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Hey road,
Yes I saw it. I liked the tackling there. It looks pretty good. I knew there was going to be a change to the collision system. However, the first thing I noticed was the ball carrier who was swerving and zig zagging just like before. Immediately turned me off. I strictly play online and that nonsense ruins the game completely. It tells me they still have it in their minds that they want to create a "fun" arcade game. Breaking 80 yard runs every other play and zig zagging or swerving through the defense is not my idea of realism. So great, we have nice improved collision detection, too bad you can cut at a 90 degree angle with the ball in your hand - amongst other things. Improvements are fine, but they are not enough improvements. The gameplay team was doubled and there is the supposed push for realism. Yet the most basic piece of that in player running is completely absent. That's really sad, especially when games like FIFA actually have it.
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
i missed the presentation bit and got most of the gameplay stream. however did i miss the super lbs being fixed bit? i saw the psychic dbs being read and react but did i miss lb?Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
Yeah, I agree.Hey road,
Yes I saw it. I liked the tackling there. It looks pretty good. I knew there was going to be a change to the collision system. However, the first thing I noticed was the ball carrier who was swerving and zig zagging just like before. Immediately turned me off. I strictly play online and that nonsense ruins the game completely. It tells me they still have it in their minds that they want to create a "fun" arcade game. Breaking 80 yard runs every other play and zig zagging or swerving through the defense is not my idea of realism. So great, we have nice improved collision detection, too bad you can cut at a 90 degree angle with the ball in your hand - amongst other things. Improvements are fine, but they are not enough improvements. The gameplay team was doubled and there is the supposed push for realism. Yet the most basic piece of that in player running is completely absent. That's really sad, especially when games like FIFA actually have it.
Even the video guy said something about the zig zagging and the foot planting.
The tackling part is somewhat encouraging.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
Looking really good so far. But, was there any mention on penalties (or lack thereof)?
One or two pass interference calls within a season doesn't cut it...Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
I have a feeling the play action cancel will be the new cheese move....the defenders will bite and will have supreme blocking to hit open man deep.
What they need to add with that is possiblity of collision with RB and QB and fumbles.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
Well for what it's worth, one of the NCAA 13 CD attendees or a Game Changer said they are expecting the movement to be toned down to NCAA 11 levels, which I think may be on par to M10's.Hey road,
Yes I saw it. I liked the tackling there. It looks pretty good. I knew there was going to be a change to the collision system. However, the first thing I noticed was the ball carrier who was swerving and zig zagging just like before. Immediately turned me off. I strictly play online and that nonsense ruins the game completely. It tells me they still have it in their minds that they want to create a "fun" arcade game. Breaking 80 yard runs every other play and zig zagging or swerving through the defense is not my idea of realism. So great, we have nice improved collision detection, too bad you can cut at a 90 degree angle with the ball in your hand - amongst other things. Improvements are fine, but they are not enough improvements. The gameplay team was doubled and there is the supposed push for realism. Yet the most basic piece of that in player running is completely absent. That's really sad, especially when games like FIFA actually have it.
Question asked by Bryan and answered by ShaunMason EA Game Changer
So did they just kind of tighten up the player movement so its not so herky jerky? Or how would you best describe the change?
The ability to change direction was tuned, so you can't turn really, really hard like you used to. I'm hoping they tune it more based on velocity, because I felt like I was sticking to the lineman trying to get around them at times
Question asked by Gotmadskillzson ans answered by David EA Game Changer
8. Did they improve or tune locomotion at all this year ? Last year players turned on a dime, changed directions on a dime with no slow down what so ever.
Yeah I think so, like Shaun said the Runningbacks have been tuned so you cannot just swerve at full speed all over the field. And like with DB's they cannot just flawlessly cut with a WR on a dime with a route they do not know what's coming. And with the new and improved receiver animations you just see alot more fluent and realistic body and post catch movements with the ball.
I would point out though do not expect some major overhaul with the locomotion of players in the game.
I don't expect an overhaul of course but hopefully it will remove the need for banning the left stick to insure realistic movement when in the open field.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
With no improvement to the line interaction and no changes to the ridiculous left stick cutting/zig zagging, none of this really is all that impressive. I mean, it SOUNDS good, but it always sounds good. Sorry to be a negative nancy, but this just doesn't get me excited about purchasing the game. As soon as I read the whole bit on "user catching is more user friendly", I got a little ill. I'm all for user control, but now we are going to make it easier??? It is already too easy for guys to make stupid catches in triple coverage, now we are going to make it easier? It doesn't need to be easier, it needs to be more realistic. A fight for the ball like in real life resulting in incompletions instead of one handed leaping picks, over the shoulder interceptions or leaping catches in quadruple coverage. Like I said a few months ago, business as usual at Tiburon. Great they are adding these things, but why no fixes to the player movement and the line interaction? Put some developers full time on that. The gameplay team was "doubled", right?
