NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

[RayDog253]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

In my other post in another thread I said something like if you don't have a matchup advantage like size or quickness. I'm talking in general sense if all this are equal. But I see you get that. And durant smacking Iran's shots back really isn't a good example...

Just messing with you Ray. I'm done on this topic its not realistic and it give the defense an advantage, Arcade.

Yeah, You're right. Not a great example.

I fully understand why you don't like it.

But looking at it from their perspective, you wonder if this was the only way they could get smooth and responsive shot blocking with out the 2 man animations.

Nah.... I still don't think a gather would of affected it that much. But hey what do I know about animations and what not.

[yungflo]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

Even w/ ESPN license commentary still seems dead, perhaps even worse than last year. Gameplay seems disjointed...IDK how to describe it. Not as free flowing as I expected when I heard 'real time physics'.

And what was up w/ the non existent intensity on defense from both guys? Seemed like they were just letting each other run plays...another reason why PvP gameplay vids are always tough to judge compared to PvCPU.

Jennings was skating alot, I don't get the hand down, man down comment where john salmons was wide open for the three? this game looks impressive but still some work to be done. can't wait for the demo.

[RayDog253]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

Durant smacking shots on guys like Rudy Fernandez has nothing to do with what was just explained.

I used to always wonder how the heck MJ beat a guy to the rack when he was right under it and dunked on him even good shot blockers... Well MJ always got up first... or beat the man to his spot and bam, the one who jumps last loses
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In this game, MJ would've been blocked and sent home... Just not reality sir

Thats just an example but a clear one

That vid is the perfect example.

And the whole durant thing wasn't a response to his full post or the topic in general. I fully understand what you guys are saying and I 100% agree. For what it's worth I've never liked the jumping in past lives either. Shot blockin has been broke for the longest.

[yungflo]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

Not feeling the commentary so far.

its spot on, i think.

[jaosming]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

We've shown a lot of different footage.
A missed putback followed by a second putback, when have you seen that in previous versions of live? Never.

NBA Live 2004-08 (PC/Xbox/PS2) could and did do that, just an FYI




rEAnimator, the fact that you are still fielding questions is down right amazing, you get tons of respect from me for sticking through all this.

I understand the limitations of control & having the game look great animation wise, but is there a plan in place (like the 3 year physics plan) to improve the animations in future games? Are we still going to get the unnatural looking animations in Elite 12 or is this a key point to improve?

[rEAnimator]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

NBA Live 2004-08 (PC/Xbox/PS2) could and did do that, just an FYI




rEAnimator, the fact that you are still fielding questions is down right amazing, you get tons of respect from me for sticking through all this.

I understand the limitations of control & having the game look great animation wise, but is there a plan in place (like the 3 year physics plan) to improve the animations in future games? Are we still going to get the unnatural looking animations in Elite 12 or is this a key point to improve?

There are definitely some areas I'd like to focus on to improve the visual quality. I don't want to talk too much about this right now though. There will be plenty of time for that over the next yer.

I'm proud of what we have done this year and am very happy with the way the game plays.

I'd like the game to stand on its own as is for now, let people enjoy the game and their first experience with it without thinking about next year.

We have a 3 year plan, but this game is by no means an unfinished product.

It's great fun to play. Lets enjoy it a bit before we think about next year.

[yungflo]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

was sig animations scrapped this year?

[Jano]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

Does that make sense in a simulation of basketball ? How on earth will you ever get a shot off ? How often are step back jumper smacked like that ?

Now if that is the direction then no problem just say were making a arcade basketball game. But they came on here and said they are sticking with the sim direction. In no way shape or form is that a simulation of the fundamentals of basketball defense.

Another great post Czar everything you are saying makes perfect sense. And I agree with you they say they are making a simulation basketball game but have arcade elements in it.

But my counter to your point is both game's last year had arcade elements in them. In 2K10 the impossible closeout speeds being an obvious one. This one doesn't look nearly as bad as the no gather jumping (or sound as bad) but its being used for the same reasons.

The devs at VC obviously saw some reason to put that element in the game. It goes against there sim goals but its something they felt needed to be in the game. After testing the game and seeing what it played like without it.

I remember you even posting somewhere that one of the reasons certain issues are still in the game (in regards to 2K11) is that the devs were still trying to figure out how to effectively deal with it. While at the same time not breaking some other part of the game.

Now I don't know what effect the gathers had on this game but it created a problem the devs didn't like. Same way the closeout speeds were causing problems for the devs on 2K10.

So they add in some unrealistic elements to help the gameplay. Does it look great? No. Does it negatively effect other parts of the game? Yes. But as I'm sure you know these teams have to make decisions and do them in a short amount of time.

So they weigh the pros/cons of adding in certain elements (unrealsitic or not) and if it has more pros they implement it. And then try to work on fixing or improving it for next years game.

Honestly this whole thing just seemed odd and completely crazy to me too, at first. But when I started looking at it from the dev's perspective I can understand how they could do it.

They are trying to make the best game they can in the amount of time they have. So the unrealistic jumping just seemed like a good idea because it helped make certain parts of the game more enjoyable.

