i you watch carefully in the ncaa gameplay video it doesn't really have the blow up effect. infact players coming in late have different animation of avoiding the so call dog pile. even players helping other players up
Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
i you watch carefully in the ncaa gameplay video it doesn't really have the blow up effect. infact players coming in late have different animation of avoiding the so call dog pile. even players helping other players up -
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Not two man tackles. Multi-player (3 or more) converging tackles, resulting in a pile. This is what EA has been able to accomplish so far. We know they can do two. But then everyone else has to wait for that animation to clear. We're talking about the third man joining in and so forth and so on....Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
ACtually I think people are talking about something a little distinct even when they talk about two player tackling. I don't care what the CPU does. But are you going to allow ME to add on to a tackle. And that has not been a part of their games. Sure the A.I might take two guys and tackle somebody, but it hasn't allow me to do nothing but sit there and watch things play out.Last edited by Vadiplomat04; 05-15-2008, 01:21 PM.Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
ACtually I think people are talking about something a little distinct even when they talk about two player tackling. I don't care what the CPU does. But are you going to allow ME to add on to a tackle. And that has not been a part of their games. Sure the A.I might take two guys and tackle somebody, but it hasn't allow me to do nothing but sit there and watch things play out.)
Note to Tiburon Marketing:
A great product sells itself, no "back of the box" features required! (See Fifa...)
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
I like how people are already judgeing this game based off of one video....LOL. If you want to know what this engine looks like in action, watch the NCAA videos that OS took at the EA event. Thats more of what you'll see in Madden, then the video posted on the blog.
PS. there are gang tackles in this video, but they happen so fast in the trailer you don't see it. Watch some of the video frame by frame and you'll notice so of the little stuff that you can't see when playing it at regular speed. ***There is a gang tackle by Ray Lewis and Suggs that looks very real....but it happends really fast...somebody look for it in the trailer.
And why should I look at NCAA videos to see something about madden? Ive been told they have nothing to do with each other.Originally posted by Alexis de TocquevilleThe America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Your right that you should be able to add on....but you have to ask your self the question how many tacklers do you want to add on to one tackle....you could have a case were you have six or seven people tackling one player. You'll just have a big pile of bodys instead of a 3 man tackle that knocks off the defender when that the 4th one engages into the tackle. If you watch football, defenders all was knock off other defenders. Its rare that you get a tackle were more then 3 people get a good hold on a defender.....after that people are either going to grab there own teammate or knock off their own teammate
Image 1
Notice in this image here Linebacker Michael Boley is on the ball carriers hip. This was due to the angle he took as well as the position of the HB. Now you have CB DeAngelo Hall here. What users want from what I gather is that in this given situation, they want to take over Hall and come in and finish off the runner. But this level of complexity has not been there in Madden and NCAA. Not saying it's not there this go around, I dont know but let's explore some issues as to why it has not been there. First of all, let's look at McAlister and Boley. Linebackers do not waist tackle like that in Madden/NCAA. It's always been the super hit or miss. And if it was the super hit the play was over.
Second, McAlister has momentum and it does not completely come to a halt just because he encounters a defender, but in Madden/NCAA that has always been the case. Even though you have momentum, once you come into contact that momentum comes to a skreetching halt. Third, because of his momentum now it is a struggle/fight between McAlister and Boley. With Boley holding on, Hall should be able to come in and clean up. In Madden/NCAA we have never been able to do this. But this is true two player tackling. Hall doesn't have to knock Boley off. Boley is already in a position to where Hall or any other defender coming in will not knock him off. The key here though for this to happen is the back has to struggle upon contact with the first defender, something that has not been a part of Madden/NCAA.
EA has done a good job of capturing this
These are hits that are a part of the game and EA has done a good job of capturing those style of hits. However, context for those style of hits are not taken seriously. Ray Lewis decleated Pittman here because Pittman was unaware of Lewis. In EA's game you decleat players even when they are aware of you. It's the same thing with the pancake blocking. In video games they have guys pancaking guys that should not get pancaked. Linemen are most likely not going to pancake a defender who is aware of them. I see it in All Pro all the time and just shake my head. The OLB is standing there looking right at the TE and gets pancaked. Makes no sense.
Diagram 3
What EA has not been so good at is the above diagram. George and the defender are both aware of one another. George's momentum carries him. Even though the defender makes the tackle he does not stop George upon contact and as a result George scored the TD in that game. No struggle by the backs = flat tackling/break tackling. Seems to me that's what people who are criticizing are getting at.
