Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

[seanjeezy]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

Well if you don't think those guys should be A's why should anyone else.

LOL. These kinds of posts kill me.

Because they're not. Making them A's puts them on the same level as Harper, Trout, Montero, Profar, etc. If you give a player an A potential in this game they are 100% guaranteed to reach it. Not a single one of the Padres prospects scream All-Star to me, yes there is a good chance they become productive major leaguers, but the chance that they all become all-stars? no way in hell (sorry Rage); There's a reason why none of these guys crack the top 40 in anyone's list. like I said earlier, giving them a B+ allows for potential growth and also a chance to regress, which allows for a more true to life scenario.

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

Why are you so high on Austin Hedges Rage, and for that matter Ross and Sampson too? The only guy on the Padres I can justify giving an A to right now is Liriano, and I'm a little hesitant to do that as well. B+'s would have been perfect for all of these guys, because it allows for the opportunity to progress into an A or regress to a C+, giving them A's practically guarantees their success.

I already explained this in the Padres OSFM. There was plenty of time to discuss this.

I'll say this, if those players are not even A-'s... then not only will have to scale all the Padres prospects back, but everyone else, including guys like Javier Baez, Starling Marte, James Paxton, Danny Hultzen, etc.

And for the record, none of those prospects you listed will be stars or MVPs. All A's are not the same (and my version of Rymer Liriano was at the same potential rating as Austin Hedges, but ARoid's version made it in and Liriano has a higher ceiling). And all those players are many years away and have ample time to screw up their potential or raise it even higher, unless you think waiting at least seven years is guaranteeing a player's success.

[padsfan92]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

I'm a Padres fan and if the have one of the top farm systems in MLB, then the sport is in trouble. These kids look good on paper, but it's another story when they come to the show with nothing around them to make the transition easier. Alonso is overmatched at the moment without any protection in the lineup. The same will be said for the others when they come up.

I feel like you're underestimating the Padres farm system. They don't really have a true future superstar, sure fire Bryce Harper type of player in their farm system, but the Padres have a plethora of guys in their system that can be solid Major league players and with the potential to be great.

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

Because they're not. Making them A's puts them on the same level as Harper, Trout, Montero, Profar, etc. If you give a player an A potential in this game they are 100% guaranteed to reach it. Not a single one of the Padres prospects scream All-Star to me, yes there is a good chance they become productive major leaguers, but the chance that they all become all-stars? no way in hell (sorry Rage); There's a reason why none of these guys crack the top 40 in anyone's list. like I said earlier, giving them a B+ allows for potential growth and also a chance to regress, which allows for a more true to life scenario.

Please tell. For Trout and Montero, there's is already locked and the potentials of the other players were at the whims of other creators.

None of them scream All-Star at the moment, yet what I've read from Austin Hedges is that his offense was questionable going into the draft so that's why I did my due diligence with the two teams I worked with and worked from top to bottom in potential. Don't believe me? You can move the prospects from the Padres to the D'Backs and vice-versa, and see that none of the Padres prospects have the ceiling of Tyler Skaggs or Archie Bradley (again, I mentioned this earlier that Trevor Bauer took a hit in his potential because it's ARoid's version, in my list he was higher than the other two pitchers). You'll have to exclude Rymer Liriano because I did not rate him.

Again, you are ignoring the fact that the A potential range has a wide range. Missing descriptions aside, not all A's are equal or you'd think Cameron Maybin has the same ceiling as Matt Kemp.

[padsfan92]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

It's a nice looking park but it's not nice when you're hitting.. it is the definition of a pitcher's park lol

I didn't realize that a pitchers park automatically meant that it was a poor stadium. Petco is a beautiful park, have you ever been to it?

[bkrich83]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

Because they're not. Making them A's puts them on the same level as Harper, Trout, Montero, Profar, etc. If you give a player an A potential in this game they are 100% guaranteed to reach it. Not a single one of the Padres prospects scream All-Star to me, yes there is a good chance they become productive major leaguers, but the chance that they all become all-stars? no way in hell (sorry Rage); There's a reason why none of these guys crack the top 40 in anyone's list. like I said earlier, giving them a B+ allows for potential growth and also a chance to regress, which allows for a more true to life scenario.

They're not, says you. You can't predict the future of how these guys will develop any better than the rest of us.

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

Mat Latos also has no bearing on these rosters and other potential decisions, but he too was heavily considered a B under both Knight and Ridin when we had no roster vault. I vouched for an A, but it was shot down in favor of guys like Brett Cecil, Trevor Cahill, and so on years before.

These potentials are based on their outlook this year. They can disappoint and drop like Jaff Decker and Casey Kelly, but neither player has done anything to warrant such a potential, especially after I've read some pretty good outlooks for them (especially Austin Hedges). Sampson is very underrated in my opinion and he might not be at the same level as a Gerrit Cole or Archie Bradley.

Add-On:

Even with those four players being A's, the player of the franchise would have to wait a long time to reap the benefits, and even if you keep Alonso and Maybin, that's only 6 A's for the organization... which is in-line with the average team if you divided all the A's in the game equally among the 30 teams, but it's nowhere near teams like Toronto, Kansas City, and power houses that are stacked with A's.

