All-Pro Football 2K9 Benched

[sportsdude]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer "on the slate" for release

well I'm glad I kept my copy of 2k8. Still, I hope this means we haven't seen the end of 2K football forever. I've been a 2K football fan since NFL2K on the Dreamcast and I just can't stand the product put out by the competition.

[Valdarez]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer "on the slate" for release

I think it's important to notice that it just isn't on the release slate, which doesn't mean that it's canceled. Those are two completely different things. I know things can move fast, but I have a hard time believing it's gone from being in development yesterday to canceled today without that information propagating through out the company to the person I spoke with on the phone.

I'm a glass is half full type of guy, and the only thing that article shows me is that APF2K9 currently isn't on the October release date schedule.

I think the GameSpot guys were expecting the game to be released when Madden was released, and wrote the story with a bit of a negative spin. Remember in the Quarterly Conference call the last quarter that they indicated they were looking at pricing points and, yep you guessed it, release dates!

[sportsdude]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer "on the slate" for release

I think it's important to notice that it just isn't on the release slate, which doesn't mean that it's canceled. Those are two completely different things. I know things can move fast, but I have a hard time believing it's gone from being in development yesterday to canceled today without that information propagating through out the company to the person I spoke with on the phone.

dude I'm glad you're optimistic about it, but the writing's been on the wall for a while now. I think this just helps confirm it as close as possible as dead without actual word from 2K saying it's officially been canceled.

[Crimsontide27]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer "on the slate" for release

I think it's important to notice that it just isn't on the release slate, which doesn't mean that it's canceled. Those are two completely different things. I know things can move fast, but I have a hard time believing it's gone from being in development yesterday to canceled today without that information propagating through out the company to the person I spoke with on the phone.

I'm a glass is half full type of guy, and the only thing that article shows me is that APF2K9 currently isn't on the October release date schedule.

I think the GameSpot guys were expecting the game to be released when Madden was released, and wrote the story with a bit of a negative spin. Remember in the Quarterly Conference call the last quarter that they indicated they were looking at pricing points and, yep you guessed it, release dates!

Lol if they were planning on it releasing in October anyways. Game wouldnt sell 50k copies if that was the street date.

Majority of all football fans would have already shelled out $120+ for NCAA and Madden by then. Only way AP2K would stand a snowballs chance is to release while the hype is building for the NCAA / Madden games. ( And this doesnt mean release it a day after NCAA )

Release it in early June when everyone is clamoring around for every football tidbit of information that they can get and people wilk buy it. If it sucks, they would just trade it in for NCAA / Madden anyways, but 2k already has made their sale.

If October + is what you are suggesting for a release date, then the people in charge of 2k have absolutley no business sense whatsoever.

[rrobbone]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer "on the slate" for release

The way I see it, there are four possibilities that may happen to give video football fans what they really want: a fully realized, realistic, well developed and full featured football game with outstanding graphics, true to life A.I., the NFL, and fun in spades. They are as follows:<O</O
<O</O

Scenario 1:Take Two tells EA where they can stash their huge wads of cash and in trying to reverse and improve the company's fiscal outlook, decides to focus on the IPs that have the most potential for strong sales. GTA 4 releases and does very well at retail, spurring new development for established franchises, including All Pro Football. APF 2K9 is shelved, but APF 2K… uh… APF 2Kten (I guess) enjoys a longer development cycle, more legends, online like you wouldn’t believe, and is one of the greatest football games ever made, NFL or no. EA then jealously cries all over its money and mourns what might have been.

Odds of it actually coming true: 20 to 1. Last week Iwould've been a little more confident about this one, but since we now know about some of Take Two's major stockholders dumping large chunks of shares and one or two of them actually bringing lawsuits against the board in the wake of the publically announced EA buyout attempt, it's looking less likely. Especially the EA crying part. Nobody cries on huge piles of cash.<O</O
<O</O

Scenario 2: Take Two is purchased by EA. The employees at Visual Concepts are faced with a choice to be folded into EA or dismissed (or maybe they don't get a choice). Many ex-VC developers join Natural Motion, developers of Backbreaker, the only other high profile football game left. Backbreaker is delayed a bit, but is improved. It sells modestly, but is picked up for another year and eventually becomes APF with amazing physics.
<O</O
<O</O
Odds: Maybe 50 to 1. Backbreaker is far enough into development that the whole VC crew coming over with cases of beer to help wouldn't change the game a whole lot for this year's version unless it was delayed substantially. You can't delay the release of a football game, people want it near the beginning of football season. As for Backbreaker 2010, if Backbreaker 2009 isn’t completely astounding, it too will drown in the wake of the Madden juggernaut, and there will be no 2010 for Natural Motion’s football game.<O</O
<O</O

