Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

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  • harriman8
    Rookie
    • May 2003
    • 11

    #1

    Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

    I'm playing in a 3-man online franchise. I'm the Bears and one of the other guys is the Titans. We both go 16-0 (yeah I know) and make it to the Super Bowl. Now my team has battled injuries all year long and had Forte and Hester out most of the season (both back for SB) while his Titans have enjoyed an injury-free campaign and Chris Johnson has rushed for 2100+ yards. All of my games have been fairly competitive but he has blown out most of his competition save for a a couple of teams. We play a realistic style of play but don't have any rules in place because we've never needed to.

    I win the toss and elect to kickoff. He puts together a decent drive but I manage to hold CJ in check for the most part and he kicks a 51 yard FG to take a 3-0 lead in the first.

    My first possession I manage to drive a little ways but have to punt. I come up in punt and notice he is in punt block. I punt and pin him at the 2 yard line.

    His next play Urlacher busts through the line and hits Johnson before Collins can hand the ball off and my DL cleans up Collins for the safety.

    Titans 3 Bears 2 end of 1st QTR.

    I get the ball back on free kick and manage to get a TD pass Cutler to Bennett. The 2-point conversion fails. Bears 8 Titans 3.

    He gets the ball and gets a TD drive to go back up 10-8 halfway through the 2nd qtr.

    We trade punts after each having a 3 & out and he again comes up in punt block.

    I hold on his next drive.

    I get a TD and 2-point conversion to take a 16-10 lead.

    I get an INT with around 2:00 to go in half. He holds again and I punt for the 3rd time in the half and again he comes up in punt block (leaving my outside gunners completely uncovered for the 3rd time).

    Halftime

    I get the opening kickoff and get to my 36 yard line with a 4th and 3. Now he has come out in punt block every time I've punted so far so I decided to call a fake and see if he comes out again in punt block leaving the outside gunners uncovered.

    A little aside here I have never called a fake punt in an online game or offline game. I only went for it on 4th down 2 times during the regular season but both with traditional plays converting 1 of 2. My thinking here is that it is early in the 3rd and if I fail to pick up the 3 yards the best he can do is go up 17-16 early in the 3rd qtr. He hasn't moved the ball particularly well to this point so I figure the reward is worth the risk and if he doesn't come out in punt block I can always audible to a punt or call a timeout.

    He does in fact come out in punt block so I run the play. It turns out he is in punt block zone and his defenders drop back into the routes of my receivers. I throw (with my punter mind you) underneath to my backup FS short of the first but he manages to juke a defender and barely get the first down. I go on to pick up a FG on the drive and lead 19-10 early in the 3rd.

    To make an already long story a little shorter the game remains a defensive struggle into the 4th and Collins throws his second pick of the game on the 5 yard line about halfway through the 4th quarter with the score still 19-10.

    Titans owner gets pissed off and says that the fake punt was not realistic and quits the game and the league. I argue that while risky it wasn't unrealistic. A special teams coach sees 3 straight punt blocks where no one is covering the outside receivers. I very much think the fake is a call that would be called given the way the game was going and seeing the receivers left uncovered for a 4th time.

    It wasn't like I called some cheese play that couldn't be stopped. I called my first ever fake punt and had to execute a punter to backup FS pass and catch and run to convert.

    So for those of you who actually took the time to read all of this (thank you BTW) what do you think. Was the play reasonable at that point in the game and is the Titans owner overreacting?

    Bears won 19-10.
  • JayInSaratoga
    Rookie
    • Aug 2009
    • 233

    #2
    Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

    I think it's fair. That's just out coaching your opponent. Reacting and capitalizing on his tenancies.

    There are coaches in the NFL that would have tried the same thing in that situation.

    Comment

    • ktipton87
      Rookie
      • Sep 2009
      • 164

      #3
      Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

      Very realistic and fair. The odds were in his favor, so he shouldn't be complaining.

      On question I have for you though, is it possible to audible to a punt when you have already called the fake? Same thing with field goals? I just have noticed that I can't audible out of the punt or field goal formations, so I didn't know if it was different for fakes or not? Which buttons do you press?

      Comment

      • KBLover
        Hall Of Fame
        • Aug 2009
        • 12172

        #4
        Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

        Yeah, fake punts are SO unrealistic - they NEVER happen in the NFL (end sarcasm)

        You did nothing wrong. You took a chance in a tight game based on the fact your defense was playing pretty well all game long.

        In fact, he seemed to at least expect it or at least wanted be prepared for the possibility by calling a defense out of the punt block formation instead of just attacking the punter.