The images here are rather fluid and my interpretation is not the only one, but I just tried to give some visual of what it is people seem to be talking about in their critique.Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
9 times out of 10, only the 1st defender engages. At best, a 2nd defender may come clean up, knocking the 1st tackler off. In '08, I may have seen 1-2 2-man tackles(2 defenders engaged at the same time) per game. And understand why folks don't like this, especially with all this new control over ball carriers and the talk of broken tackles. The key to bringing down a back is gang tackling. If we can't get more than 1 defender to wrap the ball carrier up, RBs will be running wild.
Watch a Cheifs, Browns, Vikings, Cowboys, Giants, 49ers game... teams with stronger RBs, and see how often it takes 2+ defenders to take them down. It happens quite often.Shout out to The Watcher! Where you at bruh?Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Did George get the TD? His knee was CLEARLY down with the ball short of the end zone. But they did lose. HaHa. I won money on that game......Note to Tiburon Marketing:
A great product sells itself, no "back of the box" features required! (See Fifa...)
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Were not judging the game off of 1 video or even 100 videos, were judging it off of years of ineptness.
And why should I look at NCAA videos to see something about madden? Ive been told they have nothing to do with each other.Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Yeah, your definition is in line with EA's. I thought their blog about 3-4 man tackles last year was hilarious. Problem is, EA seems to have a MAX of 2, and even that's rare. In Madden, no matter what, if a 3rd defender comes in, someone is taken out. The game seems to have a max of 3 models interacting. And even that's rare.
9 times out of 10, only the 1st defender engages. At best, a 2nd defender may come clean up, knocking the 1st tackler off. In '08, I may have seen 1-2 2-man tackles(2 defenders engaged at the same time) per game. And understand why folks don't like this, especially with all this new control over ball carriers and the talk of broken tackles. The key to bringing down a back is gang tackling. If we can't get more than 1 defender to wrap the ball carrier up, RBs will be running wild.
Watch a Cheifs, Browns, Vikings, Cowboys, Giants, 49ers game... teams with stronger RBs, and see how often it takes 2+ defenders to take them down. It happens quite often.Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Yeah, your definition is in line with EA's. I thought their blog about 3-4 man tackles last year was hilarious. Problem is, EA seems to have a MAX of 2, and even that's rare. In Madden, no matter what, if a 3rd defender comes in, someone is taken out. The game seems to have a max of 3 models interacting. And even that's rare.
9 times out of 10, only the 1st defender engages. At best, a 2nd defender may come clean up, knocking the 1st tackler off. In '08, I may have seen 1-2 2-man tackles(2 defenders engaged at the same time) per game. And understand why folks don't like this, especially with all this new control over ball carriers and the talk of broken tackles. The key to bringing down a back is gang tackling. If we can't get more than 1 defender to wrap the ball carrier up, RBs will be running wild.
Watch a Cheifs, Browns, Vikings, Cowboys, Giants, 49ers game... teams with stronger RBs, and see how often it takes 2+ defenders to take them down. It happens quite often.Note to Tiburon Marketing:
A great product sells itself, no "back of the box" features required! (See Fifa...)
Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Yes. I'm not going to move into the 3 and 4 man yet. At this point why can't we allow two guys at anytime, user controlled to do this? Let's play this out by taking a look at some images.
Image 1
Notice in this image here Linebacker Michael Boley is on the ball carriers hip. This was due to the angle he took as well as the position of the HB. Now you have CB DeAngelo Hall here. What users want from what I gather is that in this given situation, they want to take over Hall and come in and finish off the runner. But this level of complexity has not been there in Madden and NCAA. Not saying it's not there this go around, I dont know but let's explore some issues as to why it has not been there. First of all, let's look at McAlister and Boley. Linebackers do not waist tackle like that in Madden/NCAA. It's always been the super hit or miss. And if it was the super hit the play was over.
Second, McAlister has momentum and it does not completely come to a halt just because he encounters a defender, but in Madden/NCAA that has always been the case. Even though you have momentum, once you come into contact that momentum comes to a skreetching halt. Third, because of his momentum now it is a struggle/fight between McAlister and Boley. With Boley holding on, Hall should be able to come in and clean up. In Madden/NCAA we have never been able to do this. But this is true two player tackling. Hall doesn't have to knock Boley off. Boley is already in a position to where Hall or any other defender coming in will not knock him off. The key here though for this to happen is the back has to struggle upon contact with the first defender, something that has not been a part of Madden/NCAA.