Scenario 3: EA buys Take Two and merges VC with its own Tiburon studios, the two sides shake hands and make nicey-nice. After all, these two teams did make some great games in the past; logic dictates that the blending of the two developers could only improve their chances to make a brilliant football simulation. With more talent to develop the game, they could produce more within the standard development cycle and we would cease to see games lacking in previously standard features year after year. Think of it, everything you loved about both franchises back in the day would return. Let Tiburon handle the teams, player ratings, and game modes, and let VC handle A.I., online/multiplayer, and presentation and you've suddenly got a game that would make heads spontaneously explode. Oh, Lord in heaven, I hope this happens…. Also, as a result, NBA 2K dissolves but NBA Live rises from the ashes to take its place as the must have hoops title. And Sony continues to quietly make excellent baseball games.<O</O
<O</O

Odds: Hmmm, (strokes beard): I’m thinking 100 to 1 for the formation of the Justice League of Football Developers, 3 to 1 that EA eventually buys Take Two, 75 to 1 NBA Live is ever good again, and 1.5 to 1 that MLB ’09 The Show will be amazing.<O</O
<O</O

EA's track record speaks for itself. If EA owns Take Two, the VC team would suffer final humiliation, slowly and solemnly being handed their hats, one by one as they take their severance and walk out the door. Then Tiburon throws a lavish victory celebration for themselves, foolishly squandering time and resources that they should be using to regain the once great status of their games. EA, once again, with no real competition or any reason to change anything, doesn’t. Madden sells another metric sh*tload of copies.<O</O
<O</O

Scenario 4: EA buys Take Two, eliminates VC, and with no other competition in the football marketplace save for an upstart title from an unproven developer, makes the sports gamers of the world do the gaming equivalent of kneeling before Zod. Madden's sales continue to rise, even as EA continues to let the game descend into something less and less resembling the sport we love. EA makes press releases touting Peyton Manning as being the first player with a 'commercially viable' rating of 102, as if we cared. The vision cone returns, "but maybe you'll really like it this time." EA announces German and Chinese language versions in an attempt to reach new markets, Pat Summerall makes a return to the booth and Brett Favre becomes a sideline announcer after receiving a glowing recommendation from John Madden, among a million other little sideways improvements to change Madden enough to scroll the number on the outside of the box one year higher.
<O</O
<O</O
Odds: Bingo. I'm sorry to say this, but EA doesn't love you. EA doesn't love football. EA loves your money. We'll either play Backbreaker or get used to forking over sixty bones every year for a sub-par, barely improved roster update. The only other option is to enjoy things like GTA 4 (ironically putting more cash in EA's pockets) and waiting a couple years to see how they dilute the GTA 5, Bioshock 2, and Mass Effect 2 experiences. Don't get me wrong, EA does make some great stuff, (skate, for one) and I don't hate them, I just want them to stop coasting and resting on past accomplishments.<O</O
<O</O

EA, hurry up and make a truly great football game like you used to. <O</O
<O</O
As if your market share depended on it, as it once did.
<O</O
<O</O
Until then, I just won’t play new sports games.<O</O

[Valdarez]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer &quot;on the slate&quot; for release

Odds of it actually coming true: 20 to 1. Last week I would've been a little more confident about this one, but since we now know about some of Take Two's major stockholders dumping large chunks of shares and one or two of them actually bringing lawsuits against the board in the wake of the publically announced EA buyout attempt, it's looking less likely.

It's not major stockholders that are bringing suit. It's one person on the 'behest' of the shareholders, and probably a lawyer looking to make a quick $$$.

http://dealbook.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/03/11/take-two-hit-by-shareholder-suit/?ref=technology

[VCdolphin]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer &quot;on the slate&quot; for release

I'm not shocked, but certainly disappointed. I was hoping a very customizable APF 2K9 would be given a chance to improve on the 2K8 sales.

I wonder if GTA4 doing HUGE numbers (even beyond expectations) and making T2 flush with cash, would put them in the mood to give some marginal games like APF 2K9 a chance? Certainly, with the game engines already done, adding a few features wouldn't be all that expensive.

I'm hoping that the UFL (United Football League) ,which will start in August 09, is interested in having a UFL football videogame. It would be a win-win for both sides, as 2K Sports would have a real league, with real players, and the UFL can benefit from the advertising effect of the videogame. Plus they can update the game every year with new rosters and some game tweaks, which spreads the cost of the game engines out over several years, not just one.

In any event, I went from NOTHING on my 360, to having 2K5 become BC, and APF 2K8 as a fun online game. I've clocked in 150+ hours on 2K8, so I don't regret a penny of that $60 I spent on it.