I know cats probably think that Taz is being a Debbie Downer, but I agree with everything he said here. I am not at all ignoring the fixes that WERE made in Madden 13, but the unrealistic zig-zag cutting and the ineffective 4-3 Defensive Ends are two major game killers for me, and from what I have seen/heard so far, I just doubt that either one is going to be addressed properly in Madden 13, making it a must NOT buy for me. Again, I will wait for the demo to drop before making my final judgement, but I am just personally not that encouraged from a gameplay perspective at this standpoint. Madden 13 still seems to be lacking too many important gameplay elements for me to stick with it for longer than a few weeks, maybe a month at best.Hey road,
Yes I saw it. I liked the tackling there. It looks pretty good. I knew there was going to be a change to the collision system. However, the first thing I noticed was the ball carrier who was swerving and zig zagging just like before. Immediately turned me off. I strictly play online and that nonsense ruins the game completely. It tells me they still have it in their minds that they want to create a "fun" arcade game. Breaking 80 yard runs every other play and zig zagging or swerving through the defense is not my idea of realism. So great, we have nice improved collision detection, too bad you can cut at a 90 degree angle with the ball in your hand - amongst other things. Improvements are fine, but they are not enough improvements. The gameplay team was doubled and there is the supposed push for realism. Yet the most basic piece of that in player running is completely absent. That's really sad, especially when games like FIFA actually have it.Last edited by Illustrator76; 04-26-2012, 01:30 PM.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
I can't find the thread, but someone posted a video showing how a previous version of Madden was supposed to eliminate psychic dbs.
I don't hate on those who are skeptical about Madden 13. I suspect by their criticisms we don't disagree on much, except where our red lines are and how much we should expect from EA/Tiburon. I have come to the conclusion I shouldn't expect much, and hoped that at a minimum RBP would be in this year. It looks like it is, plus some other stuff. If it works reasonably well (heh) I'll buy it. I don't anticipate pre ordering, unless there's a good deal.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
Let me know when they fix the OLine play when it comes to pass blocking and the running game. In every iteration of Madden the Oline play has flat out sucked. The oline doesn't double team block correctly, not drive blocking, no setting the edge, and no seek and destroy blocking on lineman pulls on runs to the outside.
1.) Double team blocking- One man engages and the other stands there chopping his feet waiting on the engaged lineman to release so he can "suck" him into an animation.
2) Drive Blocking- on plays like the iso and hb blast the offensive line doesn't try to drive forward and put that Dtackle on his heels. They just block like normal. They should look more like the spartans from 300 driving forward with them shields trying to put the dline on its butt. The dline should be trying to get low and go forward but that is another discussion.
3) setting the edge- if the play is off tackle , lets say to the right, the rt should be trying to turn his man to the left and the fb should come and hit the lb on that side and turn him to the right so that the hole on the edge opens up. Not on madden, the rt tackle just reacts to the DE coming at him. Off tackle is not a reactionary play. it is a drive forward and make the defense react to the offense type of play. Also the ability to of the RT, in my play example, to turn that DE to the left should not only be based on rating but also by the DE's assigned path to the qb. if he is crashed inside, then the RT chance of turning him left should go up since he is already heading that way. It should be more difficult if the DE is crashed outside since he is heading into the play's design. This doesn't happen at all in any madden that i have seen. When the off tackle is most successful it is because the OLine holds their man long enough for the play to work not because the "visual" technique is correct.
4)Seek and Destroy. Seen any real football madden devs? when the guard pulls, it is a seek and destroy mission to the outside on plays like the counter. On madden if you run the counter and go into replay, I guarantee that you will see the guard pull, head to the edge and slow up and wait to block someone on the back side instead of getting out to block someone ahead and clean their clock. The best example of this other than giants or gb packers footage (the two teams i think run the best counters ive seen) is from the movie Rudy. When they are on the practice field and Rudy tells the big guard to block him hard instead of treating him with kid gloves. The next play, he shows you how it should be done. when he pulls, he comes and clean Rudy's clock and burries him in the dirt. He comes all the way out around the edge past where the tackle would be to put Rudy on his @55. That is how it should be done in Madden....seek and destroy! Here is an example of what im talking about. Look at the 1:28 mark for the pulling guard. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyauOc9_7_I Also at 1:42, 2:05,2:31, and 2:51. That is rucking fidiculous!
When they fix this....let me know.Last edited by Dr_Doom_98; 04-26-2012, 02:02 PM.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
Awesome post man. To piggyback off of this, what good is the new Nickel Wide 9 alignment going to do if the Defensive Ends aren't using their speed to fire off the ball and burst upfield AROUND the Offensive Linemen? If the DE's simply look to engage the OL and hand fight at the line of scrimmage, then that alignment is basically worthless. Not to mention that stopping the run with the Wide 9 alignment is already somewhat difficult, but if the LB's and Safeties in Madden 13 aren't programmed to fill their gaps correctly, then you're screwed even more in the run game if someone decides to run the ball out of a passing formation.Last edited by Illustrator76; 04-26-2012, 03:42 PM.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
Hey Big,Well for what it's worth, one of the NCAA 13 CD attendees or a Game Changer said they are expecting the movement to be toned down to NCAA 11 levels, which I think may be on par to M10's.