It seems to me you're trying to make me look like I gave the Padres the same treatment as what was given to the Brewers in the initial roster set. You're treading a very fine line.

[seanjeezy]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

These potentials are based on their outlook this year. They can disappoint and drop like Jaff Decker and Casey Kelly, but neither player has done anything to warrant such a potential, especially after I've read some pretty good outlooks for them (especially Austin Hedges). Sampson is very underrated in my opinion and he might not be at the same level as a Gerrit Cole or Archie Bradley.

Add-On:

Even with those four players being A's, the player of the franchise would have to wait a long time to reap the benefits, and even if you keep Alonso and Maybin, that's only 6 A's for the organization... which is in-line with the average team if you divided all the A's in the game equally among the 30 teams, but it's nowhere near teams like Toronto, Kansas City, and power houses that are stacked with A's.

It seems to me you're trying to make me look like I gave the Padres the same treatment as what was given to the Brewers in the initial roster set. You're treading a very fine line.

This is where you're losing me. If the potential ratings are reflective of this year, why are you still giving them A's? An A for an 18 year old kid who had only pitched who pitched one inning in rookie ball and has been lit up in 2 of his first 3 starts in A ball, an A for a 21 year old who struggled in his callup to A+ last year, and is now striking out in 39% of his at-bats this year, and a justifiable A for Sampson. For the record, I think whoever did KC vastly overrated them this year, but Toronto makes sense. Star power isn't the only determining factor on who has the best system, just look at the Nationals - two studs who are near major league ready, but overall their middle of the pack.

I'm not sure why you think a B+ is a bad thing, when a C grade means a player has a decent shot of at least playing in the major leagues. Are you not happy that the Padres have a tremendous amount of depth and no studs? Because if I had a choice between picking any of the 30 teams, the only team I would pick above the Padres is the Blue Jays, only because I think they have more high upside players.

Side note:

I simmed til 2016, and every single year the Padres' AAA and AA teams made the playoffs while the big club made it in 2013, 2014, and 2016.

By 2015, Keyvius Sampson was their second best pitcher, Joe Ross the 6th. Rymer Liriano was the starting RF by age 24.

[zephyr13]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

Top five farm system, bottom five stadium lol

You just lost all credibility with this statement. It's evident that you've never set foot in PETCO Park...

[BatsareBugs]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

This is where you're losing me. If the potential ratings are reflective of this year, why are you still giving them A's? An A for an 18 year old kid who had only pitched who pitched one inning in rookie ball and has been lit up in 2 of his first 3 starts in A ball, an A for a 21 year old who struggled in his callup to A+ last year, and is now striking out in 39% of his at-bats this year, and a justifiable A for Sampson. For the record, I think whoever did KC vastly overrated them this year, but Toronto makes sense. Star power isn't the only determining factor on who has the best system, just look at the Nationals - two studs who are near major league ready, but overall their middle of the pack.

You're clearly misunderstanding me. By "this year" I mean going into this year. How the hell can I foresee several prospects struggling and starting off cold as the basis for potential ratings? Don't you see the flaw in your own logic.

And again you are still treating all A's equal. I've been looking into all these potential grades, where they fall, and what descriptions they had and such for years now, so stop it.

I'm not sure why you think a B+ is a bad thing, when a C grade means a player has a decent shot of at least playing in the major leagues. Are you not happy that the Padres have a tremendous amount of depth and no studs? Because if I had a choice between picking any of the 30 teams, the only team I would pick above the Padres is the Blue Jays, only because I think they have more high upside players.

You're barking up the wrong tree. I never said that and I've been a big proponent in pushing the idea that C player's are average starting players towards people who think C's aren't worth your time. You're really trying to put words in my mouth to the point that I believe you're just trolling, or at least it's a little interesting that not once have you brought this up during the time for when we were all working this, but once this article came out for the OS front page. At the very least it feels like you're trying to discredit all the work I put in these rosters, so perhaps maybe YOU should take care of the Padres next year, or at the very least make the adjustments on your own roster.

Side note:

I simmed til 2016, and every single year the Padres' AAA and AA teams made the playoffs while the big club made it in 2013, 2014, and 2016.

By 2015, Keyvius Sampson was their second best pitcher, Joe Ross the 6th. Rymer Liriano was the starting RF by age 24.

In AA, up to 12 baseball clubs can make playoffs, in Triple-A it's 8. The sim engine is not perfect hence it loses all credibility when you point out that the big league club made the playoffs in 3 times.

The Padres have weak rotation, if all things stay equal, I'm not surprised that a guy currently in AA is their second-best pitcher, unless you really think he's only marginally better than Robbie Erlin. What is Sampson's overall by 2015? I bet you it's at most a B-. Rymer Liriano is probably a B- as well (and it's not like Will Venable is anything special).

I'm sorry, this is beginning to irritate me. Perhaps I'll never volunteer to work on the OSFM rosters again since you are completely bothered by something that I left open to everyone way before I started working on this team. Of course you're the go-to source for all this stuff, I should've known to seek your wisdom and have gotten your permission before doing this rather than trying to pull things from various reputable sources and working from them.

