NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

[Fngb3]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

Well im not a fan of killing the whole game just to add more of what you already had in controls and genreally ignore other important aspects of the game. Underdeveloped isnt even the word.

...They had to start somewhere...

You can't reboot and start over with a game you've been slowly building for 15 years and just dump everything over into a new system. There's no copy/paste for this shizz (am I allowed to say things like that here??? Will happily edit it away if it's inappropriate).

Like I've said, I'm not buying the game. But I understand that, while a very difficult decision, starting over from scratch could prove to be very beneficial to them a few years from now.

[The Truth 101]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

...They had to start somewhere...

You can't reboot and start over with a game you've been slowly building for 15 years and just dump everything over into a new system. There's no copy/paste for this shizz (am I allowed to say things like that here??? Will happily edit it away if it's inappropriate).

Like I've said, I'm not buying the game. But I understand that, while a very difficult decision, starting over from scratch could prove to be very beneficial to them a few years from now.

RTP is new to b-ball games thats why we don't have all the animations from live 10 because most of them don't work with RTP.

[Zen_Master07]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

Even once you get the controls down, the learning curve is over and you are forced to look beyond that. The fact is that the game lacks depth, scrapped the one up it had on the competition and is a one-on-one game in a 5-on-5 sport. Controls don't sell games, look at 2k. Their iso-motion controls pre 2k11 never really made sense, and were hard to understand for the casual gamer. Yet, it trumped Live in sales because of its depth in other areas. Again, your control scheme was fine, you even managed to convince me that a shot stick wasn't even needed and that perhaps right stick dribbling was best based on the momentum shots (that just needed a few tweaks). Why you would decide to start over when you are neck in neck with the competition is why you are catching so much hell for the new game

[faze38]

worse bball game ever thy need to scrap this gam and come up with something new! The only reason Live 10 was even exceptable was because the head 2k designer was on the Live team for that year! 2k is were it's at

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

Starting over from scratch is a double edge sword. It can be a great hit or it can be great bust. They just better be glad they are with EA and that EA has deep pockets and can absorb the hit if this game turns out to be a flop. Being that it has NBA Jam, they should sell at least 300k unit off of that alone.

If this was a much smaller company, they would be bankrupt if they put out a miss. I have seen it happen over the years. Videogame business is like any other business. There is a risk and reward factor for every decision you make. Sometimes when you roll the dice you strike it big, other times you crap out.

Such is the life of business.

[Kaanyr Vhok]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

That video pretty much proves that once you've mastered th controls, you can do unrealistic things like it was shown in the hook shot glitch thread. Regardless of what the devs says, I have a hard time believing that the hook shot glitch could be fixed. Which will make online gaming unplayable.

Its an easy fix. There could be an issue if it cant be fixed in a DNA update. If thats the case they might have to wait for a patch. I think MS limits patches so it might have to include a whole bunch of other things in the patch and that would take at least 40 days unless they are working on an immediate patch. Those immediate patches are rare. I reckon they are seen by some as unprofessional.

[The Truth 101]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

Its an easy fix. There could be an issue if it cant be fixed in a DNA update. If thats the case they might have to wait for a patch. I think MS limits patches so it might have to include a whole bunch of other things in the patch and that would take at least 40 days unless they are working on an immediate patch. Those immediate patches are rare. I reckon they are seen by some as unprofessional.

IDK about this because the Greathouse patch for backbreaker was huge.

[Mr.Wednesday]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

IDK about this because the Greathouse patch for backbreaker was huge.

I think he meant MS limits the number of patches, not the size of the patch.

[Wiffyjustus]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

You know, I hear you and that's something that could easily be patched.

But I get the sense that that's not the thing that's going to win over everyone on OS.

I'm having a hard time figuring out what the biggest problem people have with the game is.

Why are we getting such a sky is falling, doom and gloom, worst sports game ever reaction from people, like in this round table?

The specific things people bring up seem fair and accurate, but I can't figure out why the reaction is so bad.

And I need to. It's part of my job.

I went back and played the game, and there are rough edges, but I just don't see where the extreme negativity is coming from.

I don't want to argue or debate it, I want to understand it.

That's why I asked what 5v5 dynamics were missing in response to that previous post. I can't think of any.

Ok, I will try to use a specific example. I hope it is helpful.

Control:

Elite: You need to make a right stick move just to move the bball from one hand to another.

