matter most when trying to find good quarterbacking (kind of like OBP in baseball).

Sometimes you have to know what to look for with certain stats.

[The15thunter]

a tougher way to measure, but one i use sometimes, is to look not just at the numbers or their direct impact, but at what they allow their team to do. especially useful for defensive players, but can also apply to skill position guys.

example: haloti ngata of the ravens. it's not just about what he does and the direct numbers he accumulates, but look at what he enables his unit to accomplish. because he can move around and do so much from different spots, he is incredibly difficult to account for. he opens things up for other guys on the defense because he creates such havoc with offenses focusing on him.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Clay Matthews(even though some people don't think he's that important)

And if you want to look at how much of a difference he makes a defense: look at the 4th quarter/OT of the Skins and the Dolphins' game and I DARE you find any resemble of a pass rush in either of those games where he wasn't in there.

[Kanobi]

Matt Cassel has just about the same passer rating as Peyton Manning......that's an insult to Manning