Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

[ps3ownz]

Sounds like another epic Madden fail, I cann see they will make it even more arcade for the casuals. IN GAME SAVES have been around for ages, for gods sakes EA, smarten up.

[joejccva71]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

I've read through Ian's posts here, but I still don't see how you can make a game simpler and faster, but yet make it deeper.

The idea behind having a deep game is having ALOT of information presented to you with ALOT of different options at your disposal, whether it be in on the field itself or throughout the franchise mode.

How can you possibly make the on-field gameplay SIMPLER but yet DEEPER? The same applies to the depths of franchise mode.

Maybe I'm just dumb and can't comprehend this.

[ODogg]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

Maybe think of the option play. It's a simple concept but offers a wealth of choices and is deep in the number of options you can do with it. I think that's akin to what Ian is saying.

[BezO]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

I've read through Ian's posts here, but I still don't see how you can make a game simpler and faster, but yet make it deeper.

The idea behind having a deep game is having ALOT of information presented to you with ALOT of different options at your disposal, whether it be in on the field itself or throughout the franchise mode.

How can you possibly make the on-field gameplay SIMPLER but yet DEEPER? The same applies to the depths of franchise mode.

Maybe I'm just dumb and can't comprehend this.

Football is just a complex sport. Simplifying it is not the answer IMO. The way to make this game accessible is to include options to automate the complexities. Give those with football knowledge the tools to play football. Give those w/o the knowledge options to automate what they can't/won't account for.

But hey, maybe that's exactly what they're doing.

[joejccva71]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

Football is just a complex sport. Simplifying it is not the answer IMO. The way to make this game accessible is to include options to automate the complexities. Give those with football knowledge the tools to play football. Give those w/o the knowledge options to automate what they can't/won't account for.

But hey, maybe that's exactly what they're doing.

Good call BezO and thats exactly how it should be. This way...everyone wins.

[Rocky]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

I just doubt that EA and Madden can capture that COD/Halo crowd they seem to be going for with this. Those guys who put in hours and hours online are always going to be there, imo. I don't mind making things easier for online gamers...but having your slogan for your next game be directed towards them is a huge mistake.

I firmly believe that EA needs to get back those NFL fanatics. Too many people who love football, loved growing up playing football video games, etc. are looking at the increasing prices of games and systems but not seeing Madden look any smoother or realistic animation wise. The PS2 game had better looking animations quite honestly. Slowing the game down in M10 made those animations look even worse.

My focus would've been animations, animations, locomotion, animations, sidelines/crowd, animations, franchise, superstar, online in that order.

[lgxjames]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

I have to say, I'm not worried...

[ODogg]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

Rocky - at one time all FPS were offline too, the online community has grown significantly and I don't see why the same couldn't apply to sports gaming.

[Tyrant8RDFL]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

Sounds like another epic Madden fail, I cann see they will make it even more arcade for the casuals. IN GAME SAVES have been around for ages, for gods sakes EA, smarten up.

I've read through Ian's posts here, but I still don't see how you can make a game simpler and faster, but yet make it deeper.

The idea behind having a deep game is having ALOT of information presented to you with ALOT of different options at your disposal, whether it be in on the field itself or throughout the franchise mode.

How can you possibly make the on-field gameplay SIMPLER but yet DEEPER? The same applies to the depths of franchise mode.

Maybe I'm just dumb and can't comprehend this.

Football is just a complex sport. Simplifying it is not the answer IMO. The way to make this game accessible is to include options to automate the complexities. Give those with football knowledge the tools to play football. Give those w/o the knowledge options to automate what they can't/won't account for.

But hey, maybe that's exactly what they're doing.

I definitely agree with the 3 replies above.

My bigest concern is the areas they are focusing on. The reason why many online players seem to use a small handfull of plays is simply because of how Madden's A.I is not up to par. Let me explain.

Gamers will use a play over and over that has a good success rate, and that is becuase madden has not done a good job in giving us plays that combat those plays. Thus making the decision for many to use the same plays over and over easy with no regrets.

