The CPU decides the game....

[BigTone1970]

I know there have been many rants about this game, but I have spent a great amount of time playing this game on the all-star level using timing hitting in a franchise with the Angels. The bottom line is that my skill levels are not deciding the outcome of these games. Before you say that I suck or that I have no skill let me say that I work the count, I am very patient at the plate and usually draw 3-4 walks a game. I only attempt power swings when I am up in the count 2-0, 3-1. But like many have stated before me, nothing is more upsetting than seeing that you have perfect timing on a swing (it is timing after all) and you have just missed it or you have weak contact. This is a video game. Who is deciding whether or not I am successful, the CPU, not me, not you. It is very frustrating to battle and finally get the pitch that you are looking for and receive the just missed/perfect timing info. What else can I do?? I don't want a game where every one is Albert Pujols, but at the same time, I do want my skill level to have some type of effect on the game. I don't want to have to use the Red Sox or Yankees in order to win games. For those who argue that they want the VIDEO game to accurately reflect players ratings, then maybe you should play SIM baseball instead of a video game or just let the CPU simulate the games. The whole point of us playing is to be able to change the outcome of the game based on our skill level, not just to be somewhat involved in a pre-determined computer simulation. Video games should attempt to be realistic, but also be fun. There is nothing more frustrating than doing every thing right and not being rewarded. I can live with hard balls being outs because that happens in real life. I cannot live with the CPU randomly deciding if my perfect timing results in weak contact or no contact at all because then my skill does not matter. I might as well watch the CPU play itself instead of getting my hopes up that my performance will have an effect on the outcome. By the way, I am 40 years old and have been playing video games (in particular sports games) since video games were invented. I have never felt this helpless in determining whether I win or lose. When you use timing hitting and your timing is perfect, you should see results. It is hard enough to be patient at the plate and time your swings perfectly.

[rondoman]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

Your issue is using timing hitting.

Timing hitting means the CPU uses ratings and stats to determine where the PCI is. So, by using timing hitting yes, the CPU is deciding "where" you swing.

Try zone hitting. This is much more reliant on the user.

[SoxFan01605]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

When you use timing hitting and your timing is perfect, you should see results. It is hard enough to be patient at the plate and time your swings perfectly.

That's not entirely true though. You can time a pitch perfectly, but if you swing over/under a pitch you won't make good contact or flat out miss. The 3 modes of hitting aren't designed to give different results, just different user interface. In other words, things like pitch type and location, hitter ability, etc all still count even if you time it perfectly.

With timing hitting, you should have the best chance if you time perfectly, but you are also asking the AI to handle bat placement through the zone, which is dictated by ratings, the pitch, etc. So you are essentially asking the CPU to dictate more for you.

If you are using timing only or analog, since aiming is handled almost solely by ratings (up and down for analog, and virtually 100% for timing only) you have the least overall user control. If you want the most control, then you should use Zone. I've never once felt "cheated" out of my control. It's much more challenging than timing though.

[spit_bubble]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

...It is very frustrating to battle and finally get the pitch that you are looking for and receive the just missed/perfect timing info. What else can I do??

You can raise the "Human Solid Hits" slider all the way up to 10.

What that slider does is effect the alignment of the PCI (plate coverage indicator). With it raised all the way up to 10 you will have the PCI line up more often, and thus make the hitting more about your own timing... Rather than having the CPU "decide" the game.

Mind you, it's not going to make the hitting all about timing, but it will alleviate some of the frustration.

The other thing you gotta do is just accept the fact that ratings will dictate a certain percentage of the game, and proceed accordingly...

Also maybe press "Enter" every now and then when posting a message here, to prevent your thoughts and ruminations from being presented as a giant wall of text.

[BigTone1970]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

Sorry, but hitting the enter button still doesn't change what I am saying.

Anyways, I shouldn't have to change the settings of the game to get realistic results and to have some feeling of having using input affect the results of a VIDEO game. Anyone that has ever played baseball knows that hitting a baseball requires reaction, not pre-planning. Yes you can look for a ball in a certain spot, but mostly, when you have 2 strikes on you, you are swinging at strikes.

When I was successful as a baseball player, it was because I was swinging at strikes, and my hand/eye coordination automatically took over and contact was made. It was not because I looked at a certain area, it was because I had trained to swing at strikes and knew where the strike zone was. Timing hitting is the closest to this because you have to make one decision and that decision is simply to swing or not to swing. Everything else was done naturally.