This is one thing I believe the game should handle automatically. (ala Live 10)

e.g. I am bring the ball up with my point guard. I want to to thinking about what play I want to run, trying to read the D, not thinking "Oh hang on, I am not protecting the ball properly". This is something that any basketball player will do automatically without thinking.

I get no thrill from being able to make my player change dribble hands. However I do get an immense thrill when I read the D and make a crossover a exactly the right time to find the open lane.

A summary of my thoughts:

To me, it is all about control. Live 10 had the perfect balance. Team control (second to none if you ask me) and individual control.

Live 10 gave me the ability the run plays, read the defense and react as the play developed. I am fully aware that other games (2k and I'm sure elite as well) give you all this control. But Live 10 was intuitive. It felt good.

-Live 10 - perfect balance of player/team control
-Elite 11 - too much unnecessary player control

Where Live 10 fell short was that after a while it started to feel generic. This is where all the spit and polish come into it (new animations etc). Make it nice and shiny and I'll play it for ages.

Live 10. A fantastic engine / foundation to build upon. A year spent working on the inside game (post and rebounding) and just making it shinier (new animations etc) would have brought an amazing result.

Sadly this is not the case. I can't turn back time. What's done is done. I am just left wondering "What if?".

Sorry, I know this isn't a great help for this year. Just being honest about what I want in my imaginary ideal bball game.

[ogtae1]

NBA Elite 11 is basketball game already pre order to i love it.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

Microsoft don't limit the number of patches.

[Fngb3]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

Ok, I will try to use a specific example. I hope it is helpful.

Control:

Elite: You need to make a right stick move just to move the bball from one hand to another.

This is one thing I believe the game should handle automatically.

Applause to your for getting us back on track here.
Totally disagree with you.

What hand is dribbling the ball is the most fundamental control I want to have. I may want to turn my guy left towards the basket, without having him switch hands.

If I'm on the right wing and get passed, or level with my defender, and move the left stick up and left towards the hoop, and my defender is on my left hip, I don't want the ball in my left hand. I want it in my right. Now, this could be context sensitive, which it probably is in 2K, but I'm totally down with the responsibility of putting the ball in the safest place (in my players right hand, with his body between the defender and the ball). If I'm playing against someone too lazy to do that, they should pay. This is exactly the kind of thing I like about the controls.

[Fngb3]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

I'd like to know a bit more about your opinion on this.

You said it's built around one on one dynamics.

What 5v5 dynamics do you feel are missing?

I'm gonna try and get this thing rollin again, we really got away from it. Whose got input on this?

[dtq]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

It's not that I don't believe you. Clearly I'm just not aware of any. It would be helpful if you perhaps provided some background information on the matter...

Sufice it to say. It's new to EAs basketball franchise. And since stealing is illegal, they can't just take someone else's system.

The question wasn't directed towards me but I'd like to chime in. RTP isn't something new, it's just a buzzword used to describe the physics system they've implemented in this year's Live.

2K had been using physics for several years...they just didn't throw everything but the kitchen sink into advertising it as the next big thing.

[Fngb3]

Re: NBA Elite 11 Demo Roundtable

One of my initial, gut reactions to the 5v5 play was that it seemed it could be slowed down.
I don't mean to say I need to get used to the pace, but that everything looks very frantic.

I would also like to reference the following EA developer video:

http://nbaelite.easports.com/videos?labels=reasons#!videoId=Zra2VwMToOAic_FMCwamL5queoj_hMYR

I said before that sliding/foot planting wasn't really that important to me. I don't care if the animation is right I just care if someone changes direction when I ask them to, or starts to change direction if they're at a dead sprint and have momentum they need to fight against. However, that is a different kind of sliding than what's going on in this video.
At about 35 seconds, Bargnani meets the created player at the elbow, and both immediately begin to shift backwards like the little guard is pushing him backwards like he's not there.
That play doesn't work if Bargnani holds his ground.

At the same time the wing defender close to the camera looks as though hs is about to play some great help defense and cut off the driving guard, and between the two Raptor defenders (one of which being 7 feet tall) effectively ending this guards drive. He should have to take the ball back out to the 3PT line or pick up his dribble. An alley oop just isn't a realistic option.

To preempt any comments about it, I don't give a flip how close to the rim Okafor's head is. That's animation, I don't care.