This is why a gamer online will use just a small handufll of plays. It works.

I personally use more plays the 13, but Im in the minority of a sim baller.

What Madden should focus on is a full counter system for every play they impliment into the playbooks on both sides (Offense and Defense). This way when they play a real football gamer the game will become a strategic battle, and forcing them to choose more plays.

I can go into great detail on what can be done, but the chance of them seeing it is very small, also EA needs to realize that they are to blame for this.

Well let see what happens but this article for me is discouraging , and the only thing I can see making me interested in Madden. Would be how the gameplay looks. Especially animation wise. The biggest reason why I have never purchased a next gen Madden.

I have stayed with Madden 8 on the PC. Im hoping Madden 11 can change that. Right now from what Im reading I will still be on Madden 08 PC.

[ODogg]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

Wow, great post Tyrant8RDFL, I hope Ian is reading this because that is the TRUTH. What I wrote is true also, but you took it from another perspective and I think yours is the biggest reason why players only use a small number of plays. As Madden himself would say, if they can't stop it, keep doing it. And in Madden that's true of certain plays, there is no way to stop it a lot of times so the other guy just keeps running it. They really need to look at the whole point/counterpoint aspect of football and realize it in the game.

[CreatineKasey]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

I definitely agree with the 3 replies above.

My bigest concern is the areas they are focusing on. The reason why many online players seem to use a small handfull of plays is simply because of how Madden's A.I is not up to par. Let me explain.

Gamers will use a play over and over that has a good success rate, and that is becuase madden has not done a good job in giving us plays that combat those plays. Thus making the decision for many to use the same plays over and over easy with no regrets.

This is why a gamer online will use just a small handufll of plays. It works.

I personally use more plays the 13, but Im in the minority of a sim baller.

What Madden should focus on is a full counter system for every play they impliment into the playbooks on both sides (Offense and Defense). This way when they play a real football gamer the game will become a strategic battle, and forcing them to choose more plays.

I can go into great detail on what can be done, but the chance of them seeing it is very small, also EA needs to realize that they are to blame for this.

Well let see what happens but this article for me is discouraging , and the only thing I can see making me interested in Madden. Would be how the gameplay looks. Especially animation wise. The biggest reason why I have never purchased a next gen Madden.

I have stayed with Madden 8 on the PC. Im hoping Madden 11 can change that. Right now from what Im reading I will still be on Madden 08 PC.

I like the idea of more contrived counters for sure. I know football is random and not black and white, but anyone who has spent a fair amount of time online knows that players can bank on a handful of tactics to work for an entire game. There isn't much "mixing in" of plays.

Personally I like to think I'm the opposite of that type of gamer. I'm one who tries not to call the same plays more than twice. It has obvious advantages. The first advantage being that the user controlled pass defender legitimately has no idea what's coming and is therefore stripped of his inherent advantage to CPU players: he doesn't know what's coming either.

That being said, it gets very frustrating see the PA flats work consistently against blitzes when the user isn't setting up those plays with run calls. In reality, defenders should be obliterating the QB if he's trying to pull off playaction without actually running the ball.

On defense, many people find 1 or 2 blitzes that get through consistently and call it a day. One trick ponies are just everywhere in ranked matches. These guys bank on someone now knowing a basic counter to their strategy.

Where I think things get really sad is when you see guys who play this game for money. They play just like the ranked lobby kids: 1 base play and audibling/hot routing from it. What does this tell us: It's really the best way to play if your main goal is to win at all costs. That's not good. That needs to change. There's clear logical reasons why teams don't come out in the same play every play. That logic needs to be reflected in Madden in some way.

To be completely blunt, Madden becomes a pretty terrible experience once the chess match is stripped from it. That's what some of the top players do. Madden needs to learn from real time strategy games. Promoting smart decisions, unpredictability, and an overall engaging chess match is the reason football is successful in real life, and is exactly where Madden needs to go to compete with FPS in the competitive game arena.