        It also sounds like you broke a tackle to get just enough for the first down.

        I think he's complaining because he got beat on the play. It's the "if I couldn't stop it, it must have been cheese" mentality.

        Cheese, cheese, cheese - it's like the only thing people who play look out for. Never mind your coaching strategy or your thought process - just looking out for something to call cheese.

        Thank you for reminding me why I don't play online and congrats on your win and solid gameplan.
        "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

        Comment

        • JaymeeAwesome
          Dynasty Guru
          • Jan 2005
          • 4152

          #5
          Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

          If anything he was being unrealistic doing punt block in non punt block situations. No NFL team is that agressive when they don't have the other team backed up in their own endzone.
          -

          Madden 15 Sliders: Realistic Game Stat Sliders for Madden 15

          Madden 15 Dynasty: The NFL Reborn...

          Comment

          • Tyrant8RDFL
            MVP
            • Feb 2004
            • 3563

            #6
            Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

            Your Quote:
            I get the opening kickoff and get to my <h4>36 yard line with a 4th and 3</h4>. Now he has come out in punt block every time I've punted so far so I decided to call a fake and see if he comes out again in punt block leaving the outside gunners uncovered.


            My response:
            I can see his point of view simply becuase where you attempted the fake punt. You was on your own 36yrd line and it was 4th and 3. Now I dont ever recall seeing any team do this on a close game early in the 3rd qtr and being on their own 36.

            I can see why he got upset. On your own 45yrd line or somewhere in his territory would be realistic, but on your own 36 at the time and the score. Sorry man I agree with him.

            I would apologize to him and just replay the game. I could see what your saying but your timing or placement on the field wasnt right when you attempted it.
            Last edited by Tyrant8RDFL; 10-20-2009, 12:51 PM.
            Simply *Magic* Just click the link and Watch :)
            http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2043715147

            Comment

            • bill2451
              Banned
              • Jan 2009
              • 1123

              #7
              Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

              on your own 36, its a bit of a stretch to call the fake but given your reasoning I dont think it's unreasonable... so basically idk if i agree w/ the decision in that situation, but I could see it happening

              personally I think you going for the 2 point conversion that early in the game was more unrealistic though lol... no reason to play the numbers game (trying to go up 7 instead of 6) that early in the game
              Last edited by bill2451; 10-20-2009, 01:30 PM.

              Comment

              • johnkorean
                Rookie
                • Jan 2008
                • 104

                #8
                Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                Originally posted by Tyrant8RDFL
                Your Quote:
                I get the opening kickoff and get to my <h4>36 yard line with a 4th and 3</h4>. Now he has come out in punt block every time I've punted so far so I decided to call a fake and see if he comes out again in punt block leaving the outside gunners uncovered.


                My response:
                I can see his point of view simply becuase where you attempted the fake punt. You was on your own 36yrd line and it was 4th and 3. Now I dont ever recall seeing any team do this on a close game early in the 3rd qtr and being on their own 36.

                I can see why he got upset. On your own 45yrd line or somewhere in his territory would be realistic, but on your own 36 at the time and the score. Sorry man I agree with him.

                I would apologize to him and just replay the game. I could see what your saying but your timing or placement on the field wasnt right when you attempted it.
                I feel like the Jets just did this twice last week against the Dolphins on MNF. The first one was I think 4th and 6 from the 34. Seems realistic to me.

                Comment

                • mavfan21
                  MVP
                  • Jul 2007
                  • 1842

                  #9
                  Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                  Totally fair and legit. You did nothing wrong.

                  Big risk to fake punt there.
                  Don't look back too long and don't look too far ahead.

                  Comment

                  • blocknose
                    Rookie
                    • Jun 2007
                    • 347

                    #10
                    Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                    awsome call that guy is a poor loser i have been waiting to do this in my franchise to the guys that try to block a punt every time but im a bit scared to do it still

                    Comment

                    • KBLover
                      Hall Of Fame
                      • Aug 2009
                      • 12172

                      #11
                      Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                      Real life coaches do things all the time that are stretches or gambles. They do things we or even other coaches probably would say "Why did he do that? I wouldn't have done that."

                      I guess we as coaches in Madden aren't "allowed" to do so because then it's "cheese".

                      I guess I don't understand the MP mentality. Surprising your opponent and sometimes taking high-risk decisions is as much coaching as having a solid gameplan and "playing straight".