I guess I'll keep a close eye on details about Backbreaker and the Tecmo football games, though there are so many things to "get right" in a football game, that I can't see a first year game being very good. Certainly not like a APF 2K9 could have been...

[grunt]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer &quot;on the slate&quot; for release

Hey guys this is not a funeral.

We been through worst. The more I think about APF2k8 it is amazing the game was even made. This game was a gift to the hardcore game play guys. The arm that had to be twisted to get this game made will be a good book one day.

We remember the "shut up and play comments" I think it was more out of frustration from the developers. We have an amazingly deep next gen football game. Keep building you teams and building your play books. Tap into the online sliders and enjoy the best playing football game ever.

Remember the exec also said "weighing their options." So, there is still a chance of another game being made and remember

KEEP HOPE ALIVE

Peace

[Rocky]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer &quot;on the slate&quot; for release

I think it's important to notice that it just isn't on the release slate, which doesn't mean that it's canceled. Those are two completely different things. I know things can move fast, but I have a hard time believing it's gone from being in development yesterday to canceled today without that information propagating through out the company to the person I spoke with on the phone.

I'm a glass is half full type of guy, and the only thing that article shows me is that APF2K9 currently isn't on the October release date schedule.

I think the GameSpot guys were expecting the game to be released when Madden was released, and wrote the story with a bit of a negative spin. Remember in the Quarterly Conference call the last quarter that they indicated they were looking at pricing points and, yep you guessed it, release dates!

Only problem with that is.....why would they release it at the same time as NBA 2K9 and NHL2K9? I just don't see it.

But as long as I have a broadband connection, I will be playing this game online come football season unless Madden and NCAA make HUGE strides.

[J.R. Locke]

Monopoly....I guess it is up to EA.

[Sausage]

Re: All-Pro Football 2K9 Benched

This is bad news for football fans and many don't even realize it. Now the other game will go back to being a stale, emotionless, and un-fun football game.

I was really looking forward to play APF 2K9, Backbreaker, and a patched NCAA 2009. I am not depressed, but just mad because I believe it would have been a special game.

[BlyGilmore]

certainly sad news. I twas expecting to see 2K take one more shot with APF, throw a full franchise into it and see where sales went then.

There's nothing they can do about the license, but not having a franchise in last years game killed them IMO.

[quietcool72]

Re: All-Pro Football 2K9 Benched

I guess that leaves us with hope for news on Tecmo Bowl 08, which is due sometime this year.

[rm217]

Re: All-Pro Football 2K9 Benched

I guess that leaves us with hope for news on Tecmo Bowl 08, which is due sometime this year.

Forget Madden bring on Tecmo Bowl 08!!!

[spankdatazz22]

Re: APF 2k9 is no longer &quot;on the slate&quot; for release

I'm not shocked, but certainly disappointed. I was hoping a very customizable APF 2K9 would be given a chance to improve on the 2K8 sales.

My sentiment also. But I disagree w/you regarding the UFL or whatever it is - I doubt that league survives. It seems to have even less behind it than the USFL did, in terms of buzz, coach/player talent, venues, etc.

While I hoped for the best re APF2K9, I figured it was somewhat unlikely they'd release a 2K9. At times last year I campaigned that they shouldn't even attempt to make another game, given the convulsive reaction some in the hardcore community had to the game initially. It's just too much of an uphill battle, it's margin for error too small - with too many varying expectations for the game to be moderately successful. Some want it to be an all-encompassing, fully-customizable game, some want a 32-team/2-conference/4 divisions/4 teams per division gimped copy of the NFL, some want a college game, others a high school game, some even want USFL/XFL/Canadian league games. All while having an ultra-deep franchise mode (with no real-life base to mirror) and a spectacular new graphics engine. Oh and redefine presentation in a sports game, and give us some minigames.

Wow - I didn't mention gameplay. Unlike last gen, it seems gameplay sometimes takes a back seat to a lot of things. Interesting to think back on just how much things changed four years ago (?) when the NFL exclusivity news came out. Then the NCAA, NCAA, EsPN, Arena, and MLB league deals came. I remember thinking at the time we were on the cusp of seeing something truly great with NFL2K6, and they were cut at the knees. Going forward, I guess there's still a chance that an APF game could be released in the off-season; I think anytime between January - June is viable. But at the same time I can see where they'd be better off not dealing with the headache. Unfortunate, because even to this day I see the occasional spectacular play that makes me say "wow" (gonna try to post one later today). I have no doubt that if APF was given the same room to grow in next gen that most sports have, it could have easily carved it's own niche and been successful even with all that was stacked against it. Chances are like NFL2K6, we'll have to wonder "what if..."