Cheesing Online

**akula** · 09-23-2009, 09:53 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

I don't disagree but.. I don't feel cheesing works in NHL 10 (not very well anyways)

what IS cheesing in NHL 10?

**seasprite** · 09-23-2009, 10:02 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

I only know of one cheesing/glitch goal in 10 that works everytime, but it is easily defendable by playing decent defense. I would like an example of this "cheese" that you are experiencing in10.

**Redshirt_EA** · 09-23-2009, 10:11 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

Originally posted by seasprite

I only know of one cheesing/glitch goal in 10 that works everytime, but it is easily defendable by playing decent defense. I would like an example of this "cheese" that you are experiencing in10.

Private message me with a description of the cheese you know.

**seasprite** · 09-23-2009, 10:18 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

Check your PMs Redshirt

**swil** · 09-23-2009, 10:23 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

There's a website that allows you to look up teams before/as you play them. You can view wins/losses/ player stats.

My club does this to avoid the cheese.

The tell-tale signs are typically ridiculous goals-to-games ratio. Like a guy whose played 40 games and has 100+ goals.

**Lerxt** · 09-23-2009, 10:25 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

I disagree totally. I am having a blast online. I have had great games in all but one case, where a guy would literally take a penalty every whistle for roughing after the play. I beat him 3-0 because I was constantly on the PP. Other than that one experience, I have loved every second of the online experience...

**thegenerel** · 09-23-2009, 11:13 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

Originally posted by swil

There's a website that allows you to look up teams before/as you play them. You can view wins/losses/ player stats.

My club does this to avoid the cheese.

The tell-tale signs are typically ridiculous goals-to-games ratio. Like a guy whose played 40 games and has 100+ goals.

link?

**seasprite** · 09-23-2009, 11:15 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

Originally posted by thegenerel

link?

Easportsworld under the NHL10 link

**clivo1050** · 09-23-2009, 11:41 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

Originally posted by Fierce Robot

I can't stand it!!

The first UNRANKED team game I play is a boring 0-0 because of the freaky goalies. It goes to a shootout and the host cuts me and some other guy out of the shoot out so he and his buddy can do it all...they lost. But why would you do that to someone??

I played some quick play ranked 1 on 1 and I get met with cheesers!!! I have to laugh because the ammount of players that cheese is just as bad again as it was for 09. I congratulate EA and Litty for trying to shutdown the cheesing glitch goals but you can't do anything about some of the people who play the product.

Put simply I hate this game online. It is a sure fire way to go from looking to have some fun to getting so damn frustrated.

This is a very good look at who people are becomming these days. We are cheap, selfish and so success driven that we can't see how this destroys human community. And in this age, online communication and entertainment is a massive form of community.

Cheating or being cheap online is the practise of selfishness against another person, its like ripping off a stranger in the street. It focusses only on the self with no regard for the other. The other gamer is merely there to be abused.

I am absolutely convinced that this thread will make no difference whatsoever...but I have to say it. Here is the thing, if you don't cheese you may lose more games...what to do? Don't bloody cheese damnit, play hard and don't abuse the stranger playing against you living somewhere else in the world. Why? Because surely people matter more than a video game!!!

I for one don't give a cat's nuts what your online record is, just keep in mind that you are not cheesing the cpu...you are cheesing real bloody people!!!

I agree with your comments about cheesing. Being an almost exclusive online only player, this year's online experience is extremely frustrating. Last year, I had around a 75% win percentage online. This year, i'm around 50%. The strategy most people use online is look for one timers every time down ice. I can stop almost all of them, but when they get a good chance it usually goes in. With this year's goalies, 1 or 2 cheap one timers is usually enough to win.

I find it very hard to win on a consistent basis this year when vastly outplaying my opponent. 09's online system was more balanced. As in, the person who outplayed the other person usually won the game. This doesn't happen on a consistent basis in nhl 10.

Also, don't even get me started on the OTP boosts.

**Redshirt_EA** · 09-23-2009, 11:46 AM

Re: Cheesing Online

Originally posted by swil

There's a website that allows you to look up teams before/as you play them. You can view wins/losses/ player stats.

My club does this to avoid the cheese.

The tell-tale signs are typically ridiculous goals-to-games ratio. Like a guy whose played 40 games and has 100+ goals.

I'm not sure this is a reliable approach. We matched up against the #1 team ranked team yesterday and they have a number of players with ridiculous stats and they played a good honest game against us. Unless they were on best behaviour because they know my gamertag I would say they play clean, and I can see how they would rack up some big numbers against any team that didn't know how to play tight defense. If we'd backed out on them because of their stats we'd have missed out on a great game and some education on how to play too.

The best solution to cheese in EASHL is to have more human players. A half-decent human defenseman can take most of the scoring chances for positions where a CPU goalie has weaknesses -- and a strong human goalie would take away those weaknesses too.