And the parts it did effect negatively might be overshadowed by the parts it had positive effects on. In that instance you brought out it looks terrible.

But I'm sure there are other instances in the game where without it the defender has to helplessly watch the offensive player score. Because the game doesn't have a mechanic that allows the player to do anything to stop it.

Even though in real life he may have an option, so if the game doesn't have sim mechanics that can cover that specific issue the devs can step in add one. It may be unrealistic but it could provide the game with a balance in that area.

So I'm not trying to excuse them for their actions but I can understand why they did it. And I'm sure all developers struggle with issues like this one from EA to 2K and even in series like COD. So the disgust I understand but I think its just one of those things that goes along with game development.

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

Really didn't notice that either until you pointed it out, I was looking at the players on the court.

This might just be a alpha demo or something, no way this is even 60% complete version. Good eye on that by the way!!!

Definitely going to wait until a demo before I make 100% decisions, and also still not liking the player models. Even in the most recent screenshots, player models are worse.

60%?!?! So you're saying the game should be in development for at least another 2 months? Oct 5 is less than 5 weeks away. Average time to shelves after submission is 6 weeks. Do the math man. No offense.

[elprez98]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

To Reanimator:

I'm going to definitely have agree with the poster above. You are doing a great job sticking with the very fickle OS community (including myself). It is small things just like this that make me truly consider buying your game.

When I know, at the very least, the developers care and are truly making an effort AND standing behind the product's worth, this means a lot to me.

Thanks sir. I look forward to trying out Elite when the demo is released.

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

OMG you are really beating us over the head the the control aspect of the game, like thats the only thing that matters. Most people like myself are attracted to the look (Graphics/Design/Animations) of the game before the control.

Would you buy a Kia for the same price as a BMW becasue the sales person said it drives like a BMW, hell no...If you were smart you would buy the BMW.

I used that example to say this. All the control in the world doesn't mean anything if it doesn't look good. Another funny example is having a ugly girlfriend becasue her sex is good.

I think WTF and Da_Czar's hangup is the effect this has on the balance of game play. Not looks.

[Dawgthem]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

Okay after going back and watching everyone's post shout to to DA Czar and all the other moderators and writers...felt pretty hyped when i saw all of them in one thread. Anyway this is what i've come to EA has a different idea of what realistic basketball is and we know true idea of what it is.

REanimator said that you adjust to your ball handler and then that antcipation key is lessened because the moment you see the ball handler start to shoot you can respond easily without frustration. To counter this that is why in the videos the shooting animations are HIGH and QUICk

Now


Dawgthem......Says..Yo i honestly think what Czar and them are talking about is the true representation of what a basketball game is..on defense skill is the deciding factor in a block along with the anticipation not just the guessing...thats why in sports video games theres a quickness factor thats why guys like MArcus camby who aren't tall as Ilgalskus..oh however you spell his name or as tall as Shaq or as tall as the foreign guy on the magics wins defensive player of the year. Because they have SKILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! blocking a shot should be 75 percent anticipation with SKILL included not just guess and getting the block i think somewhere along the lines EA lost the direction of exactly this idea and that is why it seems as if this thread has turned into a war room..............................That is all roll with me

[malgrneyes]

Please!! After changing the name, this is what it turned out to be. What's saving this game is the presentation and license. I have been a Live(Elite) fan since Genesis days so I am not a fanboy of 2k or any other bball game; just a fan of a good game. Player models are not totally accurate compared to 2k11. Gameplay looks to fast like they are on Redbull, everyone has handles like Chris Paul. Sorry this is not cutting it for me.

[xRobertitox]

I'll admit I'm a 2K fan, I've never purchased NBA Live, but let's be honest, I thought I was watching a PSP game.

I just can't look at this game without critiquing, the players look so skinny and have a cartoon-ish feel to them.

I'm not bashing, or trying to. I just wanted to check out the vid. and see what was up this year.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: NBA Elite 11 OS Exclusive Video: Milwaukee Bucks @ New York Knicks

Every sports video game ever made has arcade elements.

A game is only as sim as you play it. You can pick up any sports game and act a fool, if you want to, and see nonsense.

Honestly, the most sim basketball game I have ever played was NBA Live 10.

It punished lunatics who just wanted to barrel into the lane with the Lebrons of the world, or take crazy off the dribble jumpers.

With that said, Im disappointed in the hop step...Ive said it before, but that is going to be a mess online.

Just a hunch, but I have the feeling this game will be viewed more favorably once people get their hands on the controls...I really dont see the lack of animations Vs. last year.

The difference is that you are trigging them yourself, from what I can see.

I think the key is going to be how user friendly the control layout is going to be.

The graphics do look duller then last year, no doubt. I dont see why they couldnt have kept the same graphical sharpness, to go along with the control scheme.

Live 10 was a vibrant colorful game, but I still think the things that Live does well are still present: Spacing, body contact, play calling layout, arena sound.

The game does lack the personality and color of Live 10...thats really the biggest difference I see. I absolutely loved how NBA Live 10 sounded. It felt exactly like being in a NBA arena.

Im looking forward to trying the demo.

How accesible and intuitive I find the control scheme is going to be the make or break for me.