Edit: You contributed a little in the top prospect thread, although you only said that you see no superstars. Again, none of the four players are given superstar potential... you keep questioning and I keep saying the same thing over and over, it's an endless circle. Superstar potential IMO is anything from a Mid-A to a Max-A. No Padre prospect has a mid-A in their potential.

You had from February 12 to say whatever you wanted to in the Padres OSFM thread. Don't tell me you never saw it because you took the time to give some input in my Diamondbacks OSFM thread which has been around at the same time.

[seanjeezy]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

You're clearly misunderstanding me. By "this year" I mean going into this year. How the hell can I foresee several prospects struggling and starting off cold as the basis for potential ratings? Don't you see the flaw in your own logic.

And again you are still treating all A's equal. I've been looking into all these potential grades, where they fall, and what descriptions they had and such for years now, so stop it.

You're barking up the wrong tree. I never said that and I've been a big proponent in pushing the idea that C player's are average starting players towards people who think C's aren't worth your time. You're really trying to put words in my mouth to the point that I believe you're just trolling, or at least it's a little interesting that not once have you brought this up during the time for when we were all working this, but once this article came out for the OS front page. At the very least it feels like you're trying to discredit all the work I put in these rosters, so perhaps maybe YOU should take care of the Padres next year, or at the very least make the adjustments on your own roster.

In AA, up to 12 baseball clubs can make playoffs, in Triple-A it's 8. The sim engine is not perfect hence it loses all credibility when you point out that the big league club made the playoffs in 3 times.

The Padres have weak rotation, if all things stay equal, I'm not surprised that a guy currently in AA is their second-best pitcher, unless you really think he's only marginally better than Robbie Erlin. What is Sampson's overall by 2015? I bet you it's at most a B-. Rymer Liriano is probably a B- as well (and it's not like Will Venable is anything special).

I'm sorry, this is beginning to irritate me. Perhaps I'll never volunteer to work on the OSFM rosters again since you are completely bothered by something that I left open to everyone way before I started working on this team. Of course you're the go-to source for all this stuff, I should've known to seek your wisdom and have gotten your permission before doing this rather than trying to pull things from various reputable sources and working from them.

Edit: You contributed a little in the top prospect thread, although you only said that you see no superstars. Again, none of the four players are given superstar potential... you keep questioning and I keep saying the same thing over and over, it's an endless circle. Superstar potential IMO is anything from a Mid-A to a Max-A. No Padre prospect has a mid-A in their potential.

You had from February 12 to say whatever you wanted to in the Padres OSFM thread. Don't tell me you never saw it because you took the time to give some input in my Diamondbacks OSFM thread which has been around at the same time.

Wow did this get out of hand quickly

If you felt like I was personally attacking you or your work, I apologize, it wasn't my intention. I guess we're not allowed to have different opinions, I ask you a question, a different user jumps on me for asking it, calls my post a joke, I ask you another question, same response...

Anyway, I just think that there needs to be an overseer for this whole potential thing, or a revamp of the system completely, because the way the system is right now, A's (and A-) should be something reserved for truly special players. If prospects had more volatility, or the system worked like Knight's 10A, 9B, 8C system, I wouldn't have a single problem with dishing out this many A's. Trust me, I've simmed multiple years with various teams; I've had John Hicks, Brad Miller, Jack Marder (All C's) progress 4-5 points every year, and I've had Paxton, Pimentel, and Castillo (all B's) progress 0-1 each year.

Again, sorry if you mistook this for a personal attack (I've never been called a troll before lol), but I just think its unfair to make what is already a deep, talented system head and shoulders above the rest, especially for those of us who went the conservative route with our organizations. I'll just end by saying agree to disagree, and I won't bring it up again.

[sink4ever]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

Okay . . . maybe everyone take a step back. This is a wonderful community effort involving a lot of people who are passionate about their work. These rosters should be fun to make and are enjoyed by many, so let's not kill ourselves over the difference between a high B and a low A (especially when potential in this game can be such a nebulous concept). I love that everyone cares so much about making this as accurate as possible, but let's not forget that this is all supposed to be fun in the end.

Edit: Sorry, not trying to sound like a mod or anything. I just really enjoy these rosters and I'm interested to hear people's actual experiences with the Padres.

[pistolpete]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

I have a Yonder Alonso question. He is a 4-star potential on the other game and he cannot hit for anything against LHP. Is this accurate for real life?

Cam Maybin is also a 4-star potential (out of 5) is he a sure fire future star? If so, I'll bump him up.

[hawks223]

I have a Yonder Alonso question. He is a 4-star potential on the other game and he cannot hit for anything against LHP. Is this accurate for real life?

Cam Maybin is also a 4-star potential (out of 5) is he a sure fire future star? If so, I'll bump him up.

Maybin was a top 10 prospect in all of baseball for about 5 straight years.

[BaylorBearBryant]

Re: Top Five Farm Systems in MLB 12: The Show: #3 San Diego Padres

I tear it up with Maybin. He's fun to play with in The Show.