                      I guess if he didn't fake punt, suddenly it would be "okay"? Not that it would make any more logical sense to me, but is that the MP "rule"?
                      "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

                      Comment

                      • Tyrant8RDFL
                        MVP
                        • Feb 2004
                        • 3563

                        #12
                        Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                        Originally posted by KBLover
                        Real life coaches do things all the time that are stretches or gambles. They do things we or even other coaches probably would say "Why did he do that? I wouldn't have done that."

                        I guess we as coaches in Madden aren't "allowed" to do so because then it's "cheese".

                        I guess I don't understand the MP mentality. Surprising your opponent and sometimes taking high-risk decisions is as much coaching as having a solid gameplan and "playing straight".

                        I guess if he didn't fake punt, suddenly it would be "okay"? Not that it would make any more logical sense to me, but is that the MP "rule"?
                        I agree with you good point. I guess the pressure of the game and what was at stake made things out to be the way it turned out, and that fake punt pissed him off so much that it ruined his mind set for the rest of the game. He then realized he couldnt recover from it later in the game and decided to quit.That does happen.

                        In a online league where things are expected to be sim going for it on your own 36 on a
                        4th and 3 would cause problems. I would have not done it.

                        There's A certain unwritten code of conduct for online play that exist when players decide to play the league in a sim manner, and it is to be uphold and when someone does something outside the norm this is what happens.
                        Simply *Magic* Just click the link and Watch :)
                        http://www.operationsports.com/forum...post2043715147

                        Comment

                        • KBLover
                          Hall Of Fame
                          • Aug 2009
                          • 12172

                          #13
                          Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                          Originally posted by Tyrant8RDFL
                          In a online league where things are expected to be sim going for it on your own 36 on a
                          4th and 3 would cause problems. I would have not done it.

                          There's A certain unwritten code of conduct for online play that exist when players decide to play the league in a sim manner, and it is to be uphold and when someone does something outside the norm this is what happens.
                          Doing things outside the norm is also "sim". Wildcat anyone, or should Goddell ban it because it's "cheese"? Running with Vick so much he gets 1000 yds back when Vick was the Falcons?

                          Some coaches blitz more than most "normal" coaches. LeBeau and Jim Johnson (RIP) come to mind.

                          Belichek played Troy Brown at CB one year. If that happened in Madden, even if someone got freak injury luck and lost their starting CBs, I bet it would be cries of "Cheese!" heard all over.

                          You play to win the game. While exploiting AI glitches is one thing, confusing and surprising your opponent is part of being a "sim" style coach. It's more than "don't call this unless XYZ".

                          To me, being a "sim" coach is weighing the options of the situation and if you take a risk, have sufficient reward for doing so while also having a logical decision for doing so in case it fails.

                          That's just smart coaching, which is "sim".
                          "Some people call it butterflies, but to him, it probably feels like pterodactyls in his stomach." --Plesac in MLB18

                          Comment

                          • nickohrn
                            Rookie
                            • Dec 2008
                            • 26

                            #14
                            Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                            Originally posted by KBLover
                            Doing things outside the norm is also "sim". Wildcat anyone, or should Goddell ban it because it's "cheese"? Running with Vick so much he gets 1000 yds back when Vick was the Falcons?

                            Some coaches blitz more than most "normal" coaches. LeBeau and Jim Johnson (RIP) come to mind.

                            Belichek played Troy Brown at CB one year. If that happened in Madden, even if someone got freak injury luck and lost their starting CBs, I bet it would be cries of "Cheese!" heard all over.

                            You play to win the game. While exploiting AI glitches is one thing, confusing and surprising your opponent is part of being a "sim" style coach. It's more than "don't call this unless XYZ".

                            To me, being a "sim" coach is weighing the options of the situation and if you take a risk, have sufficient reward for doing so while also having a logical decision for doing so in case it fails.

                            That's just smart coaching, which is "sim".
                            Hear, hear!

                            Comment

                            • MAHAM
                              Rookie
                              • Aug 2008
                              • 323

                              #15
                              Re: Realistic or not? Need some opinions.

                              On 4th down, the playscreen always goes to 'ask madden'. Ask madden never gives a normal punt. I dont think he was intentionally trying to show block, and probably did that all season without realising the importance of having someone on the gunner.

                              You say its realistic and it is, but isnt it also realistic to play max protect with all the extra guys on the line? In years previous, punts actually got blocked and you had to go max protect every once in a while, not this year really. The only thing I think is a bit cheesy is that Madden doesnt have real special teams packages, but definately not an easy play to hit, ballsy really.

                              Comment

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