Week 17: Steelers (11-4) @ Browns (4-11)

[mjb2124]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

Rolling around in the mud all week to show how big of a Browns fan I am right now.

I'm sure the Ravens will take care of business so this game will have no meaning to you guys.

[mjb2124]

Quote: Originally Posted by Reed the Raven

Eric Weddle is better than Ryan Clark. If anything Ed Reed shouldn't be there at FS.

Agreed about Weddle being better than Clark and that Ed Reed shouldn't have been voted in. Ray Lewis has no business being in the Pro Bowl based on this season either.

I read today that if Brady and another QB decide to not attend the Pro Bowl, Tim Tebow will be the replacement as a second alternative. That goes to show how much of a joke the Pro Bowl really is.

[wwharton]

Quote: Originally Posted by mjb2124

I'm sure the Ravens will take care of business so this game will have no meaning to you guys.

I hope you're right but its far from a lock. Cincy always plays the ravens tough, and especially since Marvin Lewis has been there. A loss will further the talk of hoe shaky they are on the road... and a loss and PIT win will put them on the road throughout. Not a good look at all.

Quote: Originally Posted by mjb2124

Agreed about Weddle being better than Clark and that Ed Reed shouldn't have been voted in. Ray Lewis has no business being in the Pro Bowl based on this season either. I read today that if Brady and another QB decide to not attend the Pro Bowl, Tim Tebow will be the replacement as a second alternative. That goes to show how much of a joke the Pro Bowl really is.

Ed prob shouldn't be starting. He gets credit for qbs scared to throw his way and putting the rest of the 2ndary in position to make plays. I give Ed some credit for how well Webb had played. But his tackling has been god awful. I know why but he's still on the field so he doesn't get a pass.

Ray is an ok pick though. He was having a great year before he got hurt. He's looked really bad in the last 2 games since coming back (no way he's 100%) so the only question w him would be if he was in enough games to deserve the vote. Considering everything else he means to the team, I'd say he deserves it.

[mjb2124]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

Ray is an ok pick though. He was having a great year before he got hurt. He's looked really bad in the last 2 games since coming back (no way he's 100%) so the only question w him would be if he was in enough games to deserve the vote. Considering everything else he means to the team, I'd say he deserves it.

The names are escaping me now, but there were 2 MLB's i thought deserved it more when i was looking at stats a few days ago. One was the browns MLB....jackson i think.

[wwharton]

Quote: Originally Posted by mjb2124

The names are escaping me now, but there were 2 MLB's i thought deserved it more when i was looking at stats a few days ago. One was the browns MLB....jackson i think.

I can't think of any that can overcome the season he was having before injury (13 games) and his impact as basically a coach on the field. There may be someone but I don't think it's a stretch that he was chosen. Don't get me wrong, it's the probowl so I think he'd be picked to start if he rolled out in a wheel chair for 16 games, and that's BS... but I honestly don't think it's that crazy this year.

[mjb2124]

Quote: Originally Posted by wwharton

I can't think of any that can overcome the season he was having before injury (13 games) and his impact as basically a coach on the field. There may be someone but I don't think it's a stretch that he was chosen. Don't get me wrong, it's the probowl so I think he'd be picked to start if he rolled out in a wheel chair for 16 games, and that's BS... but I honestly don't think it's that crazy this year.

My opinion - The Pro Bowl should be based on a full years stats and frankly, Ray's stats don't compare guys like D'Qwell Jackson or Pat Angerer to name two. Sure, there are the intangibles that can't be measured by stats, but it's the Pro Bowl...I'd like to think it's based on stats for that single season.

FWIW, both players had better stats through 13 games than Ray. More tackles by both and more sacks by Jackson (Angerer has only 1 sack throughout the season). FF and INT are pretty even amongst all three players. Jackson and Angerer also had lesser D's surrounding them making their jobs more difficult IMO.

I just don't see how a case can be made for Ray above both of those players when stats are involved. IMO, Ray made the Pro Bowl because of name and not merit and he'll continue to make the PB due to name until he retires. It's the nature of the beast. He's not the only player either...just one of many in the Pro Bowl's history.

[wwharton]

Quote: Originally Posted by mjb2124

My opinion - The Pro Bowl should be based on a full years stats and frankly, Ray's stats don't compare guys like D'Qwell Jackson or Pat Angerer to name two. Sure, there are the intangibles that can't be measured by stats, but it's the Pro Bowl...I'd like to think it's based on stats for that single season. FWIW, both players had better stats through 13 games than Ray. More tackles by both and more sacks by Jackson (Angerer has only 1 sack throughout the season). FF and INT are pretty even amongst all three players. Jackson and Angerer also had lesser D's surrounding them making their jobs more difficult IMO. I just don't see how a case can be made for Ray above both of those players when stats are involved. IMO, Ray made the Pro Bowl because of name and not merit and he'll continue to make the PB due to name until he retires. It's the nature of the beast. He's not the only player either...just one of many in the Pro Bowl's history.

Fair enough, but I still don't think it's as crazy as others that are starting (starting probably with Ed Reed). If we were talking All Pro I'd agree with you, but I can give a bit more leeway to intangibles for the Pro Bowl (even if we were to assume the voting process made some kind of sense).

[SteelersFreak]

Its looking like Ben is gonna play. But if he throws more than 20 passes I'll be disappointed.

Knowing Arians he'll probably throw at least 30 times though.