With that being said, the few responders are saying that maybe I am playing the wrong mode (not using zone hitting) or to raise the PCI level. That let's me know that I am correct about my original post because I am subjecting myself to the randomness of the CPU and that my skill (or lack of) has no bearing on the outcome of a VIDEO game. I am merely a spectator. I am playing a game mode that says that timing is the only factor that I can control, yet I am not being rewarded when I am successful. Like I said in the first post, I don't mind getting out, but the ball should be hit hard somewhere, not missed/just missed/weak contact because then I am not in control of a VIDEO game. Isn't that the point of playing a VIDEO game, to be in control?

[cas850]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

all i know is i just use analog on all-star and that works for me. i feel like i have complete control and it's not random at all. don't really have any suggestions for you.

[johnpreyes]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

Sorry, but hitting the enter button still doesn't change what I am saying.

When I was successful as a baseball player, it was because I was swinging at strikes, and my hand/eye coordination automatically took over and contact was made. It was not because I looked at a certain area, it was because I had trained to swing at strikes and knew where the strike zone was. Timing hitting is the closest to this because you have to make one decision and that decision is simply to swing or not to swing. Everything else was done naturally.

Then you should also know that baseball has a lot of randomness to it. How many times have you seen a batter hit a ball hard and just line out? Maybe this game isn't for you. Just move along.

[Knight165]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

You say you have perfect timing on the ball....so even if your swing is perfect/perfect....what should happen when the pitcher throws a perfect/perfect pitch at the same time?(it's not indicated like batting, but of course it is and should happen)....
Should YOU always get the nod?
I think you have unrealistic expectations and not really unexpected game results.

M.K.
Knight165

[Pared]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

I can empathize with what he is saying. This is an argument that will forever last in sports video games - user input vs. realism.

There has always been one thing The Show does not do well and that's bypass the realism set in player ratings within the game's "system." There are plenty of times where you can be a sub-par player batting with a stud and still expect to crank one out, especially against a tired pitcher.

While this is realistic, there -ARE- people out there who would like a "realistic" baseball game where they can turn their favorite player into a stud, their horrible team into a dynasty, etc... through USER input. Better timing and "stick skills" resulting in success.

You won't find that here. Ratings keep a lot of the players in check even on the lower difficulty settings. Perhaps once they've fine tuned the balance of the game a bit further can the developers look at accessibility this way. Call me selfish, but I'd rather they keep working on the game the way they are than to spend time allowing user input to be a bigger factor in the digital results. But that's just me...

[Joey]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

Well said, Knight. Too many people who complain about this topic make no mention of the pitcher's input into the equation. The hitter isn't hitting the ball off a tee.

I also disagree with the timing statement more closely resembling real life than the others. You mention you decide to swing and your hand-eye coordination takes over telling you where to swing (in real life). That action would be closer to both analog and zone than timing, where both of them require your hand-eye coordination to tell you where to swing.

[stealyerface]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

I think that your player's hot/cold trend plays a lot into the equation as well. I have had Ortiz in a cold spell, hat the feedback on the PCI as Perfect and Superb for placement and timing, and had him ground out to second.

I have had J.D. Drew be on a hot streak, and launch balls into the gap with a much lower PCI "score" for the contact.

As in real life, sometimes the balls fall, and sometimes they are caught...

I get frustrated sometimes as well, but usually, it is my own fault.

I have also noticed something that I never realized before, and that is the PCI will change, based on the count. Using Ortiz as an example, if you are down in the count 0-2 and you decide 9for whatever reason) to use a power swing, and you miss, the PCI might show up as a tiny little circle.

Likewise, if you are up in the count 3-1 and decide to sit on a fastball (not using the Guess Pitch, just guessing on your own) and you swing and miss, the PCI is decidedly bigger than the previous example.

In my opinion, this is very well done, and really helps you try and work the count to a hitter's count, and thereby be rewarded for doing so with a bigger zone for contact.

Work the count, and hit away.

~syf

[northface28]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

I can empathize with what he is saying. This is an argument that will forever last in sports video games - user input vs. realism.

There has always been one thing The Show does not do well and that's bypass the realism set in player ratings within the game's "system." There are plenty of times where you can be a sub-par player batting with a stud and still expect to crank one out, especially against a tired pitcher.

While this is realistic, there -ARE- people out there who would like a "realistic" baseball game where they can turn their favorite player into a stud, their horrible team into a dynasty, etc... through USER input. Better timing and "stick skills" resulting in success.

