This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

[jpdavis82]

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[Only1LT]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

Don't have speakers at work. Any chance that you or someone else could provide a synopsis of his point of view?

[falconfansince81]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

i agree with him for the most part, but i still think 2k can be used as a great reference point in certain aspects where madden is still lacking such as head tracking, DB technique, AI awareness, presentation, acceleration and procedural awareness.

while the series is done, been done, and not coming back anytime soon...there is still a lot ea can look to that proves it HAS been done correctly and what areas they can refer to in building madden to be a more realistic playing game.

[jpdavis82]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

i agree with him for the most part, but i still think 2k can be used as a great reference point in certain aspects where madden is still lacking such as head tracking, DB technique, AI awareness, presentation, acceleration and procedural awareness.

while the series is done, been done, and not coming back anytime soon...there is still a lot ea can look to that proves it HAS been done correctly and what areas they can refer to in building madden to be a more realistic playing game.

IMO I have to disagree that it has been done correctly, I feel like Madden 12 is going to be the closest to it though. I think with Cam Weber as the GM starting in Madden 13, they will get there though.

[Giants4Natic]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

i agree with him for the most part, but i still think 2k can be used as a great reference point in certain aspects where madden is still lacking such as head tracking, DB technique, AI awareness, presentation, acceleration and procedural awareness.

while the series is done, been done, and not coming back anytime soon...there is still a lot ea can look to that proves it HAS been done correctly and what areas they can refer to in building madden to be a more realistic playing game.

That was not his point. As much as people want to put 2K as the holy grail of sim, It is farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr from sim and has horrendous aspects that can make you pull your hair out.

He is stating that it is a video game and not all will be 100% sim

I love 2K but it also had things that madden does better. That is fact

[DeuceDouglas]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

For ONLY1LT:

-Madden is just a game.
-We will never get a sim football game because in order to get a sim game you would have to eliminate user controller because the user has 'god cam' where you can see everything.
-EA Sports will renew license and be the only football game and they're not monopolizing the game.
-If you don't like the game don't buy it. Play 2k and update the rosters every year and be happy with what your playing on your PS2. While smart people play madden on the 360 with updated graphics, current NFL, current announcers etc. while you spend hours upon hours updating rosters.
-Put 2k to rest. Let 2k die.
-He doesn't live in fantasy land.
-2K could make a game that is an nfl game without it being an nfl game but they don't so blame them for not coming out with a product and you can't blame ea and nitpick at music.
-2K horse is dead.
-2K fanboys talk as if 2K5 is the best football game ever and that it's a fact.
-Madden 07 was better than 2K5 and 2K5 wasn't even good.
-Running style in 2K look ********.
-They won't cancel a madden to implement physics this gen unless sales drop big time.
-2K5 is not the standard. The standard is real football and that will never be reached. 2K5 is not the end all be all of football games.

[Gosens6]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

He could have stopped recording at 1:10 and I would have agreed with everything he said. Madden is just a game, people act like they're entitled to everything they see on Sundays down to an exact 100% science.

That didn't happen with NFL 2K5, it didn't happen before it, and it won't happen. I believe Madden 12 is going to be the most realistic Madden to date, which is why i'm buying it for the first time since Madden 07 on PS2. Where your game is downright bad, then people have the right to complain, but i'm seeing people complain about the Madden 12 demo saying it's horrible and this and that. IMO the Madden 12 demo is better than any Madden since we got to the next gen consoles.

For the people that expect too much the only satisfaction they're going to get is if they strap up pads and go play in the NFL themselves.

[Big FN Deal]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

I totally disagree with the view point expressed in that video but he is certainly entitled to his opinion. I admittedly did not watch the whole video but the suggestion that people who don't like the game should only not buy it, is not productive, imo.

If every time someone felt a product was not up to par, they just didn't buy it and kept their mouth shut, products would seldom improve and many consumers that want to view the product opinions of others, would be making "blind" purchases.

It makes far more sense, imo, for people that enjoy the game to just ignore the complaints of those who don't. I don't see people trying to convince those that like Madden to not express it, so the reverse should apply too.

Any youtube video and forum post is optional viewing, that anyone can simply ignore. I am sure their are countless videos and negative opinions of many games I personally find enjoyable and I could care less.

I would like to see someone make a youtube video about people being more independently minded and not being so influenced by the actions of others that don't directly affect them.

DO YOU!

[Giants4Natic]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

I totally disagree with the view point expressed in that video but he is certainly entitled to his opinion. I admittedly did not watch the whole video but the suggestion that people who don't like the game should only not buy it, is not productive, imo.

If every time someone felt a product was not up to par, they just didn't buy it and kept their mouth shut, products would seldom improve and many consumers that want to view the product opinions of others, would be making "blind" purchases.

It makes far more sense, imo, for people that enjoy the game to just ignore the complaints of those who don't. I don't see people trying to convince those that like Madden to not express it, so the reverse should apply too.

Any youtube video and forum post is optional viewing, that anyone can simply ignore. I am sure their are countless videos and negative opinions of many games I personally find enjoyable and I could care less.

I would like to see someone make a youtube video about people being more independently minded and not being so influenced by the actions of others that don't directly affect them.

DO YOU!

If you think somebody busting on the game is going to make the game better in the future then you are delusional.

The only thing that matters is not purchasing the game.

If you root for a team and hate what the GM does and never improves the team but you continue to go to the games and the games sell out or are close to selling out all the time even though you and your other fans bust on the GM and the teams players all the time.