Question asked by Bryan and answered by ShaunMason EA Game Changer
So did they just kind of tighten up the player movement so its not so herky jerky? Or how would you best describe the change?
The ability to change direction was tuned, so you can't turn really, really hard like you used to. I'm hoping they tune it more based on velocity, because I felt like I was sticking to the lineman trying to get around them at times
Question asked by Gotmadskillzson ans answered by David EA Game Changer
8. Did they improve or tune locomotion at all this year ? Last year players turned on a dime, changed directions on a dime with no slow down what so ever.
Yeah I think so, like Shaun said the Runningbacks have been tuned so you cannot just swerve at full speed all over the field. And like with DB's they cannot just flawlessly cut with a WR on a dime with a route they do not know what's coming. And with the new and improved receiver animations you just see alot more fluent and realistic body and post catch movements with the ball.
I would point out though do not expect some major overhaul with the locomotion of players in the game.
I don't expect an overhaul of course but hopefully it will remove the need for banning the left stick to insure realistic movement when in the open field.
Sorry, but all that is is developer speak for "No, we didn't fix it.".
Been here before. I don't have the energy to put up with the frustration this game can cause. It ends up not being fun past the 3rd week of owning it. I enjoyed my league from Madden 12 immensely. We had a pretty good group of guys and XFN made it really cool. However, after 4 seasons, it wore me, and the majority of the other guys in the league, down to the point where they didn't want the game anymore. Having to institute rules just so you can have some semblance of realistic football is a nuisance and a HUGE pain for commissioners. It does not work well, and eventually, people stop following them because they know if they zig zag, they can get a few cheap scores. I watched the entire web cast, which was an hour+. They seem like nice guys, but you can completely see the difference between these guys, the work they've done and what real top notch people would be showing. I felt bad for them watching it, because I honestly did not see much difference at all between 13 and 12. I'm sure they did a lot of work, and the code underneath is much better, but as the consumer, I'm shielding myself from that and I still see a lot of the same crap. I still saw warping of DBs, the line interaction was still atrocious, etc.etc. Not to mention, we know the challenge system is still going to be garbage, penalties are missing and the ones in the game don't work. Running animations are completely broken. Pass blocking is terrible. So do we REALLY have a new madden? This feels more like a 60.00 patch to me. I'm sorry, but it is what it is. Madden is not a good representation of NFL football. It's a great game for young kids who want to play with their NFL heroes. We've been through all of this before so it's no longer something people should be angry about. I remember posting about a month ago and I said that Madden 13 would be a better game than 12. It would have the same incremental improvements that don't wow you and most likely throw off the balance of the game opening a whole new window of exploits, tactics and issues.
Don't get me wrong, the improvements are great, but they are really highlighting them like they are revolutionary elements. This is supposed to be a football simulation. Those elements are just basics of football. Why do you have to point them out as the main selling points of the game? Backbreaker had the reverse problem, but the right idea for a foundation. They touted player movement and interaction without the "football" part. Madden doesn't really have either at this point. It's 2012 and the only NFL game doesn't include all of the real rules, a working challenge system, proper player movement, proper line interaction, or even proper ball physics. I've given up on Madden. After getting 11 and 12 after a near 10 year layoff, it's not something I can justify dropping 60 bucks on. Kudos to the team for making the changes they did and I'm happy for guys who will really be able to enjoy this game as their football hobby.Comment
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Re: Madden 13 Gameplay Impressions
Taz;
I understand your frustrations and it's a frustration that has been built up over several years.
As far as what they are advertising, it might be not new to football, but it might be new to Madden. If they were advertising gimmicks, this place would have been exploding. So, they are darned if they do and darned if they don't sometimes.
I knew before these playbooks were announced that this years Madden wouldn't be able to please everyone. Yes, I blame the one year sports cycle, but not much we can do about that. If Madden would have announced a new all around physics system plus good foot planting with great animations, there would still be a faction of people who would have complained that they didn't fix pass trajectories and super LB and CB's.
If all this stuff they have advertised, works, (big if) then 13 is just not a incremental advancement of 12, at least not in my eyes, especially, with franchise, audio and game play 2 still unannounced.
I don't think anyone is being Debbie Downer if they are still experiencing the same issues over and over during the last several years. EA needs to know that.
I will say, though, that, again, if everything, works as advertised, there might be some good football games coming from EA from this point forward.
We'll see, though. I was burned by NCAA last year and I wasn't happy with that and the franchise bugs in Madden didn't make me a happy customer, either.
Hopefully, one day, we will all be happy with a football game that EA produces.Comment
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