You won't find that here. Ratings keep a lot of the players in check even on the lower difficulty settings. Perhaps once they've fine tuned the balance of the game a bit further can the developers look at accessibility this way. Call me selfish, but I'd rather they keep working on the game the way they are than to spend time allowing user input to be a bigger factor in the digital results. But that's just me...

This, I want ratings to play a large role, not "stick skills". Otherwise, the game will turn into Madden with 50 OVR rated players with high speed playing like Hall of Famers.

[HustlinOwl]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

Tons of threads on this

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...itting-14.html

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...vs-timing.html

Man there is a ton of miss information in this thread let me try and clear this up.


Timing option- It's pretty basic we took rookie and veteran hitting from last year and broke it out completely to its own mechanic. In timing hitting only your timing is used everything is is calculated based on player ratings. PCI is still there it drives the entire hitting engine. So player A has a 85 contact/72 power rating this stays the same no matter what you do. Unless you use contact or power swing that is.

This option is very timing centric with a very very heavy weight on the batters attributes. Power, Contact, Plate Vision, and Plate Discipline.

Its the easiest option to bat this year.


Zone PCI option- This mechanic is a two step process its timing centric based on your input when you swing. However unlike the timing only option you must control the players PCI its not calculated for you. You do this by moving the L analog stick (PCI) over the ball. Don't move it to the ball and you won't make solid contact. Contact and Power ratings are still the driving force as the Contact and Plate Vision ratings drives the size of the players PCI. Your Contact/Power ratings do not change unless you use the other swing types. Just like timing you can select contact, power, and regular swing.

Pure Analog option- This option is a uses the R analog stick and is very timing and swing spot centric. You must rock the R analog stick back to stride and rock it forward to swing. Your stride timing will cause the PCI to shrink and grow. The last part of the mechanic is you need to swing Right, Left, and Center. To closer you are to swinging at the pitch the better your contact bonus. In this mode Plate Discipline, Plate Vision and your swing timing determines the PCI high and low. It's all rooted in baseball logic.

In this option a players contact and power ratings will go up and down depending upon your stride timing and contact timing.

Now one possible issue we are looking at is the PCI placement in swing analysis maybe a little jumpy. Also I just found out today we shot the Analog hitting tutorial very very early before we changed the mechanic to where you have to swing at the pitch Left, Right, and Center.

[chrishthomas]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

. . .

When I was successful as a baseball player, it was because I was swinging at strikes, and my hand/eye coordination automatically took over and contact was made. It was not because I looked at a certain area, it was because I had trained to swing at strikes and knew where the strike zone was. Timing hitting is the closest to this because you have to make one decision and that decision is simply to swing or not to swing. Everything else was done naturally.

. . .

This is the part of your post that really bothers me. And, believe me I've been around a lot of baseball - my dad played semi-pro, and two family members (dad's cousins) played MLB - and I played my share of baseball, up to college when I broke my back in a car accident.

So, you mean to tell me that every time you happened to time your swing correctly, that you also managed to get your bat through the zone at the exact place the ball was coming over the plate? Please tell me that's not what you are implying.

The best players in baseball often foul balls off even when they have perfect timing simply because the bat was just under or over the path of the ball, and by over/under I mean fractions of an inch, it doesn't even have to be that far off...we're talking about hitting a small, round ball with a narrow, cylindrical object, unless you make really good contact, then there is a high probability that the ball is going to glance off the bat weakly in some odd direction.

It happens, even when you time the swing correctly, and even when you read the pitch--curve balls break unpredictably, the magnitude of movement on a slider varies from pitch to pitch, and even fastballs have some movement to them--the bat isn't always going to be at the right spot.

In this game, that is accounted for by contact ratings. Some players are better than others at having their bats meet the area where the ball is traveling on a more frequent basis, others have more difficulty with this, and thus are more prone to fouling or even completely missing on well timed swings. Also, within this game (as in real life), pitchers have "effectiveness" ratings...just because two pitchers have identical speed on their fastball, doesn't mean that hitting them is equally easy/difficult. Some pitchers throw balls that are more deceptive, that have late movement on them, or just otherwise give batters headaches.

It's baseball, and that's just one more of the things that makes it a grand and glorious game.

[treyraq]

Re: The CPU decides the game....

BigTone,

I feel for you; I was so frustrated with trying to hit in this game when I got it in '09, that I've been primarily hooked on Manager Mode ever since. Personally I wish the hitting aspect was ...funner?

Anyway, are you sure you're understanding the modes? TIMING mode is the easiest to use, but it yields results based off of the real players' skills/stats.
So, regardless of YOUR perfection in pressing the button, Carlos Pena is still barely going to hit .200 (for example).