EA has done a good job of capturing this
These are hits that are a part of the game and EA has done a good job of capturing those style of hits. However, context for those style of hits are not taken seriously. Ray Lewis decleated Pittman here because Pittman was unaware of Lewis. In EA's game you decleat players even when they are aware of you. It's the same thing with the pancake blocking. In video games they have guys pancaking guys that should not get pancaked. Linemen are most likely not going to pancake a defender who is aware of them. I see it in All Pro all the time and just shake my head. The OLB is standing there looking right at the TE and gets pancaked. Makes no sense.
Diagram 3
What EA has not been so good at is the above diagram. George and the defender are both aware of one another. George's momentum carries him. Even though the defender makes the tackle he does not stop George upon contact and as a result George scored the TD in that game. No struggle by the backs = flat tackling/break tackling. Seems to me that's what people who are criticizing are getting at.
The images here are rather fluid and my interpretation is not the only one, but I just tried to give some visual of what it is people seem to be talking about in their critique.Note to Tiburon Marketing:
A great product sells itself, no "back of the box" features required! (See Fifa...)
Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
okay, the video was impressive, but I have a few concerns. My main concern was the 4 year old "15 yard facemask" tackle where they two tango in a circle. I dont have a major problem with that animation, but I don't see how physics can prompt that, especially since it's a KNOWN canned animation.
However, I flat out LOVE the :59 second mark where the ball carrier is running and the defender grabs his facemask, and he breaks out and keeps running. I HOPE they have face mask penalties in the game this year.fool me once... shame on me.
Let's get the fantasy football section poppin!
http://www.operationsports.com/forums/fantasy-football/Comment
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Re: Madden 09: Tackling Engine Blog & Video
Yes. I'm not going to move into the 3 and 4 man yet. At this point why can't we allow two guys at anytime, user controlled to do this? Let's play this out by taking a look at some images.
Image 1
Notice in this image here Linebacker Michael Boley is on the ball carriers hip. This was due to the angle he took as well as the position of the HB. Now you have CB DeAngelo Hall here. What users want from what I gather is that in this given situation, they want to take over Hall and come in and finish off the runner. But this level of complexity has not been there in Madden and NCAA. Not saying it's not there this go around, I dont know but let's explore some issues as to why it has not been there. First of all, let's look at McAlister and Boley. Linebackers do not waist tackle like that in Madden/NCAA. It's always been the super hit or miss. And if it was the super hit the play was over.
Second, McAlister has momentum and it does not completely come to a halt just because he encounters a defender, but in Madden/NCAA that has always been the case. Even though you have momentum, once you come into contact that momentum comes to a skreetching halt. Third, because of his momentum now it is a struggle/fight between McAlister and Boley. With Boley holding on, Hall should be able to come in and clean up. In Madden/NCAA we have never been able to do this. But this is true two player tackling. Hall doesn't have to knock Boley off. Boley is already in a position to where Hall or any other defender coming in will not knock him off. The key here though for this to happen is the back has to struggle upon contact with the first defender, something that has not been a part of Madden/NCAA.
EA has done a good job of capturing this
These are hits that are a part of the game and EA has done a good job of capturing those style of hits. However, context for those style of hits are not taken seriously. Ray Lewis decleated Pittman here because Pittman was unaware of Lewis. In EA's game you decleat players even when they are aware of you. It's the same thing with the pancake blocking. In video games they have guys pancaking guys that should not get pancaked. Linemen are most likely not going to pancake a defender who is aware of them. I see it in All Pro all the time and just shake my head. The OLB is standing there looking right at the TE and gets pancaked. Makes no sense.
Diagram 3
What EA has not been so good at is the above diagram. George and the defender are both aware of one another. George's momentum carries him. Even though the defender makes the tackle he does not stop George upon contact and as a result George scored the TD in that game. No struggle by the backs = flat tackling/break tackling. Seems to me that's what people who are criticizing are getting at.
The images here are rather fluid and my interpretation is not the only one, but I just tried to give some visual of what it is people seem to be talking about in their critique.Last edited by Vadiplomat04; 05-15-2008, 02:15 PM.Comment
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