I'd like to see mechanisms within the game that force varied playcalling. Something as simple as that would add so much to the game. Nothing kills Madden (or any video game nonetheless) more than people "gaming the game". It sucks the life out of everything you intend to do in a game. It becomes a moral battle. It's you playing a guy willing to mess with the AI for an advantage while you won't. I'd rather have the moral battle be gone.

Interestingly, Tecmo Super Bowl's simple concept of "guessing plays" eliminates money plays and repetitive playcalling right then and there. Tecmo does more with it's 8 plays than many Madden games do with their 300. There's a lesson to be learned there, guys.

Rant over. I'd love to hear opinions on this.

[yungmizzou]

Re: Madden 11 Hints From EA

There focusing on nothing that matters. Typical.

[Rocky]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

Rocky - at one time all FPS were offline too, the online community has grown significantly and I don't see why the same couldn't apply to sports gaming.

I hear what you are saying, but watching a football game takes a pretty big investment in itself. We're talking about 3+ hours there. That's 1/3rd of the time it takes to play a game in Madden and this is without in-game saves.

FPS's and sports games are different breeds. First of all, there are a plethora of video gamers who have ZERO interest in sports. The vast majority. These players won't flock to Madden because of these new options. Sports games and pro sports in general are predicated on seasons and championships specifically....especially american football. I think ignoring this aspect is hurting Madden a bit.

Alot of gamers WANT the game to be an investment. I want to be wowed if I take an hour or 2 away from my family to play. I fear that this new focus may cheapen the experience a little bit.

I could be completely wrong...maybe this will get alot more gamers back on board with the series. I don't know though.

[lofeazy]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

Tyrant8RDFL & CreatineKasey great post.

[Rashad19]

Re: Madden NFL 11 Hints From EA (IGN)

I like the idea of more contrived counters for sure. I know football is random and not black and white, but anyone who has spent a fair amount of time online knows that players can bank on a handful of tactics to work for an entire game. There isn't much "mixing in" of plays.

Personally I like to think I'm the opposite of that type of gamer. I'm one who tries not to call the same plays more than twice. It has obvious advantages. The first advantage being that the user controlled pass defender legitimately has no idea what's coming and is therefore stripped of his inherent advantage to CPU players: he doesn't know what's coming either.

That being said, it gets very frustrating see the PA flats work consistently against blitzes when the user isn't setting up those plays with run calls. In reality, defenders should be obliterating the QB if he's trying to pull off playaction without actually running the ball.

On defense, many people find 1 or 2 blitzes that get through consistently and call it a day. One trick ponies are just everywhere in ranked matches. These guys bank on someone now knowing a basic counter to their strategy.

Where I think things get really sad is when you see guys who play this game for money. They play just like the ranked lobby kids: 1 base play and audibling/hot routing from it. What does this tell us: It's really the best way to play if your main goal is to win at all costs. That's not good. That needs to change. There's clear logical reasons why teams don't come out in the same play every play. That logic needs to be reflected in Madden in some way.

To be completely blunt, Madden becomes a pretty terrible experience once the chess match is stripped from it. That's what some of the top players do. Madden needs to learn from real time strategy games. Promoting smart decisions, unpredictability, and an overall engaging chess match is the reason football is successful in real life, and is exactly where Madden needs to go to compete with FPS in the competitive game arena.

I'd like to see mechanisms within the game that force varied playcalling. Something as simple as that would add so much to the game. Nothing kills Madden (or any video game nonetheless) more than people "gaming the game". It sucks the life out of everything you intend to do in a game. It becomes a moral battle. It's you playing a guy willing to mess with the AI for an advantage while you won't. I'd rather have the moral battle be gone.

Interestingly, Tecmo Super Bowl's simple concept of "guessing plays" eliminates money plays and repetitive playcalling right then and there. Tecmo does more with it's 8 plays than many Madden games do with their 300. There's a lesson to be learned there, guys.

Rant over. I'd love to hear opinions on this.

Great post man!!