That is not going to do anything because the owners are still making money

But you and your other fans stop going to games and buying tickets and see how quickly things change.

I laugh when people say, we must say something

EA is not improving madden because of people moaning about it, they take huge steps if they see their sales drop. They have seen a slight decrease and have to take action.

But bitching and moaning about a game is only going to matter when the customer does their talking with their wallets

[wallofhate]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

He had some good points and I agree with him for the most part. What people need to understand is the guys tryin to tell the people to shut up about complaining about madden are just as annoying as the guys going out of their way to bash it! It almost becomes a arguement against each other in general instead of it just being about the game itself.
I just say if you want them to "shut up" or "go away" then ignore the videos made and posts! Let them be a tree falling in the woods with noone around lol

[jpdavis82]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

For ONLY1LT:

-Madden is just a game.
-We will never get a sim football game because in order to get a sim game you would have to eliminate user controller because the user has 'god cam' where you can see everything.
-EA Sports will renew license and be the only football game and they're not monopolizing the game.
-If you don't like the game don't buy it. Play 2k and update the rosters every year and be happy with what your playing on your PS2. While smart people play madden on the 360 with updated graphics, current NFL, current announcers etc. while you spend hours upon hours updating rosters.
-Put 2k to rest. Let 2k die.
-He doesn't live in fantasy land.
-2K could make a game that is an nfl game without it being an nfl game but they don't so blame them for not coming out with a product and you can't blame ea and nitpick at music.
-2K horse is dead.
-2K fanboys talk as if 2K5 is the best football game ever and that it's a fact.
-Madden 07 was better than 2K5 and 2K5 wasn't even good.
-Running style in 2K look ********.
-They won't cancel a madden to implement physics this gen unless sales drop big time.
-2K5 is not the standard. The standard is real football and that will never be reached. 2K5 is not the end all be all of football games.

Before he talks about the 2k horse being dead he says, people are already bashing Madden 12 and it's not even out yet. How can you judge a game you haven't even played yet. He also talks about how 2k has money plays and gimmicks and repetitive animations, but no one wants to talk about that, but they're real quick to point out the flaws in Madden.

[Only1LT]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

For ONLY1LT:

-Madden is just a game.
-We will never get a sim football game because in order to get a sim game you would have to eliminate user controller because the user has 'god cam' where you can see everything.
-EA Sports will renew license and be the only football game and they're not monopolizing the game.
-If you don't like the game don't buy it. Play 2k and update the rosters every year and be happy with what your playing on your PS2. While smart people play madden on the 360 with updated graphics, current NFL, current announcers etc. while you spend hours upon hours updating rosters.
-Put 2k to rest. Let 2k die.
-He doesn't live in fantasy land.
-2K could make a game that is an nfl game without it being an nfl game but they don't so blame them for not coming out with a product and you can't blame ea and nitpick at music.
-2K horse is dead.
-2K fanboys talk as if 2K5 is the best football game ever and that it's a fact.
-Madden 07 was better than 2K5 and 2K5 wasn't even good.
-Running style in 2K look ********.
-They won't cancel a madden to implement physics this gen unless sales drop big time.
-2K5 is not the standard. The standard is real football and that will never be reached. 2K5 is not the end all be all of football games.

Thank you very much for sparing me from having to listen to that tripe.

[KCsFinest5]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

Don't have speakers at work. Any chance that you or someone else could provide a synopsis of his point of view?

Quick Summary

HIS POINT

-There will never be a sim football game because of user control and the ability of the user to play the game and see parts of the field that are normally unseen to NFL players.
-He can't be mad at EA Sports for "running a business"; it's foolish to think that Madden is a monopoly because football gaming is not an industry by itself
-Other football game devs will never get the NFL license back
-However other football game devs can make a game that is 100% user content and can include the ability to create NFL teams
-You can't bash Madden 12 if you have not played it
-Madden games are unfairly compared to previous football games
-Just because people perceive Madden as inferior to previous games (from other devs) doesn't make Madden a bad game
-Don't buy the game if you don't like it
-People bash Madden because they aren't good at the game (he said he is beginning to believe this)
-Madden will not incorporate physics into this gen.
-Madden is just a game (some glitches are unavoidable)
-The standard of video game football will never be reached
-Perception of Madden is largely based on opinion



I agree with a lot of what he said. The guy is a realist and won't let people tell him whether or not he can enjoy Madden 12.

[spankdatazz22]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

I don't know why people constantly make the situation about NFL2K5 when it's more about Madden imo. 2K5 was 7yrs and a console generation ago - of course Madden should be better; technically it should've been better with Madden '06. Imo this is more about where football gaming has been/is at this point.

If you look in other forums on the board, you don't often see the question come up "Do you think [soccer, basketball, hockey, baseball, etc.] gaming is where it should be?". If it ever comes up in other forums at all. That's not 2K5's fault that perception exists, it's Tiburon's. Tiburon should've long ago made 2K5, APF, Backbreaker, old NCAAs and old Maddens irrelevant. Acting as if 2K5 had some huge fanbase from 2004 that never let go that "their" game is no longer available is silly imo. I love 2K5 as much as anyone, but I brought both Madden and 2K back in the day. And I'd guess given 2K5 was only $20 many of the people that purchased it likely purchased Madden too.

Too often some people here want to debate the messenger instead of debating the message.

[roadman]

Re: This man speaks the truth about people's expectations of football games

Thank you very much for sparing me from having to listen to that tripe.

It's ok LT, I don't watch anything positive or negative with Madden on Youtube.