That said, I have to say that I'm not seeing much cheese at all in EASHL though. There are a few weak spots we are aware of and actively addressing but so far I'm fairly happy with the goal scoring balance in the game and the style of hockey it encourages.

Of course as people master the game they may uncover unforeseen weaknesses, this is why we've added the ability to tweak gameplay parameters from the server: so that we can address problems without the lengthy turnaround time of a title update. Can't fix everything this way, but it can help in a lot of scenarios.

Addressing the initial post, I agree that probably will have no effect to plead for people to not exploit weaknesses in the game. The problem with having "house rules" that you expect strangers to follow is that the lines are going to be grey and without consensus. When a player feels the other guy is crossing a line he'll likely respond with whatever cheese he knows. Some people start out with the intent to do anything it takes to win, others will switch to that mode if the other guy does something they don't like, and others still if they end up behind in a game, or if the other player is just better (and a rare few not at all). The conclusion to draw is that the game needs to be tight and not have exploits, or at least have as few as possible. Frankly, that's harder than it sounds to achieve and I'm proud so far of how well NHL10 is holding up.

One last point, there's a difference between skill and cheese. There are a lot of great players out there and the online games can be extremely competitive. Someone venturing out there having only played against the CPU could be in for quite a shock. I'm not saying anyone here is doing this, but I have seen people cry "cheese" just because the other player was skilled and they had no answer to it (as opposed to no answer existing). That is not cheese in my books. I want the game to have the sort of depth where it is possible to have prodigious skill and strategy make that much of a difference.

**kerosene31** · 09-23-2009, 12:15 PM

Re: Cheesing Online

Online you are always going to have people that find whatever combination or strategy gives them the best percentage of success (even if the advantage is tiny) and do it over and over and over and over and over. That's just human nature. Game devs can't fix people. All we can hope is that most of the glitch goals are fixed (haven't seen any yet myself but I don't play a ton). If any do exist, you hope they are easy to stop.

This is why I don't play online at all except EASHL when I have teammates who can easily shut down these "one trick pony" teams.

**swil** · 09-23-2009, 12:48 PM

Re: Cheesing Online

Originally posted by Redshirt_EA

I'm not sure this is a reliable approach. We matched up against the #1 team ranked team yesterday and they have a number of players with ridiculous stats and they played a good honest game against us. Unless they were on best behaviour because they know my gamertag I would say they play clean, and I can see how they would rack up some big numbers against any team that didn't know how to play tight defense. If we'd backed out on them because of their stats we'd have missed out on a great game and some education on how to play too.

The best solution to cheese in EASHL is to have more human players. A half-decent human defenseman can take most of the scoring chances for positions where a CPU goalie has weaknesses -- and a strong human goalie would take away those weaknesses too.

That said, I have to say that I'm not seeing much cheese at all in EASHL though. There are a few weak spots we are aware of and actively addressing but so far I'm fairly happy with the goal scoring balance in the game and the style of hockey it encourages.

Of course as people master the game they may uncover unforeseen weaknesses, this is why we've added the ability to tweak gameplay parameters from the server: so that we can address problems without the lengthy turnaround time of a title update. Can't fix everything this way, but it can help in a lot of scenarios.

Addressing the initial post, I agree that probably will have no effect to plead for people to not exploit weaknesses in the game. The problem with having "house rules" that you expect strangers to follow is that the lines are going to be grey and without consensus. When a player feels the other guy is crossing a line he'll likely respond with whatever cheese he knows. Some people start out with the intent to do anything it takes to win, others will switch to that mode if the other guy does something they don't like, and others still if they end up behind in a game, or if the other player is just better (and a rare few not at all). The conclusion to draw is that the game needs to be tight and not have exploits, or at least have as few as possible. Frankly, that's harder than it sounds to achieve and I'm proud so far of how well NHL10 is holding up.

One last point, there's a difference between skill and cheese. There are a lot of great players out there and the online games can be extremely competitive. Someone venturing out there having only played against the CPU could be in for quite a shock. I'm not saying anyone here is doing this, but I have seen people cry "cheese" just because the other player was skilled and they had no answer to it (as opposed to no answer existing). That is not cheese in my books. I want the game to have the sort of depth where it is possible to have prodigious skill and strategy make that much of a difference.

Interesting.... thanks for the insight. I will share this with my club. Even if we are incorrect at positively ID'ing cheesers, these teams we do choose to avoid would likely beat the pants off of us anyway!

Our goal in checking this website is to ensure we get a fun, competitive game everytime.

I will say that the match ups this year are much closer than last years - which is great!

**seasprite** · 09-23-2009, 01:01 PM

Re: Cheesing Online

The scouting feature in 10 is beast

**swil** · 09-23-2009, 01:10 PM

Re: Cheesing Online

Originally posted by seasprite

The scouting feature in 10 is beast

how does it work?

Cheesing Online

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