[PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

[instant000]

Which version of Madden for PS2 (from 2002-2010) has the best sim engine? Why?

[instant000]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

OK, I've confirmed that it's not 2006 or 2007
I didn't write down any notes on 2007, but, I know it has the problems with #1 backs getting too many carries.

Just simmed a full season on 2006, and have 4 backs over 500 carries. (had a total of 21 with more than 400 carries!!)

542: J. Lewis
538: L. Tomlinson
515: T. Barber
507: J. Jones

Actual NFL records:

<table class="history_legends" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="" onmouseout="this.className=''" onmouseover="this.className='over'"><td class="stat">416</td> <td>Larry Johnson, Kansas City, 2006</td> </tr> <tr onmouseout="this.className='alt'" onmouseover="this.className='over'" class="alt"> <td class="stat">410</td> <td>Jamal Anderson, Atlanta, 1998 </td> </tr> <tr class="" onmouseout="this.className=''" onmouseover="this.className='over'"> <td class="stat">407</td> <td>James Wilder, Tampa Bay, 1984</td></tr></tbody></table>

(Source: http://www.nfl.com/history/randf/records/indiv/rushing)

Since I have 2004 here, I can test on that one, but really wish I could test on 2005, but I'd have to get it at gamespot or somewhere ... I remember where I was when I first played that one, it was so good (which was a good thing, as NCAA 2005 was ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE that year!)

Thanks for the votes.

[instant000]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

OK, so far, 2004 is decent.

Jamal Lewis broke the all-time record for carries in a season with 440 for 2,069, but no one else broke 400 carries.

Also, this was the same season he rushed for his 2,000 yards, so this is a close to a realistic result.

I need data from 2005, 2003, 2002, to complete my analysis. (I seem to remember the problem started somewhere, and I hope the problem started after 2005, as I'd have to reconfigure my mind, to get used to the 2004 controls again!) ... at least 2005, I think it has most of the newer controls.

[PantherBeast_OS]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

I would say ps2 madden 07 because of it's deep offline franchise/owner mode. I loved 07 to death. I miss 07.

[instant000]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

I would say ps2 madden 07 because of it's deep offline franchise/owner mode. I loved 07 to death. I miss 07.

I enjoy that one also, it was the start of lead blocker controls (which, I confess to not using more than a few times). LOL.

But, it was designed to address that problem of not having people go and block the right person.

Sadly, my gripe with it is the sim stats. (Yes, there are probably more important things to gripe about, LOL, but as a solo dynasty player, not much to think about, LOL.)

And, with a tangent to presentation, just booted up ESPN NBA 2k5, and Stuart Scott ... "Pistons ... Bucks, it's going to be off the chiz-ain" LOL.

I think all of the more recent Maddens have that HB1 with too many rush attempts problem, and people just overlook it.

[Blitz1942]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

OK, I've confirmed that it's not 2006 or 2007
I didn't write down any notes on 2007, but, I know it has the problems with #1 backs getting too many carries.

Just simmed a full season on 2006, and have 4 backs over 500 carries. (had a total of 21 with more than 400 carries!!)

542: J. Lewis
538: L. Tomlinson
515: T. Barber
507: J. Jones

Actual NFL records:
(Source: http://www.nfl.com/history/randf/records/indiv/rushing)

Since I have 2004 here, I can test on that one, but really wish I could test on 2005, but I'd have to get it at gamespot or somewhere ... I remember where I was when I first played that one, it was so good (which was a good thing, as NCAA 2005 was ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE that year!)

Thanks for the votes.

I played Madden 07 for a long time, playing several long franchises (15+ years), and never had carry numbers that high. Maybe once a season I'd have a player or two in the 400s (usually in the 420s) but never anywhere near the 500s. Madden 06 I had quite a few players reach the mid to sometimes high 400s, but carrying numbers in the 500s were awefully rare.

[bo4345]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

Most last gen games either had too many Rushing Yards or too many carries in franchise.

I have a distinct memory of Ronnie Brown ALWAYS getting like 2000 yards in Madden 07. I played quite a few franchises in that game, and that stat was always constant.

These problems are attributed to by the Sim Engine not correctly giving the second half back the ball. The HB1 was basically running enough for two players.

[instant000]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

I played Madden 07 for a long time, playing several long franchises (15+ years), and never had carry numbers that high.

I posted stats from Madden 2006. On Madden 2007, I agree, I did not see them as bad as Madden 2006, but they did appear to have the sharing carries issue. If you look at all-time NFL records, (previous post) you don't have people getting 400 carries like it ain't nothing. Madden 2006, just had it really bad on that one sim I did. I mean, if your top 21 rushers have over 400 carries, that is a bad sim, lol.

I'm just saying that multiple players getting 400 carries in a season is bad, no ways around it.

I mean, for purposes of my experiment, I turned injuries off, to prove that people were not getting subbed out, but getting injured, to reduce their carries. (Injuries or no, getting 400 carries in a season is highly unlikely, just because few players will even average enough attempts per game, to achieve it.)

A player has to AVERAGE 25 carries a game, to get 400 carries over the course of a season, and this is unrealistic, considering that NFL records have the top 3 on attempts in NFL history barely clearing 400 carries (as shown in a previous post.

So, to see just how rare it is to get 400 carries, I'll look at the year-by-year regular season attempts per game averages, of the top five rushers (by attempts per game) from the period of 2000-2009 NFL regular season.

Top Five By Season:
Rushing Attempts Per Game, from 2000-2009 NFL, Regular Season

ATPG - ATT - NamE
2000:
25.2 - 403 - e. george
24.8 - 248 - r. williams
24.2 - 387 - e. james
22.5 - 292 - f. taylor
22.2 - 355 - j. bettis

2001:  
25.2 - 151 - e. james
22.2 - 356 - s. davis
21.2 - 340 - c. dillon
21.2 - 339 - l. tomlinson
20.9 - 167 - t. davis


2002:
23.9 - 383 - r. williams
23.2 - 372 - l. tomlinson
22.4 - 323 - p. holmes
21.7 - 325 - d. mcallister
21.4 - 343 - e. george

2003:
24.5 - 392 - r. williams
24.2 - 387 - j. lewis
23.8 - 310 - e. james
22.7 - 318 - s. davis
22.3 - 290 - c. portis

2004:
24.6 - 197 - j. jones
24.5 - 196 - p. holmes
23.2 - 371 - c. martin
23.0 - 345 - c. dillon
22.9 - 343 - c. portis

2005:
24.0 - 360 - e. james
23.1 - 370 - s. alexander
22.3 - 357 - t. barber
22.0 - 352 - c. portis
21.2 - 339 - l. tomlinson

2006:
26.0 - 416 - l. johnson
25.2 - 252 - s. alexander
21.8 - 348 - l. tomlinson
21.6 - 346 - s. jackson
21.3 - 341 - r. johnson

2007:
21.5 - 280 - m. lynch
21.4 - 321 - w. parker
20.3 - 325 - c. portis
20.2 - 324 - e. james
19.9 - 298 - j. lewis

2008:
23.5 - 376 - m. turner
22.7 - 363 - a. peterson
21.4 - 342 - c. portis
21.1 - 253 - s. jackson
19.8 - 316 - m. forte

2009:
23.2 - 301 - c. benson
22.4 - 358 - c. johnson
21.6 - 324 - s. jackson
20.7 - 331 - t. jones
19.6 - 341 - a. peterson

Key: 
ATPG = Rushing Attempts per game
ATT = Rushing Attempts
NAME = Player's Name
--------
source:  [URL="http://www.nfl.com/"]http://www.nfl.com[/URL]

So, from NFL 2000-2009, there have only been four players to average enough carries per game to have a chance at 400 carries in a regular season, and only two of those remained healthy long enough to achieve it: Eddie George, and Larry Johnson.

So, it looks like getting 400 carries is a considerable goal.

Maybe once a season I'd have a player or two in the 400s (usually in the 420s) but never anywhere near the 500s.

Getting 420 carries in a season would have those players breaking the All-time NFL mark for rushing attempts in a season!

Madden 06 I had quite a few players reach the mid to sometimes high 400s, but carrying numbers in the 500s were awfully rare.

And LOL @ saying carry numbers in the 500s were rare ... they should be nonexistent! (Not laughing at you directly, but the absurdity that it even exists!) To get 500 carries, a player has to AVERAGE 31.25 carries per game. If an offense that runs the same guy 25 times per game is predictable, can you imagine one that runs the same guy for 31 carries per game?

[instant000]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

Most last gen games either had too many Rushing Yards or too many carries in franchise.

Hrm, so this problem disappears on PS3 and XBOX360? If so, then what is the rant of PS3/360? It seems most of the PS3/360 players make little rants about how much better Madden was on PS2, lol. I mean, other than this stat thing, everything else is okay.

I have a distinct memory of Ronnie Brown ALWAYS getting like 2000 yards in Madden 07. I played quite a few franchises in that game, and that stat was always constant.

Yeah, there was a 2 grander or two out there, and they had like 400 carries or something, too, which just made it seem pretty unlikely, that multiple people breaking 2,000 in the same year, and multiple people getting really high in the 400 carries at the same time.

These problems are attributed to by the Sim Engine not correctly giving the second half back the ball. The HB1 was basically running enough for two players.

Agreed. These guys are running like there's no tomorrow, and NOT SHARING! lol.

[adembroski]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

Hate to say it, but it's pre-2nd patch (which completely destroyed it) Madden 2010. They were all just so bad before that, the improvements made it the best.

However, the best sim engine you can have with a Madden game is Madden 2005 PC + Gommo's Madden Editor (with Spin16s Sim Engine fix). It works on all versions after 05, but it was tuned for '05s problems.

[bdolan33]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

Hate to say it, but it's pre-2nd patch (which completely destroyed it) Madden 2010. They were all just so bad before that, the improvements made it the best.

However, the best sim engine you can have with a Madden game is Madden 2005 PC + Gommo's Madden Editor (with Spin16s Sim Engine fix). It works on all versions after 05, but it was tuned for '05s problems.

where can i find this though?

[PapaOso]

Re: [PS2] Which Version of Madden from 2002-2010 has the best sim engine? Why?

Anything 2004 or earlier. The sim engine from 2006 on had the RB1 "too many carries" issue. You can find posts here on OS about how to fix it, but it will involve controling ALL the teams in your franchise. The 2005 engine is also glitchy, but can be fixed. However it also involves controling all the teams in your franchise.